Perhaps a good reason for people to stop using Niche. SMU doesn’t have any religion course or chapel requirements. I have not heard anyone describe SMU as religious, regardless of its affiliation with the Methodist church.
Here’s what the website says about religious affiliation:
I agree that SMU and USC attract some of the same types of students, even though the schools have many differences. From our area, the type of females who attend both are typically attractive, social, and affluent. Many high drama sorority stories, both during rush and ongoing membership.
Re: my earlier post, I am changing my spreadsheet acre column to main campus acres instead, as google is giving me less helpful numbers. So, BC is only 120 for main campus, for example, U Roch 200 rather than 700, SCU 106, Villanova 160 (plus a little known fact, 1500 trees).
How can the kids be similar when one college has almost 2/3 white kids and another college has only 1/3 white kids? Diversity of student body is going to be different. No doubt about it. Secondly, the quality of the student body will be different based on HS test scores and GPA. If USC decided to have only 6,500 (like SMU) undergrads, their acceptance rates would be close to the ivies in difficulty of admit.
In addition, I don’t believe that “the major difference” is just location even though it’s certainly a factor. I have already listed several differences.
When you actually compare and contrast these two colleges you see more differences than similarities in student body and other areas IMO.
FWIW USC & SMU are overlap schools for applicants.
USC is more diverse due in part to the dramatic size difference in the student body.
Both schools attract upper middle class & above, very attractive students and both schools have a significant Greek presence. Both have a significant preprofessional vibe as well.
Business is the number one major at both schools while engineering, communications, & the performing arts all have a strong presence at both universities.
Can we move on from the USC/SMU talk? I’m now sorry I asked. For the kids we know, the applicants are not the same for the two schools. USC gets the tippy top students applying. The kids I know who applied to USC had schools like Michigan, UVA, Vanderbilt on their lists. Kids who applied to SMU? Those kids applied to places like Miami OH, TCU, Dayton.
SMU mom went down there for two weeks (!!!) to prepare her D for rush and stayed through the process. I told her that’s insane and she said she felt she had to do it because all of her D’s friends’ moms were coming. And this D didn’t get into Illinois or Wisconsin. She wasn’t a great student. In the end was deciding between Butler and SMU. I just don’t see D there.
@Publisher we’ve been through this before. Still working on SAT scores. Plus, I have good info from our high school on acceptance rates from our school. You must not be reading closely because I never said D was competitive for most of these schools with her current ACT. The whole point of this thread is to show the process from start to (hopefully) finish and show all of the ups and downs.
@evergreen5 I thought I was the only one tracking acres! I do think it makes a difference. I started thinking about it when D thought Madison was too big. We walked from some of the freshman dorms to campus and she just said no way. Size of campus matters to her.
Also, D has two very good friends at BC who she danced with since was four years old. They are very similar to D in academics and otherwise. They are having very good experiences. The only difference is that I would say they are both Catholic-lite. Both went to religious ed through maybe seventh grade? They were not church goers in high school though. Selfishly, it would be nice for me if D was at BC. Close to S and she’d have two girls there to show her the ropes.
We are tracking acres too for S21. He does not want to have to take a bus to class…15 min walk, max. So that takes lots of schools off the list, which is helpful! Gotta narrow it down somehow!
If she is thinking lacs may be too small, keep in mind that Colgate is a bit bigger than the typical lac with about 3,000 undergrads and is also known for being very social while also being quite academic.
I’m not really looking for more schools to add. I had another thread for that a while back. Colgate definitely stays on the list for now but we wouldn’t add Bucknell.
For schools with spread out campuses, you have to be careful with class times too. May not be able to have back to back classes because there may not be time to get from one building to the next, so that can limit class options potentially
I had a typo, Villanova 260 acres, though I have not yet determined whether that is all main campus or whether that includes some extra property - it certainly doesn’t feel too big, seemed like a happy medium, though 2 yrs ago the tour did not go where the new dorms were being built across the street. SCU feels super compact, maybe because it’s flat. BC is on a hillside; the tour is middle campus only (where classes are), so if you go, feel free to wander to upper (freshman dorms). USC felt physically bigger than it is, maybe due to the large population, and yet doable.
I also agree that SAT composite ranges are quite helpful. By the way, BC’s new factbook is up. The “freshman admission profile” is enrolled data, not admitted. (I happen to prefer enrolled.)
My 2 cents, but I think it’s important to have an open mind when considering colleges. For example, we were initially concerned that D’s top college housed all freshman on the east campus and students have to take a 5 minute bus ride to the main West campus or walk 15-20 minutes. But after we talked to several students they reassured D that it’s not really a big deal. No college is going to be perfect and you are going to have to compromise on some things.
@homerdog congrats on D opting out of her Feb ACT. I think she/you are making the right decision and she’s going to do better on the SAT.
@homerdog: Yes, I am reading closely. Just pointing out that some schools with similiar qualities are a match for your daughter and some are a reach. It is important to be realistic about one’s chances of admission.
Boston College is on your list & should be a match.
What I find most interesting about this thread are the fairly dramatic changes in list of target schools for your daughter–especially after researching schools so carefully over the prior year or so for your son.
Tulane was on my daughter’s list, and I’ll just weigh in on what we learned about the heavy deferral rate. They are HUGE on demonstrated interest. If she can’t visit, she needs to be sure and find other ways to demonstrate interest and make her essays very compelling and show that she really loves Tulane or she should absolutely expect a deferral in EA. They want to weed out all the kids who use it as backup and will end up somewhere else.
And with most schools, the city or location is almost as important a factor as the school itself.
Many have strong reactions (both positive & negative) to cities such as Los Angeles & Chicago, for example. It is important in the case of a school like USC to visit in order to assess not only Los Angeles but also the school’s location within the city itself.
Hi, Wake has rolling ED I, if you apply in June (on Wake’s online App) you will hear back 4-6 weeks. Also Wake is test optional. That way if it’s a no, you still have all options open.
@UGG2023: Helpful info. to all readers. Concern, of course, for most is that ED is binding. In the OP’s daughter’s case, she looks like a sure admit to WFU if she applies ED.
Does WFU also offer an EA option ? (For example, the University of Richmond appears to offer both ED & EA early application options.)
Also, as a full pay student with at least one highly accomplished EC (dance / ballet), and solid grades, OP’s daughter should be admitted “above her numbers” to some most selective schools.
If your D is becoming less interested in small LACs, I’m wondering about dropping Davidson (since similar to Bowdoin in academics and size) and adding Emory for your spring visit?