<p>Mom2–I still think that the fact that a fault can be found on every campus, doesn’t mean it’s the same on every campus. Drinking cultures differ. Bottom line. Academic cultures differ. ETc. To say “it’s everywhere” does not account for very palpable differences.</p>
<p>A long time ago, there were two boys who went to U of Chicago with me. One transferred to Yale to pursue drama. Never heard about him again. The other graduated from Univ. of CHicago. He has won at least one Tony. He wasn’t an acor but a dramatist and maybe a director, too. </p>
<p>My son left a small LAC when they medically withdrew him and left him hanging. Their treatment did not help his condition at all. He transferred to George Mason University and he is doing very well and looking forward to grad school</p>
<p>Re: the so-called “Southern racist attitude”… I don’t think anyone wants to touch a topic like this with a ten-foot pole on a forum, and I’d hate to see it derail this fun thread. But if I recall correctly, there are several already-existing CC threads from a while back that do touch on the issue. There was one started by a poster from the NE about southern colleges in general, and another I remember had to do with Washington & Lee specifically.</p>
<p>Around here, I’ve heard rumors of quite a number of kids leaving Syracuse claiming it was too much of a party school.</p>
<p>I suppose one could blanket the comment with polarizing regional cultural differences to be more PC about what is, an opinion. And if opinion is based on experience, it doesn’t make if fact, but it doesn’t make it “wrong” per say.</p>
<p>My comment about me not hearing of anyone who didn’t like Penn State was meant to encourage anyone who had another experience to share. Obviously, I didn’t think that every student loves it there (or anywhere for that matter).</p>
<p>Re: Penn State. My niece is a senior. She loves Penn State but is COMPLETELY ready to graduate and leave. She is really tired of the drunk partying that goes on all over campus 3 or 4 nights a week. She has had to work really hard as an engineering major, and does drink and party, too. She has just sort of outgrown the whole campus scene, I guess. She is a loyal Penn State fan and is proud of the school.</p>
<p>That is called the normal progression which leads to a happier and less regrets filled life. Partying is for young people just like short skirts and tight jeans. Drinking in college will probably lead to less drinking later–been there done that. It was fun and now I’m rady to move to the next level. If you are not ready to move on after 4-5 years that’s a problem.</p>
<p>I’ll chime in on Penn State. The freshman retention rate is about 92%. That’s very good for such a big school. I graduated from a big state school and the retention rate was in the low 80s. </p>
<p>So, I think the school does a pretty good job of building community and pride…and most students are able to make the school feel smaller after a few months. The party scene is big but we know some non-partying types who are happy. And I meet a LOT of alums in my work and the vast majority LOVE their school (which is completely foreign to me as I don’t have any allegiance at all to my old school). It’s interesting…I know some people think it’s cult-like. Anyway, I DO have one friend who didn’t have a good experience…she didn’t make it in the sorority scene. She doesn’t even follow the football team…horrors!</p>
<p>A freshman retention rate at Penn State of 93% is quite high considering we are talking about 40,000 students.</p>
<p>errr, quest… that’s why it’s called a rate (percentage). Clearly the actual number is significantly higher than those that leave Swarthmore or Franklin and Marshall or other small colleges in Pennsylvania.</p>
<p>That’s what I meant to express…guess I didn’t say it clearly - 7% leaving represents a big number in a school of 40,000.</p>
<p>Not really. I think the only places you find a significantly higher retention rate are private universities that (a) are much more selective in the first instance, so that their students are much less likely to have academic problems, and (b) have the resources to award significant financial aid, whether merit or need-based, to middle-class students, so that their students are much less likely to have financial problems. Even places like Harvard and Yale lose some percentage of their students to general malaise, poor fit, broken hearts, substance abuse, medical issues, financial issues, or the opportunity to earn millions without further schooling. Losing 7% at a public university with a much broader range of student abilities and social circumstances is hardly a red flag.</p>
<p>They aren’t losing 7% of the entire school. It’s 7% of the freshman class of 7000 or so.</p>
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<p>I agree with the idea behind the first part of this: what’s relevant is the rate, not the absolute number who leave. But the fact is Penn State’s freshman retention rate stands up pretty well against a lot of LACs in Pennsylvania:</p>
<p>Swarthmore 96.5%
Haverford 96.2%
Bucknell 95.0%
Lafayette 93.8%
Bryn Mawr 93.5%
PENN STATE 93.2%
Muhlenburg 92.8%
Franklin & Marshall 92.0%
Gettysburg 91.2%
Dickinson 90.8%
Ursinus 90.0%
Allegheny 88.2%
Juniata 84.2%</p>
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<p>Actually, some publics do pretty well, too.</p>
<p>UVA 97.0%
UCLA 97.0%
UNC Chapel Hill 97.0%
UC Berkeley 96.5%
Michigan 96.0%
William & Mary 95.2%</p>
<p>Yale’s 98.8% is stellar, but even Harvard has a freshman retention rate of 97.2%, almost identical to that at UVA, UNC Chapel Hill, and UCLA and only slightly ahead of UC Berkeley and Michigan. So it’s not just privates. And while I think Penn State’s retention rate is pretty good, it still means they’re losing people at more than twice the rate of UVA, UCLA and UNC Chapel Hill.</p>
<p>Yeah, I just looked up the same stuff. Penn State is more or less in line with the next set of public universities – Ohio State, Wisconsin, UConn. Pitt – which many people here prefer to Penn State – is at 91%. For perspective, if you look at Towson State, in Maryland, it’s 83%.</p>
<p>The publics you listed all still fit JHS’s criteria: more selective in the first place with great financial aid (as with UVa and Chapel Hill) or low cost in the first place (the UCs, Michigan).</p>
<p>I have heard that freshmen leave UMiami b/c the party scene off campus (in south beach) is VERY expensive - particularly for boys!</p>
<p>Of my daughter’s classmates, one left BC to come home to Santa Clara to be closer to her boyfriend, and because she felt BC wasn’t what she was looking for in a school. One went from Santa Clara to UCLA because he wanted to be closer to his girlfriend, and he felt Santa Clara was too small. One left one of the seven sisters (sorry, I can’t remember which one) because it was too stridently feminist for her. She was so uncomfortable she came home to go to a CC for two years, is now at UCLA. At least one came home from school because of illness, and enrolled in a school closer to home. So just as kids pick schools for various reasons, they transfer for various reasons.</p>
<p>well, let’s keep in mind that students leave AFTER freshman year too so it’s helpful to look at graduation rates. Most schools publish the 6 year grad rate. PSU’s is 85% (compare that to UVA- 93%, Pitt 76% and Towson 66%). Anyway, I used to think that kids who didn’t graduate in 4 years were lazy but my s has a few engineering friends who really needed an extra semester or two. I imagine privates have good rates…
It would also be helpful to see if the college does student satisfaction surveys. Some do, some don’t, but as a parent looking into schools, I found them interesting.</p>
<p>Interesting to look at graduation rates.</p>