Benedict → St. Benedict (reply #130).
Just trying to let OP know that not all state schools are as huge as Illinois & Wisconsin, and that an honors college satisfies all or almost all of the daughter’s wants & concerns while allowing her to participate on dance teams during major athletic events.
OP is the one who first mentioned the University of Mississippi in post #91 above. (And, yes, I understand that OP mentioned Ole Miss as an intended bit of humor.)
Also, several posters have suggested Rhodes College in Memphis, Tennessee which is within reasonable driving distance of the University of Mississippi in Oxford, Miss.
@AlmostThere2018 The engineering/business program you mention at Lehigh is worth checking out. Well regarded program and grads place well.
Not sure about the non engineering programs. Always felt they got the short end of the stick there. I do think there are aspects of Lehigh that OP’s D would like; community feel, school spirit around sports, Greek life. Lehigh has had more of its share of alcohol and hazing related incidents. Administration trying to rein that in.
Similiar concerns about Union.
FWIW: My impression from this thread is that the first choice school is Vanderbilt University which has been ruled out due the daughter’s sub-35 ACT score. Many Southern students targeting Vanderbilt also apply to Ole Miss as a backup due to perceived similarities about social life & close-knit campus culture.
I cannot think of anything–other than prestige, maybe-- that OP’s daughter is seeking that is not satisfied by the Honors College at the University of Mississippi as honors colleges tend to make large universities small in the respects about which OP has expressed concern.
And, yes, I understand that many folks have preconceived notions about the state of Mississippi. Oxford, however, is much different than the stereotypes of this state.
Very few honors colleges really “make a big school smaller”. I feel like I’ve exhausted that research but I’ll admit I never looked at Mississippi. Many honors colleges give the kids priority registration or different housing options or maybe an honors section or two. I think USCarolina seems to do a better job of keeping sections small for most of the honors’ kids classes. Maybe PSU. Maybe Michigan. But she does not want a physically large school.
I think we’ve pretty much exhausted ideas for schools to add to the list. I didn’t start this thread to get a ton of opinions on that as I think we’re pretty close to a list. Thanks to all so far who had ideas for schools to add.
I would overrule your D on Lehigh and look at Lafayette as well. They are very near each other. FWIW, I much prefer Lafayette to Lehigh. Use the old “I pay, I get a say trick” and play the parents’ choice card. Grads from both of those schools are VERY successful. Both schools have a lot of rah rah spirit and they also have a legendary rivalry. Lehigh’s campus is the most beautiful I’ve seen, on this side of the country. (Top Honor goes to U SanDiego.)
I would say that Greek Life is very strong at Lehigh, so if that appeals to her or not, consider that. I prefer the size of Lafayette and the kids seemed a little more relaxed to me. I think Lehigh has more of a work hard, play even harder culture. We visited Lehigh on a glorious, unseasonably warm Feb day. As in warm enough to wear shorts. Hardly any students were outside, unlike tons of Lafayette kids who were. We found half the Lehigh kids in the library studying and the other half working out in the gym. That’s a good thing, but it also seemed a bit odd.
Anyway, both are really excellent schools that your husband should be satisfied with in terms of career prospects.
Union was mentioned, and I definitely think the vibe might appeal to her, especially if merit money is of real interest. If visiting Hamilton is on the cards, you can easily see Union too. I know several happy Union students.
Also, if you are full pay, I think for the money, Lafayette is a much better choice than F & M, though it’s harder to get into Laf. Being a female is a slight tip at Lafayette, which has more male applicants due to its engineering offerings and D1 sports status. It might also be a slight tip at Union, for the same reason (not the D1 sports of course.)
WFU, Richmond, & Davidson College are all outstanding options !
OP: If the ACT score meets or exceeds your target of 31, will you be open to additional options ?
@Publisher yes. But I’m not holding my breath. Lol.
I think your daughter will love Wake Forest. D17 got in regular decision with similar stats, S20’s were higher but went ED since the school has become a tougher admit in RD and he was sure that Wake was his first choice.
D17’s final decision was between Wake and Smith College, strange as that might seem. D20’s final choices were WFU, Richmond and Washington and Lee. He thought Richmond seemed like a smaller version of Wake, told me “Everyone at W&L looks like me.” I was impressed with all three schools.
Feel free to PM me if you have any questions.
I think what’s hard to express here is that, from our high school, many of these suggested NE colleges are not on the radar. At all. Our 750 grads each year go to predominantly Big Ten schools. After that, they go to places like Loyola Chicago, DePaul and UIC. Every year maybe three kids go to an east coast LAC and they are 99 percent recruited athletes. I think S19 is the only student they’ve ever had go to a NESCAC school who wasn’t recruited. The top kids go to places like Duke, NU, Chicago, Georgetown, Vandy. Only athletes and legacies get into Ivies.
Wake gets maybe five apps. Maybe one gets accepted. One every other year goes. Haven’t had anyone go to Davidson now in three years. Richmond same. No one has heard of Lafayette or Union. A few kids apply to Lehigh each year but all get waitlisted or denied. I think they think they won’t actually attend.
I think it’s hard to understand for those of you on the east coast. I know these are all good schools but they are a hard sell here I guess when most kids are fine with the status quo of where most kids go to college. I do wonder if part of it is that some of the east coast schools just don’t have a lot of Midwestern kids and so the kids don’t feel like they fit. Even at Bowdoin, where there are kids from all over the country, it does feel like many kids know of each other from the Boston suburbs. I’m guessing a place like Lafayette or Union would feel very much like everyone is from the NE.
Anyway, that’s where we are coming from when considering schools. She’d like some geographical diversity at school but also like to see some kids from the Midwest so she doesn’t feel like an outsider. I feel like there are a decent number of Midwestern kids at Wake or Richmond or Davidson but not convinced for schools like Lafayette or Union I guess.
We visited Wake Forest four times (we planned additional visits while visiting other NC schools) and Richmond once. Despite our limited time at Richmond, I did not see it as a smaller version of Wake Forest (I realize this is all subjective).
Richmond has a perfect campus. It looked too perfect for my taste. It is gorgeous, the landscaping is immaculate, the grass is perfectly green, and the campus looks like it can be in a magazine for Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous. I felt like a fish out of water…not wealthy enough to be there. Additionally, on the one day we were there…a group of boys came dressed in suits. I am not saying any of this is bad…but it wasn’t my daughter’s cup of tea. My daughter is happy sitting under a tree discussing genetics…in Spanish…with her friends from Colombia. There was zero diversity…it was so noticeable that one mom brought this up for discussion with the tour guide. There was just a different vibe than what my D wanted. Again…certainly not bad, but not for her.
Wake Forest also has a beautiful campus, but it also looks real. Not as plastic, though still beautiful. There were large patches of grass that clearly needed water, for example. The kids wore jeans, and there seemed to be a little more diversity (granted, we were there four times). WF spoke about traditions (such as what they do with toilet paper LOL) whereas Richmond didn’t speak about this at all.
I say this not to bash Richmond…it’s a great school. We were particularly impressed with the business school despite my daughter not being a business major. And FWIW…most schools have things to criticize…nothing is perfect.
Our S19 is at Denison. While we have only one semester’s experience to go on, I would second @gardenstategal’s observation that the school is much more balanced than it apparently once was. Denison’s president, Adam Weinberg, is very impressive and clearly has big plans for the school. My S, who is a serious athlete and not a big partier, is very happy there, and we’ve been impressed to see how quickly he’s developed strong relationships with his professors - the academic environment is very supportive. You might want to take a look at the new Data Analytics program, which was very attractive to me as the parent of a non-STEM kid. I don’t know much about the ballet aspects of the Dance program, but the department was very welcoming when my son reached out to them about possibly taking one of their modern dance classes. The Dance department is based in the new Eisner Center, which is really spectacular - you’ll definitely want to see it when you visit. One of the things that has impressed me about Denison is the way the alumni maintain strong ties. Michael Eisner donated the Eisner Center, another graduate is funding a new apartment building for the seniors, Jennifer Garner spoke at graduation, and Steve Carrell turned up recently for the anniversary of the improv group. For one reason or another, Denison never showed up on our radar screen until very late in the process and we visited it on the way to someplace else, but my son had one of those “aha” moments that day, and we are very happy with how things are working out.
My son is at Northeastern. He just finished his first co-op, and will now start his Junior year in a few weeks. He has enjoyed his time at NEU. He has a group of friends , belongs to a few clubs, enjoys the gym. His dorm is nice, it’s right on campus. NEU does have a real campus, it’s enclosed by buildings consisting of a few city blocks. It’s actually very well kept and maintained… Public transport is easily obtained. It’s in the city, but.the campus makes it feel like a little park inside of the city.
My son enjoyed his first co-op. It was a great way to learn the ropes of adulthood and he earned a very generous salary. He learned a lot. He said his job was sort of interesting, but he would like to work in a more hip and techy next time. He worked in the insurance industry and he felt like they were behind the times a bit. So now he know what to look for in his next co-op. He plans on at least 2 co ops, maybe 3. The kids coming out of NEU are very well prepared for the workforce and should have an easy time finding a job. His advising has been excellent, he meets with then regularly.
NEU is not really traditional though. You need to have a kid that likes to mix things up and not be emotionally upset when things change. The kids will all have different school/co-op schedules. The kids are probably not going to eat lunch in the same cafeteria with the same kids for 4 years in a row, it’s more like roll with who is around at the time. So their friend group ebbs and flows. My son doesn’t mind this, in fact he didn’t like the idea of being stuck on a campus for 4 years and dealing with the same old people every day for 4 years. It’s a good way for the kids to branch out and meet new people and try new things.But they have to want to do that. My other son at a Nescac school didn’t like that aspect, of NEU he wanted the campus and smaller feel.
I personally know about a dozen kids at NEU right now and they all seem to be doing well and enjoying themselves.
I understand why some might think that the URichmond campus looks too perfect.
Regarding diversity, we don’t have to guess what it is at a given school, or rely on perceptions…we can easily find this data.
Looking at each school’s 2018/19 CDS (B2, total ug population), WFU has a significantly higher proportion of white, non hispanics (69%) than does Richmond (57%). Said differently, Richmond has 38% more non-whites than WFU (43% vs. 31%)…again, based on a percentage basis, not absolute numbers as WFU has 2K more ug students.
WFU students also have less socioeconomic diversity than Richmond, per the NY Times 2017 analysis (unfortunately that’s the most recent).
WFU: 21.7% students from top 1% income, 17% from bottom 60%
Richmond: 15.1% from top 1%, 20.6% from bottom 60%
WFU should probably be your daughter’s top choice as it is standardized test optional and your daughter has outstanding grades–if I recall correctly–and is willing to be full pay. However, we do not know your daughter’s ACT score so maybe test optional is not relevant.
Lehigh/Lafayette do draw a lot of kids from NJ/NY/PA. But while Wake may have more geographic diversity, it does tend to be eastern seaboard diversity. I having a lot of geo diversity is really only achieved at the very top tier schools
I wrote based on our one visit…which I stated was subjective. As I mentioned…the lack of diversity on campus on that particular day was so noticeable that it prompted questions from a parent. This was a few years ago and it’s very possible things have changed.
Lehigh is trying to increase geographic diversity. At our local event we were put into groups (parents as well) and given applications to read. It was our job to admit, reject, or defer. We spoke about all of this afterwards and were told that preference is given to those not from NY-NJ-Pa…other things being equal.
I’m not sure if you’ve seen it yet, but Richmond offers a geographical distribution map of its students. If you enlarge it, you’ll see the home town for all of its first-years.