<p>I realize the 15,000 are not regular expenses. As I understand from your post, your dad goes to the hospital an average of one time per year, and that visit totals 15,000 dollars in medical costs. I was just explaining that other families who can obtain medical insurance, but are required to pay out of their pockets for it, b/c their employer is not paying for it, are also paying a similar dollar amount for medical care (in premiums, deductibles, copays) even though they may, or may not go to the hospital in a given year.</p>
<p>I do not think that FAFSA accounts for private school tuition (I just did my FAFSA and there was no questions regarding that -- just how many in the family were going to college).</p>
<p>It may affect your EFC that last year, but it is hard to tell how much -- my guess is that it won't be that significant. If they calculate that you can pay 59,000 for one student, the best you could expect would be EFC's of $30,000 per student. My guess is that it would be more like $40,000 per student or a little less -- and most likely any financial aid offered would be in the form of loans.</p>
<p>wish I could help more!</p>
<p>2010 - First of all, congratulations on your acceptance to Brown. Outstanding! And since you were accepted ED you're going, as your family income is in the top 2% nationally. I applaud your efforts to help the family finance your education, but option #1 is loans. In time you may be successful obtaining some scholarship or merit or need-based funding, but it's likely that loans will comprise some of your financing. So start checking the possibilities there. JMHO.</p>
<p>Even if OP were to get outside loans, Brown would not reduce his EFC.</p>
<p>Receiving outside scholarships and tuition benefits is an excellent way to help reduce your need to work and/or borrow student loans while at Brown. **Keep in mind that federal regulations stipulate that an outside scholarship cannot be used to reduce your family's expected contribution.* When you receive an outside scholarship, our office is required to reevaluate your financial aid package and account for the additional resource. *</p>
<p>Each student is expected to make a contribution to their academic year costs through borrowing a loan, working during the academic year, and/or contributing from their summer earnings. **Outside scholarships cannot replace your entire expected contribution. Therefore, when you reduce the components of your package listed above, you cannot reduce the entire student expectation, or what we call self-help (loans, work-study and summer earnings). A minimum expectation is set for all students.** </p>
<p>Yes, they would, if he's not getting a package.</p>
<p>a lot of information is getting thrown around really quick so i'll try to see if i understand everything. </p>
<p>if i were to get loans that would reduce my EFC score?</p>
<p>will brown give me loans, or will they just set me up with a bank that will give me loans? further, will the loans arranged by brown have less interest than that loans from banks around here?</p>
<p>sorry if i'm a bit lost.</p>
<p>Loans will not reduce your EFC score, but if you're not getting a package, they'll reduce what you have to pay.</p>
<p>Basically, your EFC says you're not getting any money, they think you can pay full fare, so loans are a way of helping you meet the EFC, if you can get them (maybe your parents can take out Parent loans, too?)</p>
<p>From what I understand, EFC is what a college estimates a family can contribute toward their child's education, based on reported income (and expenses). It does not matter whether the contribution comes from existing savings, annual income, loans or some other source, such as outside scholarships. It is usually expected that the family, not the student, will take out loans. Some of the loans can be arranged through the college (and the student will be expected to work to pay back some of it) and some can be borrowed from outside sources. f you want to learn more about financial aid--including different types of loans, go the financial aid and scholarship board.</p>
<p>Congratulations on getting into Brown, it is a great school. You and your parents need to have another heart to heart talk. Involve your folks in the financial aid conversation with Brown. I can't pretend to understand your parent's situation, I would think they would have to spend quite a bit more money before the financial aid improved much. You should discuss with Brown the possibility of your backing out on an ED agreement. It may impact where you can go. Your commitment to an ED was a legal commitment and you should know what that implies. You may have to decide whether you are going to borrow money or go to a more affordable school. </p>
<p>I am sorry you got into this problem. Parents and students need to have heart to heart talks about finance, and to do a fafsa early on just to know what they can expect.</p>
<p>Future Applicants watch out for ED if financial aid is a consideration.</p>
<p>We all have to remember , and I think we do, that the OP is a student who has probably never filled out a binding contractual agreement in their life. Certainly not one obligating them to make a $180,000 purchase. While the words are simple in most ED agreements I have seen, the financial concepts are not as simple. That is certainly the case if the student is naively unaware of the family's financial situation as was obviously the case with the OP .</p>
<p>That is why even for students above 18 I believe parents still have to sign the ED agreement form at all colleges. Explain the ramifications to your parents. Explain to them that someone your age is unlikely to be able to borrow but a fraction of what you need , without proven credit, income, or collateral. I would think your best hope is to have your parents execute a parent PLUS loan , and you agree contractually to pay the loan for them. In addition, summer employment and work-study should be maximized by you to try to keeep the numbers under control (doesn't have to be Federal work-study, most campuses have both). </p>
<p>So, it looks like this. COA of let's say $45K, with parents ante-ing up $20K. Leaves $25K but that's for spending money, books, everything. If you have a car tell them to sell it. The insurance savings alone if D did that would save me $1500 a year if she was out of the house. Maybe they would be willing to give you that $1,500 (if that's your situation. D is willing to at our house.).</p>
<p>You can reasonably earn $2500 a summer. You can take out $2625 freshman year and more in later years of unsub Stafford loans. There may be Brown specific loan plans that you can sign without your parents. Most schools have a tuition payment plan which lets parents pay monthly through a third party. They may like that a little better. You should be able to make $2000 in w/s without killing your studies, and if it is in a lab you like it may even be a great thing. So if you have that added to your folks high number you have access to $8625 + $20K leaving you short about $16,375 maybe less if the summer job or the W/s is better .The Stafford amount goes up each year. Of course, so does the costs. </p>
<p>Negotiate with your folks. Find out what the payments would be on the PLUS loan. Show them how you would pay for it. Be willing to sign a legally binding document with your parents. Explain what YOU are willing to sacrifice for this opportunity. Approach it as an adult would, not as a lark. I know you are willing to take out loans, but are you willing to sell your car (if you have one) , work full-time over Holiday breaks, and summers ? In other words, being willing to sign your name is not that impressive, being willing to sacrifice niceties and work hard for this incredible privilege is far more persuasive.</p>
<p>I have no magic pill for you but if anything will work, I'd say this is the way to find it. Good luck, and I empathize. You had help getting here.</p>
<p>P.S. If you feel they are wanting to go with you , playing with the bait but you can't get them to bite, then offer up the "one year" idea. "I know you are worried if I can hack it, Mom and Dad but give me one year to prove it. If I don't live up to my end , yank the deal. You are risking X for one year."</p>
<p>The biggest problem I see is that if negotiations do not work out with parents, the OP has no alternative. I'm assuming that s/he has not applied elsewhere--and would need to get out of the binding ED agreement in order to do so, and it is now too late for most other schools.</p>
<p>This is why college applications are a joint enterprise for student AND parents. Parents can be overinvolved; but uninvolved parents who allow their child to apply ED only to tell the child once acceptance is in that they can only for up $20k are totally irresponsible. What should have been a joyous occasion--getting into one of the most selective colleges in the US--is turning into a major debacle.</p>
<p>Just two small caveats to some of the great advice here:</p>
<p>1--it's a myth that parents always had to sign some kind of binding agreement before the student gets in ED--I signed nothing until after my S got has ED acceptance.</p>
<p>2--Workstudy usually only goes to student who get FA. There are sometimes other jobs available on campus, but they are generally the lowest rung ones, like cafeteria work (totally honorable work, but not as fun as the research jobs or as easy as the check IDs at the desk jobs that are available with workstudy.)</p>
<p>2010 College, take a deep breath and don't panic. I suggest that you call Brown and talk to the Admissions office to explain your situation in detail. This will allow them to ask you questions which they feel might be necessary to adequately evaluate your particular situation. You may want to have your parents on hand to answer questions more completely.</p>
<p>They may request some documentation about the medical expenses and past history, MSA's etc.</p>
<p>Any advice you get here is merely conjecture and far less reliable than speaking directly with the people at Brown. In addition taking the initiative in this way will demonstrate your desire to attend Browm and give them an idea of the sacrifices you may be willing to take to attend, ie taking on additional loans, campus jobs, etc.</p>
<p>Good luck.</p>
<p>another possibility -- although it is most likely not what the OP wants to do, it might be better than nothing.</p>
<p>Talk to brown about deferring your entrance for a year and do this for that year: work at a job or two and save money while at the same time, talk to your parents and see if they would add the $15000-20000 they would have spent this next year on your college to your "college fund" in addition to the $15000-20000 for the four years (in other words, provide you with the $15000-$20000 for five years).</p>
<p>that would give you another $15000-$20000 (from your parents) plus approx $20,000 from working (if you worked 60 hours a week for both summers and the whole year -- alot of working, but it can and is done all the time). with the total college bill at ~$160000, this method brings down the amount you are short to ~$40,000 -- which might be doable with alternative student loans, small academic scholarships you might qualify for and working while going to school.</p>
<p>It is just a thought and most likely a better alternative to not going to Brown or any other school where deadlines have passed.</p>
<p>Also, you parents may change their minds with a heartfelt talk and a demonstrated commitment on your part to work over the summers and while going to school. With an income like that, there is money there -- that is why the EFC is so high. When your sister goes to school, it is likely that they will be expected to pay approximately the same EFC, ~59,000. See if they will pay the $20,000 that they will be paying for your sister's school for the next three years until she goes.</p>
<p>Just a few thoughts -- definitely let us know how it works out -- we are all hoping for the best for you!</p>
<p>Have you looked at ROTC?</p>
<p>rotc is a great idea -- the national security administration also offers a four year scholarship in return for service. also, joining the national guard or reserves is another possibility.</p>
<p>You can make this work, you just have to be willing to go outside your comfort zone and work hard to make it happen. (plus, there is every possibility that given the choice between paying for you to go to school and having you join the army, your parents will pay the money).</p>
<p>2010college, You will be able to count your sister as a college student your senior year, which should be a help to you. </p>
<p>As other posters have said, it may pay to call Brown. Too bad they are closed today, I have a question I would like to ask them, too!! :)</p>
<p>We noted when we got S1's package last year that it was a good bit less lovely than other schools. They stated that they had not yet taken into account the medical costs, which include out of pocket insurance, deductibles, and dental. It did help us (a little) when they factored this in. Our costs were about 1/2 of yours.</p>
<p>2010college, first, congratulations on your admission to Brown! You and your parents should be very proud! </p>
<p>However, you are indeed in a difficult situation because you AND your parents made the commitment already to attend Brown should you be accepted ED, despite the financial risk. That's what ED is all about and your parents knew (or should have known) this when you applied. On these boards, students and parents have been advised OVER and over again about making SURE they can afford the school if they are accepted. Ignorance is no excuse. Your parents now have an obligation which they will have a VERY difficult time getting out of without consequence to you and a detrimental effect to your college acceptances elsewhere. If they absolutely refuse to pay more than they tell you and Brown absolutely thinks you have no financial need, you and your parents are obligated to show Brown that you cannot pay more (not that you (they) don't want to pay more, but that they categorically cannot pay more). This will need to be documented in detail to the Brown financial aid office. Only if Brown accepts your parents' explanation AND refuses to come up with the $$$ to fill the aid gap do you have recourse to get out of this binding contract. If Brown declines to release you from this agreement, then you either must go there or, possibly, go nowhere else. Brown releases their list of ED accepted students to the other colleges who promptly remove you from their application files. So other colleges KNOW you've been accepted to Brown AND that you are obligated to go. The world of college admissions is smaller than you think and very well linked. They know which students/parents renege on their agreements and pass this information around. It could adversely affect your chance of being accepted at all to other colleges. Your parents need to have a VERY clear understanding of this.</p>
<p>sorry it has taken me awhile to respond, but school just started back up.</p>
<p>maybe if i give a bit more information it will help to eliminate some of these ideas. working during the school year is not an option because i will be playing a varsity sport for two different seasons. granted i was not a recruited athlete (could have been, but didnt want the obligation for four years) but coaches in both sports have guaranteed me a spot on the teams. now for a buch of little answers.</p>
<p>pulling out of the ED agreement is definitely not going to happen. that may sound hard headed, but as some have said it is a great honor to get into a school like brown, and despite some financial hardships i may be facing it is definitely where i will be.</p>
<p>someone recommended selling my car. wish i could do that but my sister starts driving full time right after i leave so it doesnt work out. however i will be taken down to a part time driver on my insurance so that does save ~$1000.</p>
<p>as for summer working i have a pretty nice job and should make $3500. my parents have already indicated that the money i make over the summer will be the only money i have for extra spending money during the school year, so that takes care of part of the problem. plus i have a little bit saved in an account.</p>
<p>we have already looked at the parent plus loans and that is a viable option. </p>
<p>someone mentioned an academic scholarship---those dont exist at the ivies because unfortunately everyone would qualify.</p>
<p>thanks for all of the help everyone has been extremely helpful. i am probably going to start a new thread to see of there are any people on the site that have similar incomes, go to similar costing schools, and how they have managed.</p>
<p>Just a question from someone who never applied ED...What can they really do if you breach the ED contract? I find it difficult to believe they're going to haul you to court or anything like that.</p>