<p>AFTER preschool....where I live....there is only one game in town, public school. I never thought about any of their schooling in terms of which would get the kids into the right college. They still got into the right colleges (for them anyway).</p>
<p>Another L.A. tale: finding a developmentally appropriate pre-school or daycare was prep for college search. I found places where I wouldn't leave a child for five minutes while I made a phone call. And that's not counting the "daycare" that consisted of plunking half a dozen kids next to the TV with a stack of video tapes.</p>
<p>We eventually found one through a tip from a co-worker. She was signed up to start at age 2 and then got the jump three months early when the family that gave "in home" day care came down with a case of some milk-born disease when they were traveling...mind's blanking, begins with an "L"?...and had to shut down. D was one of only three children in that situation and one of them was her the mother's own.</p>
<p>But even then, the daycare was competitive...the director must have liked some of our atypical answers because we got in without too much fuss. By the time D left three years later, there was a scramble for spots.</p>
<p>The socialization at preschool was amazing. D went from one or two word sentences to "I'd like more milk please" in the space of a week.
Which reminds me of a joke....</p>
<p>We went through the competitive private school circuit in NYC (not preschool, though, thank God). At one upper crust school my son was interviewed by a blue blood who could see at a glance that we weren't the right sort. When asked his name my son who was going through an intensive Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles phase replied "Shredder." The interviewer didn't blink and called him Master Shredder for the rest of their encounter. Anyone familiar with TMNT will know that Shredder was a revered ninja master so that made perfect sense to my son. Talk about when worlds collide!</p>
<p>Luckily and fatefully, his score on the IQ test required by these toney privates qualified him for a public school with a gifted program, free and egalitarian.</p>
<p>I don't understand any of this. I never went to pre-school, went only to public schools through high school, was the product of a single mother home, and enjoyed and did very well in my foray in both undergrad and grad with two so-called top 10 CC schools. Private school would have likely succeeded in only making me elitist and wimpy - neither of which I would be comfortable with today. Why in earth would someone think a competitive pre-school could make a hill of beans of difference? Teach your kids values and hard work - something an effete pre-school won't accomplish. This is just laughable.</p>
<p>You misunderstand: the fact that pre-school was competive was an undesirable artifact, not a feature: the goal was to find a nurturing environment with positive socialization...some sort of out-of-home situation is necessary for those of us who have two working parents in the household. </p>
<p>And either you don't know what "effete" means or you have little understanding of what a pre-school is.</p>
<p>
[quote]
When asked his name my son who was going through an intensive Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles phase replied "Shredder."
[/quote]
When my son was around age 3 or so, he went through a phase where he insisted on being called "Superstar". I don't remember whether his preschool teachers went along with it. </p>
<p>We moved to a new area when my d. was born, and a neighbor helpfully put her name on the waitlist for the local co-op preschool when she was 4 months old. I think some kids were put on the waitlist prenatally. This resulted on the coveted invitation to attend the pre-pre-school summer program when she was 3.... but we declined, as I was happy with her in-home daycare setting. Like TheDad my main priority in those days was to find the safest & most reliable setting where my kids could be left from 8 am to 6 pm - "co-op" nursery school didn't exactly fit.</p>
<p>Seeing the "6pm" reminds me of the flurry of phone calls...this was pre-cellphone, though I think I had a pager then...that resulted in me and TheMom exchanging "I thought <em>you</em> were going to pick her up!" as I dashed to pick D up 20+ minutes late. Staff was understanding but not amused.</p>
<p>Hey TheDad... remember daycare late pickup fees?</p>
<p>I know all of this stuff looks crazy to you folks in most of the country, but in NYC and Boston, it's the way it is. I remember taking DS for interviews for preschool, then on to elementary school interviews. His school ended at 6th so we were on to a new round of applications - fortunately the school he attends has middle and upper, so that was the last time we did apps until college apps. Tests were taken, recommendations were written, interviews were held - and yeah, sometimes you feel like it's all insane when you're taking a 5 year old for interviews for elementary school. But reality here is that the public schools in the city are terrible (no flames here - I was a single parent a nd navigating what paltry offerings the public schools had was not on my dance card).
My son is neither elitist nor wimpy (in fact, I specifically recall a letter from the headmaster of the elementary school noting that "wimpitude is discouraged". :-) gotta love it - DS is smart, sophisticated, tolerant, wise in the ways of the city. I loved all of his schools. He's gotten into some great colleges, severql of which cost less than his current tuition.
From those of you who have not walked in these shoes raising a kid in Boston or NYC, you just can't understand it.</p>
<p>For the vast majority of parents, the choice of private preschool, elementary and secondary high schools has nothing to do with getting into college. It is about finding the right nurturing environment as mentioned by TheDad. </p>
<p>One of the sayings at our sons's private school was "the joy is in the journey", another was "sticks and stones may break your bones but words can really hurt you." When I asked one day how other kids had done on a test, I was told, "Mom, we do NOT compare ourselves to others." The kids received virtual tutoring in all core subjects (1 to 5 ratio) with the same teacher for K-3, balanced by tons of art, music and theater at a 1-30 ratio. The message at the kindergarten graduation was so inspirational, we still use the advice. </p>
<p>The biggest adjustment to public school for them was the rudeness of the kids. They finally got used to kids sleeping in class, kids being nasty to other kids, etc. For us, it was the lack of arts programs, the politics of the sports programs, and the lack of flexibility of the system to respond to special needs. For those of you who were lucky enough to have a nurturing, flexible, safe public school, congratulations. Not everybody gets that.</p>
<p>If I ever become one of these parents, please take custody of my kids and send me on a hunting trip with Darth Cheney.</p>
<p>I'm NEVER moving to a neighborhood full of these fundamentalist kooks. They're just a higher-class version of the Kansas people who took evolution out of their schools.</p>
<p>This preschool syndrome is found in any major city.....not just Boston or NYC......happens in Chicago and Atlanta as well. I actually wish that they did more eligibility testing at my kids' private school. They take legacies in pre-K and then realise that by 5th grade the kids are unable to do the work. There are 70 kids waiting for 2 pre-K spots now, and we live in Florida!</p>
<p>We have competition for pre-school in Dallas. BUT-it IS about finding the right nurturing environment (with an added plus if the school goes through higher grades so you don't have to go through the awful admissions process again). My favorite sayings from D's preschool were "Walk your feet" and "Use your words".
Of course, Wild Child was kicked out of preschool on his 5th birthday and I thought his life was ruined! Long story, but we got over it. I remember I had an important business meeting that day and one of the lawyers with whom I was meeting said, "Kicked out of preschool? AWESOME! That kid is GOING PLACES!" How true- hasn't been an easy journey, though.</p>
<p>dke
I left Boston when pre-school was major topic, and a friend donated a building (at least a part) to get the oldest in to "the" elem school. I never understood why, when we lived in area with terrific public schools.
Same thing in FL--pressure, tears, donations. Neighbors would stop talking if 1 got in and the other didn't.
The religious schools didn't have any of the selection stuff</p>
<p>It is so funny, sad and ridiculous. I understand that from a "prestige" POV, there is nothing about common sense or rationality that alters the perception that this is somehow "necessary." But, being married to Ph.D. and Prof. of Education, whose focus is early childhood education and toddler and infant development, "fighting" to get into the "right" pre-school is just devoid of educational value.</p>
<p>When we looked for pre-schools for our kids, the #1 question was: will they be safe?; the #2 question was: will they have fun? The only pre-schools we rejected out of hand were the ones that could not affirmatively answer questions # 1 and 2, or the ones that promised our kids would learn to read or write. </p>
<p>I think my kids turned out pretty darn good, despite not learning to read and write by the time they turned 4.</p>
<p>In our small, overeducated city, there is a lot of concern about preschools and "finding the right one" (judging by the chatter on my parenting list there) but it's all about fit, not competition. </p>
<p>Co-ops are very popular among those parents who have the volunteering time. I see a lot of parents worry about the environment (is Montessori better, or an art-based one, or the one on the farm, etc), less about the academics. The only ones with a waitlist are the ones at the University, which is partly because they are seen as high quality and well-staffed, and partly because they are so close to "work" if you're on campus.</p>
<p>My NYC friends sure have some good (scary) stories, though. Sounds like it was hard to avoid buying into the hype.</p>
<p>My kids went to an ITA (initial teaching alphabet) school as 3 and 4 year olds...they "carpooled" a few towns away....reason: my mother was one of the instructors so we didn't have much choice I guess. I never liked the idea.</p>
<p>I asked S in hs what he thought of the school he went to for 2 years...he had virtually no recollection of anything other than walking down stairs and singing in Halloween and Christmas shows.</p>
<p>One "highlight" for me...I remember D's teacher being concerned enough to pull me aside to tell me D wasn't printing her name as well as some of the other 3 year olds.....gee thanks for telling me that! (and making me worry needlessly as most young parents would).</p>
<p>CD, we went a little beyond "safe" and "fun." "Disorganized" did not rate well. Maybe "staff levels" are a subcomponent of "safe," but staffing at the maximal state-allowed levels was worse, imho, in a small place than in a larger one...less of an impact if one particular teacher was tied up, anything from simply being in the bathroom to having to deal with a crisis...the other teachers provided overlapping "back-up." </p>
<p>One of those questions that would not have occurred to us before we started visiting--cf., visiting college campuses--was how did various places handle conflict resolution between kids? The pre-school we ultimately sent D to was very big on "use your words" and "give me your eyes" (i.e., look at me when I'm talking to you so that I know you're hearing me)...I about fell over laughing the first time I saw one toddler just grab a truck from another toddler, who responded, "I don't like your behavior." It's possible that that was more effete than just hauling off and slugging the kid.</p>
<p>As for not sweating the "educational" part, beyond some reasonable level of socialization, I agree.</p>
<p>CalMom, we only got dinged 2-3 times for late pick-up fees. The flip side was that young D was dragged on lots of showings of properties on the way home. Leading to things like three/four-year-old D being read "Goldilocks" and telling TheMom, "Goldilocks shouldn't have gone inside that house, there wasn't a sign out front!"</p>
<p>the co-op preschool D attended was open 7am to 6 pm, so many used it as child care- I was in school, so I didn't need it quite that length of time, but I had the job of scheduling the hours of the parents to work- (a lot of UW students and profs- interesting mix of kids)
It wasn't academic at all, but a lot can be learned by play and observation. I really enjoyed the co-op aspect of it- getting to know the other kids and parents on a different level than if we all had just met at pick up time.
Seattle is changing though, not only the co-op preschool now allows you to "pay" university students to do your hours for you, but D's elementary school that used to require hours from parents , doesn't anymore.( However some of the public schools "strongly" suggest volunteer hours, and many privates just wouldn't exist without all the volunteer hours from parents)</p>
<p>I only read the title of the post, but, this is what I'm talking about. Let kids do what they want. Who needs a prestigous preschool?? Who needs it at all? Gee, the nagging starts at preschool? I remember being forced to join Girl Scouts (which I hated so much I don't even remember what it is for) and then 4-H and some other stuff. Ughhhh...</p>