Not saying that teaching at H cannot “excellent” (however defined), but there is a huuuuuge difference in focus between a major research Uni and a LAC.
IMO, students who desire a LAC-like experience should not be applying to Harvard or Stanford…
Dartmouth is about 67%; Brown about 70%; and Harvard, about 32% undergrad. I don’t think that means that you don’t get an outstanding undergraduate education at Harvard, but I think it does mean that Dartmouth and Brown are more undergrad-focused, overall, than Harvard is.
In some ways, I actually think the presence of grad students in classes can rub off positively on the undergrads sharing that space. But if we’re talking about elite universities that are most like LACs, I think the most obvious stat is % of all students who are undergrads.
And in that regard, Dartmouth, Brown, Princeton, and Cornell are all at least 65% undergrad. The other Ivies and Stanford/MIT/Chicago are all under 50%.
@ricka8 I’m surprised you say that because I’ve heard many others say that the undergrad teaching at Harvard (and Brown, etc.) is excellent, as good as it is at top LAC schools like Amherst. Do you know this firsthand?
Well, Harvard itself certainly doesn’t believe that. Read this article from the New York Times a few years back.
"Harvard Task Force Calls for New Focus on Teaching and Not Just Research
“It’s well known that there are many other colleges where students are much more satisfied with their academic experience,” said Paul Buttenwieser, a psychiatrist and author who is a member of the Harvard Board of Overseers, and who favors the report. “Amherst is always pointed to. Harvard should be as great at teaching as Amherst.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/10/education/10harvard.html?_r=0
And for what it is worth, Amherst is also the most racially and economically diverse of all the elite private universities and LACs.
Another view. Reliable sources (current Harvard sophomore and long time Harvard faculty member with child at Harvard) report that undergraduates are often left to their own devices. Many Professors do not show a strong interest in teaching undergraduates. Again only two views so are them for what they are worth.
The question I think you need to ask when looking at colleges in terms of undergraduate education is how many classes are taught by grad students rather than professors. Not saying that grad students can’t be good teachers. My kid is one. But it’s not the same, and Dartmouth has always had an edge there in terms of the relationship between students and professors.
Hi, there, I know I’m a little late to the party, but I’m a Dartmouth '20 and thought I could give you some insight into life here that might help you decide whether or not you want to submit an application.
What drew me to Dartmouth (and reassured me that it was right for me after I got here) were the people. The professors are always willing to interact with Freshmen. All of mine are eclectic, lovable characters who share their passion with the class on a daily basis. The kids in my classes are opinionated and committed to seeing the issues they care about resolved.
There are, as at any college, dorm parties, hook-ups, etc., but it’s not as if that’s the campus culture. I feel accepted for who I am, and I’m not really into that sort of thing.