The reality is that even with all of the tours, classroom observation and overnights there will still be a lot of unknowns. These are just glimpses of the college’s experiences and typically done under the auspices of someone in admin.
Individual professors, how a TA grades, whether your first year roommate is compatible, can you get the classes you want, etc have a significantly greater impact on your child’s college experience than sitting in on a handful of classes as a non student.
Also appreciate what your child sees. My son was recruited to play lacrosse in college. His objective was to get into the best school academically with the best lacrosse program. Multiple recruiting visits, overnights, meetings with the coach, etc and he convinced himself it was the right fit. He never looked for the negatives only the positives…
Not soon after he arrived, he hated the town, disliked most of the students (other than the lacrosse players), the school size and academic rigor. Stayed for 2 seasons and played in the NCAA tournament twice then left. Ironically, he wound up at “directional school” in NC with only club lacrosse and really likes it.
I can tell you during the college search if he (or we) had mentioned the school he’s currently attending we both would have scoffed. But it seems to be the right fit.
So I surely understand and appreciate the effort to thoroughly research all college choices (trust me I did it also), one needs to understand there still an infinite number of variables you can’t account for.
Small thing: when we visit colleges with our kids we usually send them off to grab coffee and and pull out their laptop in union on their own (usually to catch up on HW) for an hour or two. Allows them some alone time to meld in with the student scene and absorb the vibe a bit, picture themselves there, process what they’ve seen/learned about the college, etc.
This student wants to join a sorority. I am wondering if there is a way to learn details about this process when touring a school? Will this student be ok joining a sorority that might not be at the top of her list?
When possible, we spent time on campus and in town on the weekend. It gave us an opportunity to see the libraries, how quiet/loud the campus gets, what goes on in town on a Saturday night etc.
@twogirls we are doing what we can to figure out the sorority scene at schools that have Greek life. I’ve talked to a number of CC parents and students and we know female students at Wake and Richmond (well the Richmond one is going next year so will be a freshman in the fall but she seems to have good info on the sorority scene and we can check back with her in the fall.)
I’ve talked to D about how sometimes girls don’t get their first choice sorority. She understands. Will she care if that happens to her? I think there are way too many variables to know. Best she can do is go in eyes wide open.
We also follow the Panhellenic groups for these schools on Instagram.
@tkoparent. That was are experience with my son. I thought at least he would do the lunch with the students thing when invited to do so. He was like “what is eating lunch with students I don’t know going to tell me”?. He was very convinced that first he needs to like the school and what it offers and then he will find his people. Not the other way around.
But he had no problem meeting with Professors or department heads. He felt that gave him a lot of information.
My daughter just finished rushing earlier this semester at UVA. What a process that was…
She had to go back a week before classes started and it was a 6 day process. If you are not thick skinned it can be a real test. Being scrutinized for what you wear, how you look , where you are from, what your parents make, etc is not something anybody wants to be exposed to.
Not getting your first choice or a bid at all can result in some real serious introspection. Unfortunately, that does not seem justified but when you put a bunch of successful, bright overachievers in competition they are not used to hearing “no”.
Each school has a hierarchy for their Greek system and it’s best for rushees to be realistic and honest with where they fit. For my daughter, she got called back to a top sorority but realized even though it was one of the top it wasn’t the for her.
A few positives did emerge from the process, after having what seemed like one hundred “informal conversations”, said she’d never be anxious about going on another interview again. And she got a bid to Tina Fey’s sorority which was one her top choices…so there’s that
@Cavitee. That sounds horrifying.
@Knowsstuff it’s a tough process. Her best friend at Duke did not get any bids and after what she felt was really successful first semester it’s knocked her back this second semester.
It can really feel like an indictment on who you are and how you are perceived…
I was Greek. It was obviously a long time ago but I still remember the feelings. D will have numerous friends going through rush this time next year since she’s friends with a lot of seniors. Her cousins went Greek. I just hope she will talk to them and get perspective. She’s a pretty tough nut. Anyone who can deal with a Russian ballet teacher knows being shamed and she’s had years and years of that. Lol. But, seriously, we will find out as much as she can. About 20 pages ago on this thread, there was a lot of discussion about Greek life. Not sure we need to repeat.
@Knowsstuff our D also thinks a campus tour is all she needs to get a feel for the school. We usually do information sessions, which are sometimes helpful (Davidson, Bryn Mawr), but often she feels she hears the same things during the info session as she’d get from the tour guides (Miami of OH, Occidental). I dragged her to lunch in the dining hall at my alma mater, and she agreed it would be a good idea to do the same at other schools, though so far she hasn’t allowed it again! Even at her favorite places she hasn’t felt the need to linger. And when she doesn’t like the “vibes” during the tour? She can’t get off campus fast enough! We did discuss re-visiting 1 or 2 early in the fall if she’s considering ED, so she may be holding out for that before doing a deeper dive.
I do agree that kids can probably get what they need from just a tour, info session, and looking at a college’s website. I think the way we looked for S19 and now for D21 is almost like deciding which college to attend, not which colleges to apply to. Digging deeper earlier helps the kids write their supplemental essays as well and helps them put things in order a bit as the list evolves.
I will say that S told us over last weekend that, now that he’s in college, all of these tours, classes, research, etc., only go so far and no one really knows what it’s going to be like until you actually go there. He also said so much of it is about which classes you are taking and the friends you meet. Some of that can be controlled but not all of it. But, you can know if the school will suit you academically, if you like the campus, if travel to and from is something you’re up for, if the students you’ve talked to give you info that’s helpful and if they are friendly. There’s always what the kids sniff out as the “vibe” too and we all know kids can do that pretty quickly sometimes just by walking on campus.
In D’s case, it will be hard for us to visit schools in the fall. She’s got that editor in chief job for yearbook and she’s on poms during football season. Plus, she’s got a pretty heavy academic load. I’d rather not have to get back on a plane again until after acceptances.
D20 applied to 13 colleges and only visited half of them (granted 6 were UCs where demonstrated interest is not considered) and on her school tours she never attended one class. She did however ask lots of questions of her tour guides, got their contact information and followed up with them when she was writing her application essays. I think connecting with current college students and asking them lots of questions can help determine best fit and can help with showing the college adcoms that you really know their college.
Facebook groups helped with my daughter decisions to get a feel also
That can evidently be hit or miss. She said it did help on the acceptance ones since she could interact with people that she might become friends with. She could get the vibe of the types of students applying to some extent. At small Lacs this is more of a possibility.
Also… Take really good notes, Excell spreadsheets etc. At some point like 6 months from now get ready for the “didn’t this school have this or that” discussion. It’s pretty easy to get all these visits /schools confused at some point.
Also don’t be surprised when some of her schools that got ruled out, get ruled back in again… Lol…
@homerdog I agree with your son- so much you can’t control. I’ve seen bad freshman roommates kill the first year. S17 was lucky. Hoping D21 does as well.
@Knowsstuff I understand about keeping options open. Even with S19, he kept Vanderbilt and W&M on the list even though he was pretty sure he wanted the smaller LAC experience. While he was applying, he was really gung ho LAC and he’s happy where he is but now he says he would have been able to make a medium sized university work for sure. He can now see the positives and negatives of LAC vc. medium sized school. I do believe he’s been clear with his sister about what the differences are. He’s been pretty helpful.
@homerdog – is your S19 thinking about study abroad? My D says soooo many go Fall of Junior year, and it’s a nice change of pace b/c it’s smack dab in the middle of the 4 years. I think at small colleges this is esp nice way to shake things up.
She’s planning to head to Spain next semester! She’ll have friends in Paris, London, Berlin and Copenhagen, just to name a few. And flights are cheap within Europe – plus she won’t have Friday classes, most likely. She’s been saving money so she can really make the most of her time and see visit a lot of places. I’m jealous!
@AlmostThere2018 Yes! S19 will have to fill out preliminary paperwork in Feb of next year to study abroad. Most kids at Bowdoin go in the second semester junior year because, well, cold dark weather in Maine!
D21 is even more about study abroad than S19 is. She’s really into that idea.
@homerdog - it seems like your son has some great insights and advice. Your D is lucky to have his experience. The only classes my D17 sat in on were at Davidson (once during junior year and again during a scholarship finalist weekend the next year). However, doing that was enough to tell her that the LAC environment and types of classes were what she wanted. Yes, there will be different vibes at different LACs, but we did feel the majority of schools she applied to would be similar in terms of the quality of teaching, size of classes and participation within the classes. Even if some of the classes or experiences your D has aren’t great, it sounds like she will have enough time at each school to have an overall picture of the school and a good feel for the environments. Such an exciting time!
I think your son’s observation are accurate. There is so much serendipity in what happens when you visit and then there is so much serendipity in what happens when you get on campus. You can do legwork to get it right, but it probably won’t be exactly what you think.
And let me add, as a parent of a kid who is now in his last semester at a LAC, the freshman experience is not the sophomore experience is not the junior experience nor the senior one. My guess is that your son will still love Bowdoin when he graduates but will describe it somewhat differently than he does today. Which is what you would hope for, but it further demonstrates how any snapshot, including one from someone in the thick of it, will evolve.
Hi from Texas. I’ve plowed through all 50 (!) pages of this thread as my S21 is looking at several of the same schools. Somewhere along the way you mentioned a discussion with parents of current Richmond parents that provided good insight. Could you share the link? Thanks!