@1NJParent I completely agree. They seem to be replacing ‘flawed’ objective standardized tests with highly subjective (and subject to fabrication) essays. I realize there are equity issues with the tests, but those equity issues are even greater with essays in my opinion.
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Back when the SAT are marketed as an “aptitude” (IQ) test, it was definitely quite preppable, in that the verbal section was mainly a vocabulary test. Prep books with lists of SAT words were offered for that purpose. There were also specific test taking techniques taught in books and prep courses. Test prep was not as common then, probably because colleges generally were not as selective (in terms of how strong the applicant’s credentials had to be to get admitted).
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The tests were never completely equitable, of course. And they could certainly be made better. The “analogy” section could have been retained, for example, without resorting to esoteric words. More importantly though, the tests were more equitable than the alternatives we have today.
In the old SATs that were mostly vocabulary in the verbal section, using more esoteric words was the way they used to make harder questions. Not using esoteric words would have resulted in a low ceiling with lots of 800 scores, which is probably not the kind of score distribution that they wanted.
@ucbalumnus *might have resulted. (If you’re speculating, don’t state it as fact) But yeah, back in the day prepping was mostly just a study book. Despite what this forum would make one think, I would bet that most kids these days still just use a prep book or khan academy, and I think that’s why admissions people often compare kids to other kids in the same high school. Perhaps they assume those kids would have similar resources and that it’s more of an apples to apples comparison. At any rate, my opinion is that the tests don’t mean everything but they don’t mean nothing either. And like I said before, replacing them with essays hardly solves the issues with the tests.
@MichaelCShort Can you define a “non-elite” student?
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I would like to provide another viewpoint on this. My child used the Additional Information section in full: to provide additional details on an award, to list a few more minor awards beyond the 5 already listed, and to provide insight into some community service projects. None of it would be defined as exceptional but it painted a more thorough picture.
For context, we come from a very average middle-of-the-road high school that never sends kids to ivies or T20s. My child had above average stats, but not 1600 territory. No National Awards. No NMSF. No hooks. No spike. Not URM.
Kids work hard for 4 years and then need to sum their lives up in this one application. I know you said that “no one wants to read anything extra unless it’s truly an exceptional circumstance.” This sort of surprises me. The Additional Information section is a part of the application. Why would kids who make use of the space be viewed as “self-important” or “the exception to the application and need more space to say more things than other applicants.” This genuinely confuses me.
The common app says “You may use the space below to provide any additional information you wish to share.” Why wouldn’t kids want to share more information with the AOs who hold their future in their hands? And, why wouldn’t the AOs welcome additional details that may paint a more thorough picture of the student?
In the end, using the Additional Information section in full worked for my kid: accepted to 13 out of 14 schools, two ivies, and is now at one of the HYP schools.
I just wanted to show an example where using the Additional Information section worked very well.
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So true about earning a B (or more) in high school making college less than a shock, especially T30s. As someone who went to a (currently ranked) T30 and had her share of grades less than As, I saw how tough it was for the 4.0 UW kids in college when they earned something less. Meanwhile, my college experience was wonderful.
Regarding the shock of earning a B grade in college… a related shock is finding out that earning a 3.5 GPA in college is a lot harder than earning a 3.5 GPA in high school for most students. When renewing a necessary-for-affordability scholarship or keeping a GPA that does not result in instant rejection for medical school is the goal, the shock and related stress over grades and GPA may be greater than it was in high school.
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@DoingOurBest Thank you for your post. It can be stress-inducing to read that your kids shouldn’t have done what they already did (and were told to do by their school CG) or they will come off as someone who is self-important.
Our S21 used the additional info section to briefly relay our state’s continued complete shutdown (which is significant due to several of his ECs) and what he did instead, and to explain his class schedule (he has 3 classes, though the school states they have 2 classes).
Our D21 cited the web pages that explained her awards/selective programs and had her winning essay in one case.
I really don’t think giving context to the brief list of ECs, or transcript, can damage an application. But I guess we’ll see!!
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Definitely! My HS GPA was probably somewhat on the lower side of admits 33 years ago, so college was definitely not a shock to me. We did not have weighted GPAs back then, which would have greatly boosted my GPA since I was taking many of the hardest classes at my suburban HS.
I really hope AOs can discern essays written entirely by students. Getting a review of an essay is one thing, but it grinds my gears to hear of applicants having essays written for them.
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Havenoidea- I think what you posted (and what your son wrote) is perfectly appropriate and what the section was intended for.
I have tried to help a young neighbor with her application which was an exercise in “duh”. She had been cast as the lead in the Spring Musical-- which never happened since the schools were in shutdown in May. She was supposed to attend a summer program overseas (not competitive- a “pay to play” type of program) which never happened because the country she was going to was in shutdown. Etc. A long laundry list of “coulda shoulda woulda”. I tried to encourage her to use the space to talk about something positive- what she DID do, despite the frustrating and continuing cancellations. But she is clinging to “what could have been”, complete with detailed annotations about when something was postponed, only to be cancelled, then replaced by something less prestigious but then that also got cancelled.
I think your son’s solution is brilliant.
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@NOVAGirl87 That’s the issue I have with the emphasis on essays-- you literally don’t know who wrote it. Some kids write the essay on their own, some get counselor or parent input/editing, some pay consultants to help them determine their topic and what to say, and then I’m sure there are kids who have someone else write the essay for them entirely. It runs the gamut, and would presumably correlate to things like socioeconomic status/ privilege/ etc. which is supposedly the problem with standardized tests.
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@rbc2018 I agree that essays are not a great way to evaluate students. Some sort of standardized testing is better…with KhanAcademy out there it is not necessary to pay anything to prepare for the exams. I am no fan of CollegeBoard but it seems better than anything else out there. HS grades are not comparable, oftentimes even within the same HS as teachers are very different.
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Essays are not the only way they’re evaluating. Not even the primary. You still have a full app/supp to present, a number of info points to provide, to create a picture of yourself.
I can see where you’d freak, if you think it’s mostly the writing. But it’s still holistic. And you still need to know what you’re applying to, why, how you match, and how to best present yourself. Assuming won’t do it.
Nor does any one piece of specific advice. It helps to make your own best journey through the info that IS available, get your own ideas, look beyond stats and marketing. Then you can try to process.
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While no one ever knows when an essay is truly written by a parent, the student or some other adult, I think often times it is very obvious when it is or isn’t written by the student and universities do figure that out and I think that essays often do make the difference.
I have a few friends who asked me to review their kid’s essays this year. One wrote like the 17 year old he is. While there were some disconnects and grammar errors that needed cleaning up, it was clear he wrote the paper. Then on the other hand, another friend’s kid the essays read like a smooth operator. Way too smooth, with vocab words that no 17 year old uses unless maybe they’re writing for a school paper, in AP English, entering writing competitions etc. Additionally this kid is not an A English student and has been in remedial English most years. There were some big vocab words in the essays. Not words I would ever use. I’m also not an English savant. My point being, it was obvious these essays were a little too polished. I have another friend where I read the daughter’s essay for a class in high school and it used words that the kid, also in remedial courses would never use. One I had to look up the definition of myself. I finally had to tell her that she needs to not have her father do her work for her. The dad walked in the room and instead of saying anything about that to him she instead told him he has to dumb down her papers. Omg! So yes, if it’s obvious to a lay person like me who doesn’t read 1,000s of essays it has to be obvious to these people. But saying that, I do think the essays make a world of difference.
My son didn’t let us read his essays until just before he was ready to submit them and only really for a quick proofread or feedback. In one place my husband had one other suggestion of a word and my son’s response was simply, no, because that’s not my words and not anything I would ever write. His essays read like him and his words and who he is. If a school writes him off because they don’t like his themes or topics then they’re not the place for him but I do think 100% the essays are vital and do make a difference and that many essays do not get through when they are written with help or not by the student.
I also don’t think standardized testing is always the right way to assess an applicant. There are many kids that have accommodations, some rightfully so, but some for reasons that they get them only for the ACT or SAT. As a proctor I know this all too well. They use them to gain the extra time advantage when most kids are rushed for certain sections on the ACT. These kids don’t ever use extra time in a regular class setting and waive it off for the AP tests. The colleges also do not know when a kid has accommodations and there were plenty of kids that have those outrageously high scores, so putting more weight on test scores is not a good idea. If anything test scores will be going by the wayside especially after this year.
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There were two former admissions officers that posted this year on CC and both were asked about whether they sometimes realized the essays were not the work of the student. I cannot recall the exact response but one indicated that the assumption was the kids were helped and there was no further efforts to determine the extent. My recollection is the second basically concurred.
One thing when it’s some help, it’s another thing when someone else writes them completely. Our English teachers have an entire unit on the senior college essay that requires you turn it in to them, they review, suggest edits, and drafts and over and over. That’s “help” but that’s not “HELP” if you know what I mean. Same when someone uses a paid college essay tutor. A good one isn’t writing the paper but helping brainstorm and come up with the creative process behind the essay but making sure the student is writing it all. There are plenty unfortunately that don’t do that.
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Isn’t it well known that the percentage of SAT/ACT takers getting extended-time accommodations is well correlated to the SES of the SAT/ACT takers’ families?
I.e. families with money are better able to get (a) legitimate accommodations and (b) questionable accommodations that families without money are unlikely to get.
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@lookingforward The original comment about this was responding to some statements that there is much more emphasis on essays in the absence of test scores. I thought the same people who are concerned about inequities in standardized tests would/should also be concerned about inequities that affect the essays. That’s the context (at least for the comments I made).
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