Hi all,
I was looking at the Brown financial aid page and I noticed something that made my stomach drop - Brown takes into account your non-custodial parent’s income?? My parents divorced when I was a baby and now my father has a very high-paying job, but he hasn’t contributed anything to us and will not be helping pay for my college. I’m already sitting on the edge of qualifying for financial aid. My mom makes about 150K and when we did the financial aid calculator, we got a reasonable amount, but that was just with my mom’s income. But we just found out that the loan we were going to try to get doesn’t apply to out of state schools, so now we’re fighting over whether or not I should still apply ED. There has to be good loans for out of state, right?
If my dad’s income is calculated when Brown determines what aid I will get, I won’t get anything, even though he won’t help pay. He makes considerably more than my mom. So if this is the case, I won’t be able to apply to Brown because my mom and I won’t be able to afford it. I don’t make near enough working to even make a dent.
And if this applies to other schools I’m interested in (Hopkins, Brandeis) I won’t be able to afford going out of state. I may not even be able to afford private schools in my own state. My older brother already is at an expensive in state private, so being the youngest, I automatically get the short end of the stick.
So is this true, or am I just reading it wrong? I don’t think it’s fair that a person who will not help pay for my college and who hasn’t had any impact on my life should have influence over whether or not I get aid. That just feels like I’m being punished for their divorce. Also, do you guys know of anywhere to look for good out of state loans? Thanks
This is true. It is true for every selective school – so that means every Ivy and MIT and Stanford and Williams, etc. – and yes, Hopkins and Brandeis, too. These schools believe that both parents hold primary responsibility to pay for college. I understand how you feel but it’s the same rule for all kids from divorced families. (This is why many divorce agreements are very specific about how much each parent pays for college.)
Students in your situation – who have the stats to apply to Brown – typically go after hefty merit awards. I urge you to look in the financial aid forum to learn about colleges that give merit for high SATs and GPA. Your other option is to ask your mother what she can afford to pay, and go to a college that costs that amount. That would most likely be your state flagship, but there are lower-cost private schools too.
There is no such thing as “out of state loans.” There are student loans you get from the federal government and student loans you get from other places, and they apply to whatever college you go to. You’re making a distinction between in-state private and out-of-state private that doesn’t exist.
@fireandrain Well it was the answer I was expecting, but dang it still hurts. And thanks for explaining the loan thing - still trying to figure the whole thing out.
I guess that’s just how this process has always worked, so there isn’t really anything I can do to change that. Now not only do I have to give up my dream school, but Hopkins and Brandeis, too. Wow, this sucks.
Spend some time browsing in the financial aid forum. You’ll understand the process much better, and you’ll see that you are not alone – many students cannot apply to their top choices because they can’t afford them. There are many great schools out there, including ones that will give you nice merit awards. It’s so much better that you know this now – many of those schools require that you apply early to get the merit. So start doing your research ASAP.
There are some CSS Profile schools that o not collect NCP info. Ask the fin’l aid forum ot likely the college board lists them on the profile website. FAFSA only schools do not.
I recall that Chicago recently stopped asking for NCP info. Darmouth limits the amount asked for.
There is no loan I have heard of that differentiates OOS private schools. You have access to Parent Plus and any number of private loans like Sallie Mae etc. But taking a large amount of debt for undergrad is not smart.
This is heartbreaking. In my situation (the opposite of yours), I am custodial, with the higher income and NCP, with the lower income, did not contribute meaningfully. But, to be fair to colleges, it is the NCP that is punishing you, not the school. I do think that, in some circumstances, if you make your case to Financial Aid, they might be flexible, but I’m not sure what those circumstances are.
"There are some CSS Profile schools that do not collect NCP info. "
Oops. Sorry, I didn’t know that.
“But, to be fair to colleges, it is the NCP that is punishing you, not the school.”
I agree with this. Why should colleges aid and abet irresponsible parents, take them off the hook for supporting their children? If your father earns a good salary, he should use some of it to support his kids.
@GMTplus7 my brother goes to a school that gives a lot of merit scholarships and he’s also an athlete there.
And thanks @bonenz and @fireandrain for the support. I don’t really blame Brown, because it’s not like their policy is directly targeted at me. Guess I just wasn’t dealt a good hand
It really hurts, but I guess I’ll just have to get over it. I actually just got a second job today that pays okay, so maybe with a 500000% raise it’ll happen
I just hope that all the kids that end up being able to go to Brown don’t take it for granted. That’ll make me feel worse.
@bwulv24, my younger son, who graduated from high school last year, was deferred from brown Ed but nominated for a full ride at USC. We visited LA & loved both UCLA & USC. Two gorgeous schools in an interesting city that offers fabulous internships. For the USC merit awards, you simply apply by dec 1. No special, extra application, as WUSTL has. If you get it, the award is more than just financial…you’ll be in their honors college, which comes with all sorts of academic & living perks. Also, if you’re a finalist – and if you’re a viable candidate for brown, you’re likely to be a finalist for either their full or half tuition awards – they will pay for you to fly to LA and visit for a weekend to interview. And, you’ll know you’ve been accepted by late January/ early feb. It makes waiting for all your other college notifications less stressful.
My heart breaks that you are unlikely to afford brown (which is what motivates my husband and me to donate as much as we can every year bc my own husband attended brown with a huge financial aid package), but I will tell you that once you arrive at college & get involved, you are very likely to be happy. Brown was my son2’s first choice, and he saw how much his older brother loved it there, but he opted to apply ed2 elsewhere bc he felt that his grades just weren’t high enough. Nevertheless, he had a terrific first year of college. It’s ok to be redirected. You will get over it & you can create your happiness and develop your academic chops elsewhere. You, especially, sound very sincere and worthy. I wish you all the best. Let us know how it all turns out.
Thanks to you all. We’re going over the numbers again, and it looks like I may be able to apply. It’s an extremely slim chance, and likely just a pipe dream, but it’s still something. I do have a question that’s been nagging at me - is the financial aid package you’re presented with if you’re accepted ED just the money that Brown will give you, or does it include federal aid, too? Sorry if this is a dumb question, I’m just trying to understand how all this works.
Also, for admissions purposes, will colleges say the income bracket I’m in is from my mothers income only or both? If they combine my mother and fathers’ income I’ll definitely be viewed as if I had unlimited opportunities (which is definitely not the case). I know at selective colleges for fin aid they take both incomes, but what about for your income bracket in admissions?
The only federal aid for someone whose mom earns $150,000 are unsubsidized loans. You don’t qualify for Pell Grants.
I don’t understand your second question, about income brackets. Colleges base financial aid on income (of both parents and you, the student) and assets (of both parents and you, the student). And BTW – if parents remarried, the stepparents’ income is also considered. Your “income bracket” is not relevant.
Oh, do you mean will the admissions officers base their admissions decision on the fact you are in the 1% or the 5% for income? (Because your mom’s income puts you in a very rarified environment, I hope you realize.) Brown and most schools are need-blind – which means they accept you unaware of your financial need. Now, do they consider your “income bracket” – i.e., do they make distinctions between someone who is rich and someone who is poor? Yes. They recognize the advantages that come from affluence and factor that into decisions. Chances are you don’t live in a slum, aren’t dodging bullets and gangs on the way to school, aren’t working a job to pay for food and aren’t helping to raise your siblings. Chances are you live in a nice suburb and have an educated mom who helps you with homework and provides a safe and comfortable home environment. Your dad’s income is irrelevant to that.
I think it’s great that you are trying to educate yourself about financial aid. Again, I urge you to spend time in the financial aid forum – there are multiple threads where people ask, and get answers, on basic questions.
Yes the Brown package estimate will include federal aid. The CSS Profile info gives them all the data they would need to estimate that accurately. But you don’t qualify for federal grants. You would get work/study and your student loan (5.5k freshman year). If the loan isn’t in the package that’s what you will be able to take. I really don’t think you should ED you really ought to compare financial packages of schools you get in. You may have to accept or reject Brown without knowing what you will get elsewhere. Look at the list I gave there are some good schools that don’t collect NCP like Oberlin.
You are trrying to say your brother already goes to an expensive school, then you turn around and try to say it doesn’t cost him much. So which is it? But remember when he graduates your cost for Brown and any other school goes way way up. So run the NCP with one in school then with none in school and less family members too.
Need blind colleges do not look at your income at all. And you are already in the income bracket where you are considered privileged.
@BrownParent Sorry, I probably should have been clearer. I didn’t say it didn’t cost him much, just that it took away some of the cost, but it’s still expensive. My brother didn’t qualify for a good number of those merit scholarships, but he still got enough to make it affordable. Expensive, yes, but reasonable. And he doesn’t get a scholarships for athletics there. Poor wording on my part.
I just wanted to mention that someone in the Brown CO 2019 group said that they were able to appeal their financial aid via the CSS non-custodial parent waiver, which they said could be used under certain extenuating circumstances. I don’t know the details of that at all, but it made me think of this thread. It might be worth looking into!
There is a form for a Non Custodial parent waiver. My daughter received one but the circumstances matter and it is a different situation. You can try but this situation, not sure.
“I guess that’s just how this process has always worked, so there isn’t really anything I can do to change that. Now not only do I have to give up my dream school, but Hopkins and Brandeis, too. Wow, this sucks.”
Are you sure you don’t even want to consider student loans from different avenues?
One of my friends at Brown who has divorced parents was able to just use the custodial parent’s financials because the NCP sent a letter to Brown stating she refuses to send in her financial information because she doesn’t want to be part of my friend’s life. If your NCP is very removed from your life, you can possibly go this route.
