<p>I'm confused about legacy status. Obviously my daughter will be a legacy at my undergrad school. But will she be considered a legacy at the school were I obtain my graduate degrees?</p>
<p>Or, even more confusing to me, do grandparents count? (This is in part a real life quandary, and in part a Gilmore Girls inspired debate). If your grandparents did their bachelors or graduate degrees at a school, are their grandchildren legacies?</p>
<p>Depends on the college. Each one has their own definition.
Grandparents usually only count undergrad, and not all over.
Some schools are different, Penn considers all grad and undergrad, parents and grandparents. You have to look at the individual schools. Some will give weight to legacy, some say they won't, but do, some don't give anything extra.</p>
<p>Any student who has an alumna/alumnus relative of a school is a legacy.</p>
<p>Whether that student gets an <em>admissions advantage</em> due to that legacy, and how much of an advantage, varies by school. Some consider graduate school degrees, some consider grandparents, even uncles and aunts, some consider siblings.</p>
<p>You have to ask at each school and you may or may not get a clear answer. Highly unlikely to get a quantitative answer, but I have seen it happen.</p>
<p>Did grandma and grandpa donate much $$ over the years?? Are they willing to build a new library??</p>
<p>Could make a difference!</p>
<p>scottymix, the easiest and best way to determine legacy is to simply call the adcoms at the colleges in question. This is the only way to get a definitive answer and it will indicate interest in the college by you. My or anyone else responding is only offering a best guess.</p>
<p>Also ask about legacy scholarships. Our son got $3000/yr because my wife is an alum of RPI and the Alum Association sponsors these scholarships for each and every legacy when our son attended.</p>
<p>JM...legacy is typically for parents, not any relative...Aunt Susie went does not make you a legacy...Brother Bob typically doesn't count either.</p>
<p>Most colleges don't count grandma or grandpa unless they donated $$$. In that case it is not the legacy that gets you in, but the $$$.</p>
<p>From what I have understood from 2 of our alma maters...our undergrad (1 child is in attendance at 1 and 1 is applying to another) They would be legacy for either undergrad or grad becaue we attended the school there. Our kids aren't near grad, and didn't/won't apply to Bullet's and my grad schools, but I would assume b/c we have degrees from them also, that they would be legacies there too, even for undergrad.</p>
<p>If you look through threads, legacy doesn't mean you're in...I think now a day it is a marketing tool. Schools can say X% are children of alumni. I do agree once in legacy scholarships exist because of the alumni fundraising.</p>
<p>Actually I think jmmom's answer covers all bases. Many applications ask, "Have any of your relatives attended/graduated from [name of institution]? Names/graduation years." How they use that information may vary from school to school, but they must ask for a reason. Whether its to apply legacy status, or to gauge level of interest, who knows. Most schools are quite cagey (there are, of course, exceptions) about how they factor legacy status, however determined, into the admissions equation.</p>
<p>Umich used to have their admissions criteria with their point system posted online. They have since changed it because of a court decision, but when it was there, you could see how many points a legacy status gave you and it wasn't much. If I recall correctly, having a parent attend gave you four points (out of approximately 120 needed for admissions) and a sibling gave you 1 or 2. Grandparents were also 1 or 2 and nobody else mattered.</p>
<p>Many schools only consider legacy status if the student applies early decision or early action. </p>
<p>When my son got into MIT, some of his friends suggested that it was only because I'd gone there as well and had donated "so much money". I told my son that if my donations had gotten him in, it was $4500 (total lifetime, but something every year) well spent. However, much later I was told that many colleges--theoretically not MIT--also look to see if the parents are consistent donors, because they want to reward that. I have given to MIT every year since I graduated.</p>
<p>For schools with highly competitive admissions standards, legacy status can be helpful if (1) the relatives gave or are capable of giving large amounts, (2) the applicant's credentials put him/her on the edge, and (3) the relatives are active volunteers. Otherwise, if an applicant doesn't present the qualifications that would ensure success at the institution, that spot could very well go to someone else regardless of legacy status (if the above criteria aren't met).</p>
<p>Agree with Little Mother:
S1 was waitlisted at top tier university, even though H & I (and FIL) are alum and contributors (well, not a whole lot, but consistent like dmd). His stats were within the published ranges, but not so stellar as to gain admittance on his own merit. And this school does tell prospects that legacy status is considered, but does not make one an automatic shoo-in.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>BulletorPima is correct that "legacy preference" is probably more a marketing tool than anything else -- marketing for more applications and marketing for alumni support (at least until their kids are old enough to apply).</p></li>
<li><p>But he/she is not correct that only parents count. It varies. I know of at least one situation where an aunt (very involved alumna, high donations) said, "I want Nephew considered as my child for admissions purposes." (She was childless, and Nephew was her youngest nephew/niece.) She was assured that would be the case (and then Nephew was not accepted, despite states well into the college's top quartile in every respect).</p></li>
<li><p>Based on anecdotal experience, I think sibling preferences are in fact quite strong. Having siblings attend the same college creates a very powerful bond between a family and a college. It makes good business sense to promote that.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>Thanks, everyone! This came up because my younger cousin's boyfriend wants to transfer to a more-selective school, and he mentioned over the weekend his grandfather had attended the school. I encouraged him to mention that on his app, but others disagreed with me (which led to a discussion of the Gilmore Girls (Richard/Rory/Yale). </p>
<p>My take is there is no harm in including it on his app.</p>
<p>Depends on the school, but at some schools having a sibling attend is definitely considered legacy.</p>
<p>Little Mother said "legacy status can be helpful if ... the applicant's credentials put him/her on the edge." At many top schools, the legacy status may help only if the applicant has excellent credentials. It is getting rare that schools overlook a weakness in the student (i.e., low GPA, low SATs) to accept a legacy. And as we know from reading lots of anecdotes on CC, many highly qualified legacies get denied.</p>
<p>Oh, and on the Gilmore Girls, I believe that Grandpa Gilmore was not just any alum, but active, possibly served on a board, and gave lots of money. He had pull. And Rory was supposed to be an exceptional genius who also got into Harvard and Princeton.</p>
<p>My D is adamant that even if she applies to one of the schools to which she's a legacy (six of them), she will not tell them. She's very morally opposed to the idea, especially given she feels she's already hugely advantaged by our socio-economic status (education and income).</p>
<p>I can't really argue against her on moral grounds, but I'm more pragmatic. Besides, I can justify it sort of evens things out, given both hubby and I were incredibly disadvantaged back in the day (very poor families, weak school systems, and this was before credit was given to being the first in your family to go college).</p>
<p>A good place to check is on the application - Stanford allows you to list relatives that went to graduate and undergraduate, Dartmouth only lets you list undergraduate, Cornell doesn't include siblings. I would say most schools only count parents for undergraduate, and for it to really count you need to apply ED/EA (use it or lose it). </p>
<p>starbright - when your daughter is competing with athletes, URM, first generation, 50-50 male vs female (less qualified male are admitted over female because female students have better stat now), she will appreciate that little advantage she may have over other applicants. It is great to be young and idealistic.</p>
<p>
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She's very morally opposed to the idea, especially given she feels she's already hugely advantaged by our socio-economic status (education and income).
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Just tell her that she has a moral obligation to answer the questions on the application fully and truthfully.</p>
<p>Post 12
[quote]
But he/she is not correct that only parents count. It varies. I know of at least one situation where an aunt (very involved alumna, high donations) said, "I want Nephew considered as my child for admissions purposes." (She was childless, and Nephew was her youngest nephew/niece.) She was assured that would be the case (and then Nephew was not accepted, despite states well into the college's top quartile in every respect).
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Is this truly legacy or the fact as you stated...high donations!
I take legacy for a child filling out the application...Are you a legacy? Aunt Susie donating $$$ does not make the child a legacy, the alumnus was just using their donation to get the child in.</p>
<p>I know a friend whose son was waitlisted at Columbia, did get in in the end. Both parents went to Law School and one went undergrad. They donate sev $$$ a yr, but yet their DS, who was definetly a match landed up being waitlisted. It is not a given anymore that legacy is a hook</p>
<p>I know of a child, Valedictorian, very high gpa, SAT, every AP possible that could fit her schedule. Full ride to UNCCH...rejected from Duke. Her grandfather even has his name on a building. She was told that even though Grandpa went there she could not mark legacy, gramps said he would go and talk to them she said no she wanted to make it in on her own...she didn't. $$$ these days can sometimes be the difference and legacies with $$$ may open the door, but justchecking the box isn't going to give you more than those who don't...it is probably a tie breaker at best.</p>
<p>I agree that it is best to ask the school what they consider legacies as the annswer varies.</p>
<p>Some schools only look at parents, others will look at grandparents, siblings, extended family.</p>
<p>Some schools only count undergraduate degrees , while others look at any school within their university system.</p>
<p>
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Dartmouth only lets you list undergraduate
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</p>
<p>Dartmouth only considers students legacies whose parents received their undergrad degrees at the college.</p>
<p>In any event, the big question everywhere is this: If you took the pool of applicants considered "legacies", and compared it to a control group of randomly selected applicants with the same demographic characteristics as the legacy pool (including family income and education) and the same GPA/test score distribution, would there be any difference in admission rate? My guess is yes, but not much.</p>