Wake Forest isn’t an option for D21, but the virtual tour and online information session were very well done and as realistic to an actual on campus tour as possible. I really wish more schools would put together a presentation similar to this.
Could you give a little detail regarding the “specific type of student” it seemed Occidental would best fit based on the info session you saw? Thanks!
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Going up: University of Puget Sound
Going down: Reed College
D21 and I were bored yesterday so we hopped in the car drove two hours north and did our own self-guided walking tour of the University of Puget Sound (UPS).
We were actually quite impressed. It is an impressively beautiful campus this time of year. Everything was closed but there were skateboarders out on the sidewalks and families out out for a stroll, using the campus as a park. So we just socially-distanced and explored the place.
UPS is one of 3 similar LACs in the Pacific Northwest. Lewis & Clark and Willamette are the other two. Having lived in both Portland and Seattle I have driven by Tacoma hundreds of times but this was the first time I actually visited the campus. It is traditional quad style campus with old English style architecture in a nice residential part of North Tacoma. Very much in the style of a traditional New England LAC. By comparison, Lewis & Clark is more woodsy with more modern architecture spread around a wooded hillside in Portland. And Willamette abuts the state capital grounds in Salem.
Based on on first impressions without students my daughter really liked the place. she also likes that it next to Puget Sound so marine biology and scuba diving options are available. Of these 3 LACs, I think UPS is her tentative first choice, but we really need to see it with students.
Reed College is going down on her list. The Pacific Northwest has two more highly selective LACs, Reed and Whitman. We have visited Reed various times since it is right next door (and I’m an alum). But I think for my daughter, Reed is going down on her list. She is interested in doing extensive overseas study abroad, perhaps even some DIY studies in Chile as my wife is Chilean and our kids are all dual citizens. Reed’s curriculum is so highly structured and their 8-semester course of study with junior qualifying exams and required senior thesis seems to make study abroad and other more creative approaches more difficult than might be the case elsewhere. It is also an academic pressure cooker and I’m not sure my daughter really wants to just study at the expense of all else in college. We have yet to visit Whitman and intend to this summer. On paper it seems more like UPS in style and student life, but with academics and selectivity more comparable to Reed. Reed also offers no merit aid so it would be considerably more expensive than the others.
We are mostly limiting our search to the Pacific Northwest and have explored nearly all of the viable options so if anyone wants advice on Northwest college options I would be happy to provide my opinions and analysis.
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Occidental felt more hippy vibe and really relaxed. My son is more intense and it didn’t feel like the right fit.
Interesting. Occidental has been on our list and we were planning to visit during spring break until we got quarantined.
I have to wonder how true to reality many of these virtual visits really are. And how they might be distorted by the particular few students and staff who are organizing and running them. I expect there are going to be a lot of students arriving on campus next fall to discover that the school the picked in real life is nothing like it looked and felt like in the virtual visit they made.
Oxy is into diversity & social justice. Really interesting school.
We were going to visit Occidental as well. I’m glad we were able to watch the session. It’s not the same as visiting in person but it gives you a good idea of a typical student. It’s just not the right place for my son. It does not mean that it is a bad place. If you are looking for a very liberal leaning liberal arts college, it has some amazing programs.
I’ve mentioned it before, but in a time of virtual visits, it’s worth mentioning: Of the colleges my D19 was choosing between in the end, she opted to go to the only one of them that she hadn’t visited in person (Mississippi State). She was a little nervous about that, sure, but it turned out to be a delightful place for her.
After all, back in the day, college visits were much less frequent (and virtual tours weren’t an option), and students still managed to enjoy their collegiate experience.
(Well, or they didn’t. But that’s no different from nowadays, really.)
We are going to give it a look. It is one of the few CA schools that is probably right in her wheelhouse. She is a lefty type kid and would be comfortable in that environment. But she also wants rigorous academics and doesn’t want to see academics sacrificed for political correctness or whatever, as seems to have been the case at a place like Evergreen State College in WA. She’s likely headed into the life sciences so that will also be a deciding factor.
Occidental is probably right in her wheelhouse. Seems similar to the other liberal arts schools on the west coast. Perhaps a degree less intense and selective as Pomona and Reed, but still excellent. The question is whether it is worth going so far away from home is something comparable is available up here.
We were planning to visit Occidental, the Claremonts, Santa Clara, LMU, and maybe San Diego over spring break. And maybe Stanford and USC but more as tourists. Maybe we will a chance to do it instead during late summer.
I posted this on another thread asking for input on Oberlin and Wesleyan around their creative programs and realized that it fit here too.
My daughter (one of 3 kids - two in Class of 2021 and one class of 2022 - so I will be her often for the next year+!) visited Oberlin and wasn’t introduced or interviewed by anyone with a connection to theater. (her interest too). She attended a class, ate lunch with a student and interviewed. The town had several former retail buildings boarded up and seemed “sad” along with some campus building also in need of TLC. My husband walked away from this tour thinking that if she remained interested in this school (it is off her list), he would dig deeper into their financial picture. (all pre-covid too). Her tour was very geared toward a lot of political correct behaviors on campus and “how it will be hard when we leave here”. One of her good friends toured a week later and the school remains on her list - so always good to visit! It is just not a right fit for my daughter and the purpose of this trip was for her to start to shorten her list.
She also visited Kenyon and had the opposite experience. At lunch with 8 theater kids, tour guide introduced her to other students and the professor from the class had her actively participate. Tiny town with nice coffee shop and a few other options plus more foot traffic. Well maintained campus and very friendly students.
For Wesleyan the town is walkable with a distinct downtown. Students and local families are out and about and even though access to NYC takes a bit of coordination - the option exists. The tour was full, so not a lot of individual attention at any of the New England schools she visited - but the guide was engaged. A current Wes sophomore that attended my daughter’s current school HS met her for lunch and took her around a bit more after the standard tour. The tour guide mentioned they always have one “big protest” a year and students are very politically aware. She left Wes feeling like she would be surrounded by creative students and have lots of options for involvement in the arts. The students did feel a bit more “edgy” (her word) vs more “laid back” at Oberlin. The current Wes student from her HS did say it can be hard to get classes fresh/soph year and if you are not proactive - you will have to take several classes that you are not interested in to meet your credits.
Here is a bit about Carleton and Macalester for one of my D21’s - other D21 is working very independently to be a recruited D1 athlete and D22 is all about STEM and big schools - so I feel like a walking Fiske Guide right now. Fortunate to have both D21’s done with ACT and started visits early, due to having 3 kids and ZERO overlap.
D21 looked at Wellesley for creative writing and theater and it remains on her list.
I don’t have a lot of input, as my husband took her and he doesn’t force the note taking like me! She did say she didn’t care it was close to Boston and couldn’t see herself taking advantage of the other schools for classes (ie MIT) and liked how loyal the students felt to the school, positive energy and the campus was beautiful.
She removed Wesleyan for a myraid of reasons - some valid, some not. (see previous post)
She did tour Carleton and Macalester in the Fall and had met the reps previously at her high school, knows a few people at both from our area and Carleton is still at the top of her list. She loves the little town of Northfield and even though the area around Mac is wonderful, she didn’t seem to care about having access to shops and more restaurants. For me, I thought it would be a great place to visit for parent’s weekend - but my opinion is not highly sought out 
I think the shiny arts building at Carleton made a big impression and Mac just seemed too small - I don’t think student count wise, but the footprint of the school. Carleton felt more like a “typical” east coast LAC, tree lined paths, building design and the trimester calendar appealed to my daughter too.
We also had a low energy tour guide at Mac and a very high energy guide at Carleton - we know that is not the best way to judge - but for a 17 year old it can’t be helped. Tour guides make a huge difference. Also, we had a very domineering parent on our Mac tour (it was only 3 families). Our area rep from Mac is wonderful and he reached out for feedback after our tour. My daughter did sit into a theater class and loved it - but she is that kind of kid. She removed Mac, as she likes a couple other options that fall within that category better - trying to keep her final list to 8 schools.
She did not get as much personal insight into the creative arts at either school compared to Kenyon and Oberlin. The Carleton tour was big and if it remains on her list, she will need to dig deeper into the creative side. Carleton assigned the mandatory freshman seminar class to attend vs letting you pick.
She attended a recent online session for Carleton and continues to put it as a top choice - still missing a few New England schools and hoping for long Fall visit weekend in order to try ED.
@Camasite we visited Occidental with our S19. It was actually the first college we visited on a cross-country college tour. We also visited Pitzer and Pomona the following day. My son really loved the Occidental campus, which is compact and beautiful. He is an athlete and liked the fact the sports facilities are right in the middle of campus rather than a long walk away. The information session, held outside under a canopy, was one of the best we heard anywhere - lots of good tips about writing essays, which makes sense as Oxy has a bunch of its own quirky essay questions. We also liked the location, which is semi-urban with some interesting restaurants and has reasonable public transportation into LA proper. We did not pick up a particularly liberal vibe, the students seemed relatively mainstream. Overall, he liked Oxy much better than either Pitzer or Pomona. Pitzer does have a very pronounced liberal/activist slant, and he wanted to avoid being in a very politicized environment. We the parents also were not taken with Pitzer’s campus, which reminded me of a motel. I’m not sure why he disliked Pomona, although it was probably part of a general negative reaction to the consortium idea. The more the tour guide talked about eating in different dining halls every meal depending on the menu, the more he recoiled. I feel sorry for the kids who aren’t able to do campus visits this year, as that’s the kind of thing it might be hard to pick up from a virtual visit.
@tkoparent - One of my kids had the exact same reaction to Pomona/consortium and I was going through the tour thinking this was the perfect fit school for her - again, appears I know nothing 
She also said all the buildings were boring looking and too “neutral” - whatever that means. She hated that the schools all shared and wants her “own” school.
At the end of the day, I am glad that is off the list as the acceptance rate is tough and when the admissions rep broke it down is became very clear. I don’t have my notes anymore from that school to get it right - but I remember they said that 50% of accepted students are either athletes, first generation and unrepresented students which leaves 50% divided by 2 for male and female students - so down to a tiny chance of acceptance.
The whole consortium idea is appealing to so many kids - but found out not mine!
PS: My nephew loved Occidental (ended up elsewhere due to merit money) and he is not a LA kid at all. Thought the presentations, professors and facilities were all great and it remained a top choice and ended up down to $.
coffeeat3 – We loved our visit to the 5cs in many ways – the town was cute and the weather amazing. My D ended up applying only to Scripps b/c she was chasing merit and knew that was her best shot. In the end, however, she felt like while the idea of the consortium was cool it just raised too many questions. Given her particular STEM major she was worried about getting locked out of some classes b/c students in the ‘home’ institution had priority. While students we talked to said it worked out, she wanted more of a ‘one college’ experience.
I found walking around the campuses that the transition from one college to another with the different architecture styles a little jarring. Sort of like the sum of the whole was not as good as the parts.
Nonetheless, so glad we visited. That long weekend with my D (including a couple days in the LA) was prolly the best mother/daughter trip we’ve ever taken! We escaped the East Coast in February. They upgraded our car to a convertible and when we pulled out of LAX and turned the radio on, the song California Dreamin’ (on such a winter’s day…) started playing – no lie! We sang at the top of our lungs!
@AlmostThere2018 I agree with the Claremont visit. My son visited CMC and it was an amazing time. One of our best visits. That place is so impressive and I think it’s best if possible to see it in person since it is very specific.
Sounds like you had an amazing time!
I am commenting as a parent of a daughter who graduated from high school in 2019. I have posted on this thread before. Lesson learned: the one-time college informational session and tour can be very deceiving.
For instance, our daughter was enamored with Columbia University after her tour, so it skyrocketed to the top of her list. The informational session spoke to her academic interests (a near-perfect match), and the tour guide was a lovely young man. He answered her questions with grace and humility. During the tour, I reflected on how tiny the main campus is, the urban-ness, and how noisy the city surrounding the campus can be. Our daughter saw none of these things.
When we visited University of Washington 3 weeks later, the campus was filled with smoke due to regional wildfires, so we were all having a hard time breathing, and we could not view the surrounding mountains which are usually visible on a bright summer’s day. Nonetheless, I found the campus stunning, while our daughter felt it was too big and did not recognize the beauty. Our tour guide was pleasant but seemed to be making a lot of excuses for UW. It was kind of odd. My daughter and I left the area feeling unwell probably due to the smoke.
University of Washington became a big “meh” for her. She really wanted to leave the state, and she wanted to attend the most challenging college to which she was accepted, one that reflected her love of and respect for humanities.
Unfortunately, my daughter had to miss Columbia’s Days on Campus because of a critical prior commitment to one of her high school teams.
When my daughter started at Columbia, she witnessed the vast resources available to her. Her professors, TAs, and classes were amazing. She made a cluster of like-minded friends rather quickly. However, the lack of private space on campus, the surrounding noise from the city, the relative lack of safe green spaces, the sterility of her shared dorm room etc., overwhelmed her, especially while dealing with a health issue.
My daughter revisited University of Washington because several friends attend. She absolutely fell in love with the campus! It’s treed and green! There is so much space! The dorms are new! It’s close to home and the Pacific Northwest! The students are so nice! (Of course, she was visiting a bunch of friends.)
To make this long story short, my daughter just accepted admission to the University of Washington and is leaving Columbia. I am sad about the academic and cultural opportunities she’ll miss. I am way more impressed with Columbia than I was nearly two years ago. Columbia appears to be my daughter’s perfect academic match. However, the UW is no academic slouch, and it’s the environment she needs right now.
My advice for students and families is that one tour cannot tell the full story. If it is at all possible, visit colleges at least twice. If at all possible, attend the accepted student days. Do not rule a college out based on the one tour if it seems to offer amenities your child wants or needs.
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UC San Diego, UC Irvine, UCRiverside out
USC first on list
UCLA second on list
Whidbeyite2002 said, “My advice for students and families is that one tour cannot tell the full story. If it is at all possible, visit colleges at least twice. If at all possible, attend the accepted student days. Do not rule a college out based on the one tour if it seems to offer amenities your child wants or needs.
I agree that campus visits don’t always reflect reality. My S12 visited his college for a tour late junior year, and he fell in love with it. He accepted his admission a year later, and that summer he returned for an orientation program. He was not impressed. He didn’t connect with anybody and just had a very meh experience. He spent the next few months miserably dreading that he might have made the wrong choice. We dropped him off in the fall, and thankfully, he loved it from that day and all the way to graduation and beyond.
I worked with high schoolers and saw everything. I saw dream schools that truly were, and dream schools that became nightmares. I saw hundreds of kids who were dreading their in-state safety, and ended up loving their experience. I saw kids who everyone thought would thrive anywhere they were planted come home after the first semester. I also saw the opposite - kids we thought would never survive the cutthroat environment of the school they chose, but they thrived. Most kids pick well for themselves.
FWIW, my advice to parents is to not insert yourself into the decision process to the point it’s your fault if they hate where they end up (unless the decision is a financial one). Also, take heart that most kids are resilient and confident enough to make a move if things don’t work out, and they’ll find happiness and success at another college.
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Great post! When doing tours with my kids I tried to take a really analytical perspective pointing out good/bad pros and cons. The problem is, once they ‘fall in love’ with the idea of the school, they are blinded to the criticism. Its very difficult to make them be open minded. I tried to really really discourage the idea of ‘dream schools’ and told lots of stories of dream schools turned nightmares.
We did seven tours of Pacific Northwest schools with D21 before the Covid shut that down. Although she is a smart kid, she is also 17 and was 16 for last summers tours. I am hyper-analytical. But I was kind of surprised at how much the personality of the tour guide and their focus absolutely influenced her perceptions.
For example, she fell in love with Lewis & Clark where we had an edgy, quirky LGBT-ish female tour guide (much like my daughter) who took her and a couple of other students to lunch sans-parents afterwards. She was unimpressed with the tour we took of WSU with a clean-cut athletic frat boy type tour guide who gushed about the sports center and athletic facilities.