<p>A good portion of Amherst students do not drink. I think Amherst, culturally, lies somewhere between Williams and Swarthmore. </p>
<p>Also, Williams boasts a lot about their tutorials (which I hear are fantastic) but Amherst allows you to do something similar, with topics of your own choice. All you need is approval and a faculty member on board.</p>
<p>^^ I’m with you all the way politically, redknight. I choose to abstain, but that doesn’t mean everyone else should be forced to as well.</p>
<p>For now I’ve added Amherst and Midd back; and I feel stronger in preferring Swarthmore because so many people say it fits me, so I’ll take the academic risk of burnout. Thank you for the comment, unregistered; I had the same gut feeling about Amherst being more moderate than Williams in terms of campus culture, but no anecdote/evidence to back it up until now. Midd fits me well academically, plus both A and M offer sub-free housing.</p>
<p>Keilexandra, here are some thoughts on HC vs. Midd. I’ll concede that Midd has great languages. But, Haverford has great English as well as linguistics and creative writing (through BMC).</p>
<p>The cooperative relationship with BMC is a real strength. There are more than 3500 cross registrations between the two schools each year. So, it’s part of the culture and common for students to do so. They are so close that the bus ride is never a burden.</p>
<p>Also, you mentioned financial considerations are an issue, Haverford is far more generous. HC is need-blind, guarantees to meet 100% of need, and is no-loan. HC is among a small handful of schools in the country with this level of aid which is the most generous in the U.S. (even several Ivys haven’t made that kind of commitment to financial aid). Midd’s program hasn’t gone that far.</p>
<p>I’m sure that students are nice/smart at both schools. But, IMHO, Midd students are more preppy/oudoorsy/athletic vs. Haverford’s more quirky, intellectual, left. For example, in terms of Ph.D production, Haverford far outperforms Midd. Of LACs, Haverford is ranked #4 in Ph.D. production in the all sciences combined, but Midd is #40. (By the way, Swarthmore is #3, Williams #7, Amherst #10, Oberlin #12, Vassar #16, Bryn Mawr #18, I include this to show that your other top schools are clustered closer together near the top). Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying Midd isn’t a great school as well, but I think these figures might tell you something about the envrionment and type of students there. </p>
<p>If you think Vassar, Beloit, and Swarthmore speak to you, Haverford’s personality is closer to that mode.</p>
<p>Also, the Honor Code and Quaker values are really unique and help create an unparalled sense of community.</p>
<p>Since you are so close to HC, I would go visit rather than stress to death. If you visit and love it, great. I know people who have turned down offers from Brown, Amherst, Swarthmore, UPenn, and plenty of other places after the visit to HC. If you visit and don’t care for it, go with Midd. But I think Haverford definitely seems like a better fit.</p>
<p>^ Thanks for the comment, pointoforder. My thoughts: While I like the -idea- of Bi-Co, I am (shallowly) worried about the impact on social life. If the two schools are close enough for the shuttle to never be a burden, then the m:f ratio is ~1:3. FA is definitely a tip in Haverford’s favor, though.</p>
<p>Not sure where you found the Ph.D production numbers–might you post another comparison using Ph.D production in the humanities, rather than the sciences? I get the impression that Haverford is stronger in science than the humanities (excluding Bryn Mawr’s resources, unfair as that may be).</p>
<p>But yes, I think I definitely need to go visit Swat, Haverford, and BMC.</p>
<p>^ Oh, I was going to say something about that in my original post, but I forgot. When you visit and talk to Haverford women they actually say that they don’t feel competitive with BMC women. Polls show HC women like the bi-co relationship as much as HC men. The relationship is actually pretty healthy (rather than dysfunctional). For social life, HC students (both M & F) focus on HC. The bi-co ties are still super strong academically, but not as strong for social (compared to the days when the schools were both single sex). It’s an understandable worry, but not really one in reality.</p>
<p>Haverford definitely has great (uniquely strong) sciences, but also very, very strong social sciences and humantities as well. By the way, interesting fact for a budding creative writer…the founding director of the Iowa Writers Workshop was a Haverford alumnus! I’ll try to pull up the PhD rankings for you tomorrow. </p>
<p>FYI, social sciences/humanities majors I know went on to Harvard Law, Harvard Kennedy, Harvard Business, Yale PhD, Johns Hopkins Med, Berkeley Business, UPenn Ph.D., etc.</p>
<p>Did you ever check out these short videos?</p>
<p>[Haverford</a> College Office of Admission: Admission Videos](<a href=“http://www.haverford.edu/admission/videos/]Haverford”>http://www.haverford.edu/admission/videos/)</p>
<p>I think they actually do a really good job of giving you a taste of what the College is all about.</p>
<p>You go to CSoW, dont you :P</p>
<p>You ask and you shall receive… Even in looking at the humanities, the HC vs. Midd figures are the same. (I think this also shows that the Humanities at Haverford are very strong.) According to NSF data, LACs rank by per capita Ph.D production in the humanities demonstrate Haverford is ranked #5 compared to Middlebury at #23. </p>
<p>(In case you’re curious the other schools on your list rank as follows: Swarthmore #1, Oberlin #2, Bryn Mawr #8, Amherst #11, Williams #12, Pomona #15, Vassar #17, Macalester #21, and Beloit #40). As others have noted on these forums, the precise rankings aren’t particularly meaningful (just as the U.S. News rankings aren’t as precise or meaningful as they would lead you to believe), but the general placement might be one piece of data to think about. </p>
<p>If I were you, I’d probably keep both schools on your list a bit longer. Do a little visiting and reevaluate.</p>
<p>^^^ So, I guess that eliminates Bryn Mawr. XD But yes, for the time I’m keeping Haverford and Middlebury both, at least until I can visit Haverford.</p>
<p>The biggest difference between Haverford and Middlebury is the size of the student body. Your experience at a college with 1,169 students will be quite different from your experience at one with 2,500 students.</p>
<p>You’re starting junior year, right? I think you should keep your list broad for now. Ideally, your math SAT would go up a little (since you took them in 8th grade, that does seem likely). Frankly, I think you need to pick a better safety-- one you would really like-- and then focus on your low-reach schools. </p>
<p>So, frankly, I’m going to suggest some schools because a lot will change in a year and it may be easier to find what you like if you leave yourself more choices. </p>
<p>I think Bowdoin would be a good low reach, especially because it’s no loans. If you are willing to go to an all-female school, I think Wellesley and Barnard might be good choices. Another good low reach (although larger than what you want) would be U Chicago. If you like Pomona, you might like Claremont McKenna. And Yale seems quite a bit larger than what you want so I would think of adding Dartmouth or Wesleyan (very different atmospheres there but excellent schools). You might also like College of William and Mary but I’m not sure how finances would work out. Make sure your reaches schools meet full need (as they calculate it) because I really think you’ll get into a few and you want to choose from places which you can afford. </p>
<p>I want to make sure you realize that these schools will all come up with different EFCs. Most do not use the FAFSA EFC so you have to go by the institutional calculators. I’m pointing this out because if the institutional aid estimates are high (because of savings or house equity), you might want to look for safeties with good merit aid.</p>
<p>^ Thank you for the suggestions, 2collegewego, although I have ruled all of them out for good reasons. I had hoped that my math SAT would go up, as well, but my PSAT seems to indicate that the improvement will be slight. I do have two “real” safeties (excluding UDel) that I really like–Beloit and the University of Rochester.</p>
<p>Bowdoin, CMC, and UChicago are not good fits academically for me; Dartmouth is even further extreme than Williams/Midd in culture; I have visited Wes and it failed to click, so to speak, while the exact opposite happened at Yale. And I’ve avoided W&M because for a comparable school, I’d be better off at a private with more generous aid.</p>
<p>Not to disdain your suggestions, as it is good advice overall; in this case, I think I just spend way too much time on CC and on college research in general.</p>