<p>My daughter likes to study just about everything. She asked me to help her narrow down her choices. She wants to possibly pursue an MD/Ph.d program, or MD or Ph.d. She doesn't know yet (Freshman). She has firmly decided to major in Biochemistry, and is thinking of minoring in 1)Bioengineering, or 2)Computer Science, or 3)International Development, or 4) Anthropology, or 5)A foreign language. </p>
<p>I know all those choices are a little bit out of control. But perhaps there's someone out there with some perspective to offer insights to a biochemistry major and a good complementary minor from the above choices for someone intending a career in scientific research in medicine. Any advice? Thanks in advance.</p>
<p>If her plans are med school, you don’t necessarily need to double major / take a minor. That’s usually not really important to those that admit students to med schools / grad school. A foreign language is always useful, I would personally recommend that one. Additionally foreign language majors/minors tend to maintain fairly high GPAs in their classes, so that wouldn’t hurt her too much in terms of maintaining a good GPA for admissions purposes. Bioengineering and biochemistry double major would be very difficult and demanding, even with a minor. But if she loves that subject it can be done. Biomedical engineering / bioengineering majors tend to have the highest MCAT scores of all majors. I’m sure some of that information could help even if she just minored, but is it worth the GPA and difficulty trade off is the question.</p>
<p>If she plans on med school or grad school she will need to do plenty of research, maintain a good GPA, good MCAT score, internships, shadowing, etc. There will be less time available for that if she takes a minor or double major. Additionally, minors or double majors don’t particularly help in terms of being admitted to higher education schools. They care more that there is a “deep” understanding in a certain subject rather than a “jack-of-all trades, master of none” understanding.</p>
<p>Hope I helped, perhaps someone more familiar with this process can chime in as well.</p>
<p>If she’s set on performing research as her career (and decides to go for an MD/PhD or PhD), then definitely computer science–or really anything to do with computers, bioinformatics, or programming. I’m not sure how admissions committees would view it, but the ability to quantify and program are invaluable these days for any researcher. Or anybody at all, for that matter.</p>
<p>This will likely depend on what field of research she wants to go into, but at least some programming knowledge can often be very helpful. If she’s interested in medicine, fluency (or at least proficiency) in a foreign language common in the area where she would like to practice/live/go to medical school will be very beneficial.</p>
<p>Also, notice that I said nothing about a minor. Minors are nice and sound fancy, but they really don’t mean much in and of themselves. Having a minor and being able to actually use a subject are two very different things. Having a minor in a foreign language, for instance, means very little if she’s not fluent in it (or at least, conversational enough to be able to use it in a meaningful way).</p>
<p>And of course, before she frets too much about what minor she should get, she should really figure out what her interests really are. She should be getting research experience to figure out if that’s a route she really wants to go down, to get experience when applying to schools, and to figure out what area of research she wants to go into. And she should be getting clinical experience for the same reasons with respect to getting an MD. And, of course, she should be looking into MD/PhD programs to see if the structure of the program is really what she wants to do. If she’s leaning strongly in one way or the other, I’d recommend she get either the MD or the PhD, rather than do a combined program.</p>
<p>For just the medical direction: I don’t think it makes a big difference. She should do what interests her.
For the research direction: computer science is hands down the most practical. Programming is essential for every field of research now. You don’t necessarily need to minor in it to get the skills, but it’s a good way to do it and demonstrate you have those skills.</p>
<p>PhD and combined MD/PhD committees will not care about any minors. For both, previous research experience will be a big factor. If she is serious about either PhD or MD/PhD, she should try to make time for an extended research experience, i.e. involving multiple semesters and a summer or two as well. Instead of focusing on a minor, she should take extra courses that interest her, and/or which strengthen her understanding of her research field. e.g. if she is a biochem major doing volunteer research in a lab which works on infectious diseases, see if she can take microbiology or pathology courses during her junior/senior years. Another example, if she’s in a lab studying Alzheimer’s, she should consider taking additional classes in cell biology, neuroscience, or pathology. A lot of premeds do the “minimum” amount of research so that they can “tick off the research box” for their applications. Strong candidates for good PhD or MD/PhD programs show that they have a genuine interest in research through lab effort and elective coursework.</p>
<p>You can’t “tick off the research box” for PhD applications - the biggest part of the application is the research. Once she gets into things, though, it will probably become more clear to her what her interests are and things will start to come into focus better. Then I think the options of minors, research experience, etc. will start to become easier. That’s not something you have to have figured out going in.</p>
<p>If I could go back and do it all over again, I would have minored in a foreign language without a doubt.
However, a minor is not necessarily worth much on a transcript at the end of the day. Computer programming skills can be learned outside of school if you have the drive and commitment to teach yourself. </p>
<p>As far as M.D./Ph.D is concerned, I don’t think a minor is worth much at all unless it allows you to take classes in an area that has a direct relationship to your research or interests.</p>
<p>Friend of mine just accepted M.D./PhD at Mayo Clinic. He got involved in a research lab first semester of freshman year. He did a summer research program at Mayo after sophomore year. He majored in biochemistry with a minor in genetics. </p>
<p>The biggest thing I noticed about him was that research was his life. He always wanted to be in the lab. You truly have to love research if you want to get a M.D./Ph.D. The decision to pursue M.D./Ph.D. is one that takes some time and soul searching. </p>
<p>I’ve actually heard that minoring in a foreign language isn’t all that useful for just developing the language skills. Most of them involve a lot of cultural class requirements rather than just language. I looked at doing a German minor but ended up doing a 6 month co-op in Germany instead. Studying abroad kept space free in my schedule for classes I wanted while still giving me a chance to improve my German and get a great experience.</p>
<p>Depends on the minor program. I know multiple people minoring in a foreign language, and they took mostly grammar,writing, and speaking courses.</p>
<p>Wow, great responses and help from everybody, thank you! I will show this thread to her when she gets home (she’s in finals now). About research, my daughter worked for 2 years in a local lab in HS, first year as a volunteer, the second for pay. She has a research job this summer too. Definitely loves that, and does see research in her future. I think she is looking at minors that would enhance her skills in either/both MD/ph.d - not necessarily for admission, but that would help her in both fields.</p>
<p>The minors are not as important as the skills you need to learn to be effective. So someone wanting to be a researcher is expected to have learnt Statistics, some computer packages used in research environment for statistical analysis, some programming languages used in the research area, at least one language as mandated by many medical schools if there is no high school credit on college transcript as a waiver, and so on. These are things adding value to your resume as opposed to creating minors on your diploma. Biochemistry research is big on computer simulations requiring a lot of programming skills these days. Someone was asked to learn python in order to work in a biochem lab as a summer volunteer recently.</p>
<p>I would advise to minor in Spanish.
The other choices are very very time consuming. Specifically writing Computer Programs that she will be required to do will eat up her time. Debugging programs is NOT a computer game. To feel that it is, you need years of experience. I am IT and I love it, love it for several decades, but still have vivid memories of assignements that took close to around the clock day after day. I was not pursuing anything else, I was not required to pariticipate in Medical Research, volunteering, frankly, I was not even working (most UGs work).<br>
I would check around, talk to current students in various majors considered as minors by your D. Music minor was a blessing for my D. It was easy for her. But Spanish is the most useful in medical career. D’s college Spanish was not easy, but very very rewarding. The technical stuff, software and such, most people learn on a job, specific job. Knowing it in general may not applicable to a future job. </p>
<p>For MD/PhD, forget a minor. It’s just not necessary and could cause her to waste precious time. When applying to MD/PhD programs, the top three most important considerations (by adcoms) are research, Research, RESEARCH! She should be conducting her own research (as independent as possible, under the guidance of a well published PI) throughout her UG years. A rigorous summer program(s) (targeted at future researchers) is also a good idea. I did two of these (summers after freshman and sophomore years) and they were very important in my success this application cycle. Instead of a minor, your D should take elective upper level classes in and around her major that will deepen and broaden her understanding of the subject. Perhaps even a grad course for UG credit if she can do that where she is. </p>
<p>Best of luck to your D, and if you have any specific questions about the path to becoming a physician/scientist, feel free to PM me. </p>
<p>You can do research and do whatever else you want to do. My D. was in research for 3 years. If you do not want to have minor, then do not. Not everything should be geared towards requirements of Graduate school, whatever it is. You are looking for a wide range of experiences, including meeting and dealing with the wide range of people to gorw personally. Personal growth is very overlooked, pre-meds are way too consumed chasing requirements, it does backfire in clinicals where you have to deal with very wide range of people, not only with professional group (where you are at the bottom of the food chain, so to speak, and should be able to accept this fact, which is also a maturity factor), but you also are dealing with patients, from very wide range of backgrounds (yes, including homeless or others at the very bottom of socioeconomic level or simply people with considerably different mind set than scientifically oriented). You have to be able to connect to everybody at every level. Limiting your UG experiences to being within group with the same set of mind is not a good idea. One of the reasons why D. decided on Music minor (besides personal interest in Music and certain level of pre-college musical education) was her desire to expand her horizon beyond limited pre-med crowd in Honors college.<br>
I do not underestimate her great Research experience though. I am just saying that it is by far NOT enough. Her minor was not a waste of time by ANY measure at all. More so, non-science Spanish class (which she had time to take only one semester)., was one of the best UG classes and the one that she has used the most while in Medical School.<br>
I do not know much about requirements of MD/PhD, D. did not apply. Her 3 years of Research could have been enough and could be insufficient. But she never adjusted her entire life and all interests to the requirements of the Medical School. Looking back, it would have been a great mistake.</p>
<p>Son majored in Biochem and microbiology (tons of crossover) and minored in genetics. Again lots of crossover, his research was in the field of genetics, botany not human. Now going into his 4th year of med school he is looking at his elective 4th yr rotations and he is looking heavily at genetics. So it does come full circle.</p>
<p>And as Miami mentioned up thread he made sure to become fluent, both written and oral, in Spanish. He also took a medical spanish classes in med school which has really, really helped.</p>
<p>As others have mentioned it is not necessary to double major or even have a minor to gain entrance to med school, however son did what he did for himself and his education. His second degree in biochem/micro came after his first degree in econ, which is now helping in completing his MD/MBA. So again do what you need to for yourself.</p>
<p>katwkittens,
D. is also finfishing her 3rd year and she has also taken medical Spanish while in Medical school (outside of Medical School). She has used it a lot and planning to continuosly improve it as much as she could. Spanish has opened opportunities at Med. School. I would say, more than any other UG class. But again, I am not familiar with the requirements of MD/PhD. I am just seeing that pusuing your personal interests some of which may not be connected (or impression of them that they are not connected) to a Medical School, is important. It is building your personal self. Some things you will give up while being pre-med. D. gave up her sport, something that was a huge part of her life since she was 5 y o all thru freshman year at college. But at least, she has tried and realized that it is not her priority any more. I hope that she will go back to it at some point of her life. But at least she hang on to some of her other interests. That made UG life a rewarding experience along with achieving an ultimate goal of getting into Med. School.</p>