<p>That could very well be true, our out of pocket costs would be higher for Michigan than the schools S1 and S2 chose BECAUSE they received ‘merit’ money for their GPA/Test scores and in their cases probably alittle bit because of geographic diversity. If S3 gets accepted (and decides to attend) Uof M in 2013 we will pay more per anum for UofM although he would be the only kiddo staying “in-state” and attending at an in-state public…if you have kids in a state with high cost publics…the wisdom of “applying to your flagship as a financial safety” might not be true.</p>
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You are confusing my two kids as my daughter did not have high stats.</p>
<p>^^
Did you ask for a FA review to find out why the CSS determined EFC was so much higher than FAFSA EFC? If so, what were you told? If not, why not?</p>
<p>From an instate comparison, I believe both Oakland and Wayne State provide better scholarships (at least from a merit perspective). </p>
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<p>Well, yeah. They are fighting tooth & nail to get the UM-quality students. UM already has them, whether or not they give them merit scholarships.</p>
<p>I have never heard of UM as “generous” in my not-rich-but-not-poor circle. I do know that is is for lower income students. If you are lower income and did not get an aid package that you feel is acceptable, you need to talk to a financial aid officer. You might not feel any better after your conversation, but at least you will understand the reasoning.</p>
<p>Just a thought … if the ducks aren’t in a row before the priorty date (FAFSA on file, good EFC, verification complete) you can lose out on aid you might otherwise receive.</p>
<p>Unless UMich made some really odd error, I can’t help but wonder if UMich refused to use the typical 60/60 split with the OP’s D if the school knew that the son was attending Yale on a full/near full ride???</p>
<p>Kdog, does UMD list PLUS loans as financial aid to meet their defined need? That is a “trick” that many schools use. I say, a “trick” because PLUS is not aid to the student, nor is it even an award. It’s just something that MIGHT be availabe for a parent if s/he is credit worthy. It rankles me when I see that listed as part of a financial aid package in the exact amount that the school deems the family has to pay as though it were an award.</p>
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Again, we only had the PLUS her first year and no, they did not list the PLUS loan. They only listed the Stafford and Perkins and grants leaving the $11,000 gap. </p>
<p>I think this thread has digressed from it’s intended topic. The OP wanted to know if U-M was stingy. Certain posters believe it is “very generous” whereas I would not use that term and defer to my earlier summation. I do not want to continue to monopolize this thread and will end my discussion on the topic.</p>
<p>Kdog, I think one reason why the discussion continued is because there are these open questions about whether you asked for a review, and if you did, what reasons were given for the aid… Since you’ve skipped over those questions that suggests that you know why your D’s aid was less than you expected.</p>
<p>Since many CSS schools ask for the FA info about siblings attending college, I could understand that a school like UMich might use a different calculation when a sibling is attending a school where the parents’ contribution is little to nothing. Your D’s aid may have been calculated as if one child is in school since your son got sooo much aid. If that’s what’s going on, then when your son graduates, you may not see much change in aid…instead of a significant reduction.</p>
<p>Okay, one last time. I did contact them and they said it was what it was. As you all know they only guarantee to meet aid once EFC is subtracted and can use loans as part of that need. The year that my EFC was highest was two years before my son was even in college (he is only a rising sophomore) so any speculation regarding his financial aid affecting the award is baseless. Let’s assume for a moment that my EFC was $11,000 (as I stated I didn’t save that FAFSA so I can’t say if it was but I believe it may have been around that). What was left was around $11,680 and when the final award was finalized their total grant was $2,180 leaving around $9,500. The remainder was $2500 work study, $5500 Stafford and $500 Perkins loans and $1000 Promise scholarship. The scholarship was rescinded by the government and I had to increase my PLUS to cover the difference. The Stafford was maxed out so the only other option would have been for U-M to increase the grants (which they refused to do).</p>
<p>In looking at their samples I believe they are inaccurate at least from the 2009 award we received. Otherwise the grant would have been more like $5000 with the Stafford a few thousand less. If you all believe that the award is generous that is your prerogative but my belief is unless you are really low EFC (i.e.<$5K) that is not the case.</p>
<p>So you used the PLUS to cover the EFC? </p>
<p>We’ll assume the COA was around 22k (which I believe is what it was-ish when I got my award package for the 09-10 year). 22-11k EFC = 11k so 11k of need. 11000-5500-2500-2180-1000 Promise = around the COA exactly. </p>
<p>So if your EFC was 11k, they met need. You must have used PLUS to cover your EFC. So they, in fact, met your need… you just couldn’t afford your EFC which is often the case for many people with that EFC. </p>
<p>Did I miss something? IMO that is still very generous especially for a public school. </p>
<p>I don’t think this is off topic for the OP. We are discussing whether or not U of M meets need. It seems in your case it did.</p>
<p>I don’t think you monopolized the thread at all, and I think you added valuable information to the topic. Whether there is agreement in your opinion is irrelevant as to the value of your input. </p>
<p>You bring a very important aspect to the definition of “generous” when it comes to any financial award. It is specific to an individual. If UM’s definition of need does not define a person as needy or deem him eligible for as much aid as he needs, all the touting and back patting on how generous UM is, in the scope of things is not going to be one bit relevant or helpful. Such a person may end up not being able to afford this “generous” school, and may even do much better at Wayne State or Eastern Michigan, both schools not defined as universally generous, but that might come up with a lot more money for a specific applicant.</p>
<p>So please, your input is valuable and not OT. </p>
<p>UM is generous in that it does provide more aid, in general, especially for instate residents, but that does not mean in specific cases it is going to be the most generous option. It is a generality. At the end of the day, all that matters is what a school gives YOU. it doesn’t help YOU one bit when the most generous school in th world does not meet your need. </p>
<p>NYU has the reputation of being stingy because it does gap a lot of students and as expensive as it is to go there, it often gaps big time. But I have seen some kids get their most generous packages from NYU. It does happen. They do mix merit and need, and will “buy” the students it most wants. </p>
<p>My son got a “generous” scholarship from a private school, over $30K that still left about that amount to be paid. The schools was still way more expensive and less affordable than State U with no scholarship.</p>
<p>Perspective and individual situation are needed when looking at these things. Before you apply to school, you have to look at the over all stats to deem whether a school is “generous” or not and you have to guess how you will personally fare in getting any awards. After you get the awards, your perspective will be altered by who gave you the money, not how many others got what kind of awards, because you are the only one who matters at that point in time.</p>
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Obviously you missed everything I said. First, I never said they didn’t meet need. I said they met need with loans being a big part of it. Forget the PLUS and my EFC that you seem so hung up on. When that was subtracted, what was left was covered PRIMARILY with loans and work study. Out of around $12,000 they offered a little over $2000 in grants. If you think that is generous then we obviously have two different definitions. Do you NOW understand my point? Also, when the Promise was rescinded I was expected to cover the difference. End of story.</p>
<p>NOTE: The year before I lost my job I had an EFC and income that I would guess is low or the norm for most families ($60-$80K and family of four) applying to U-M. For low EFC families (<$6K) you possibly could use the term generous (not very generous as that would be reserved for HY) but that would be it. For the majority of the families this is not the case.</p>
<p>Yes, to meet need with no more loans than federal loans is generous imo. It’s reasonable to expect a student to invest in his/her own education.</p>
<p>The loss of the promise scholarship is not u of m’s fault. You cannot blame them for that.</p>
<p>I feel misled. I thought kdog’s child had a gap. There was no gap. Student loans are financial aid … every school that does not have a no-loan pledge will tell you that, and the federal government will tell you that.</p>
<p>The Promise scholarship issue is the state’s fault. It’s not like UM could just come up with $1000 for every student whose scholarship was rescinded by the state.</p>
<p>Kdog’s kid’s need was met, and with a reasonable amount of loans ($5500 + $500). End of story.</p>
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I never said they shouldn’t invest in their education. I just don’t think offering $2K out of $12K is generous. After all, that is the federal government and NOT the school offering the loans. Of course, you clearly feel differently so there is no point in trying to convince you. I will say that the examples in the link are exaggerated and if you add the maximum to the loans and subtract that amount from the grants it would be more accurate. There is no way a $3.5K EFC gets $16K in grants or the $13K EFC gets $6K. I would say closer to 50% grants for $3.5K EFC.</p>
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But the generous schools would have. My son’s example is a perfect point where the school picked up the decrease in Pell. That was need beyond my EFC and NOT met by the school. End of story. So kelsmom, that would be a GAP.</p>
<p>I have a question where do the need-based grants come from at UofM? Is it from some endowement or is it a form of institutional aid, like a discount? </p>
<p>If it is the later, I can see how kids get gaped even with the promise to meet the need. If there is no actual money available to fund this, then UofM needs to charge students with higher income more. The more there are students with the need (due to bad economy), the more tuition needs to be raised or the more loans need to be offered. If I recall correctly, UofM is pretty expensive even for instate. This kind of promise of help explains it. Quite frankly, I am not a fan of those grants for instate schools. The need-based grants at instate schools should have merit component in them - IMHO.</p>
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Not to add fuel to the fire, but I am 99% positive UMich DID replace that $1k in our son’s case, and our EFC would be roughly the same as Kdog’s in the first year. However, he had a merit award, and ergo still had room on his Fed loans, so perhaps that was where the replacement came from.</p>
<p>For the OP – If you are in-state, UMich will “make it possible” for you to attend in accordance with your family’s economic ability, using loans, work-study, and in some cases, depending on EFC, federal and institutional grants.</p>
<p>With a COA in the neighborhood of $27,500 this year, that does not mean it will necessarily be your most cost-effective option for school; but for the caliber, it will at least be possible to attend unless your parents are not prepared to contributed their EFC according to the assets they report on the CSS Profile.</p>
<p>So let’s forget about the terms “generous” or “stingy.” </p>
<p>For many, UMich is “not viable.” For in-state students, it is generably “financially viable.”</p>
<p>For the record, my son could have attended elsewhere for less (even with his merit awards, he does rack up the fed loans – and was offered even more at other schools that would have equated to full ride) but he would not trade his experience at UMich for the world.</p>
<p>So if you’re able to attend, enjoy, and Go Blue!</p>
<p>Lerkin, UMich actually has one of the strongest endowments among public schools in the U.S. somewhere in the neighborhood of $7B. It entirely self-funds its grant aid with the proceeds of alumni/endowment.</p>
<p>For some students, I’ve seen it grant even upwards of $20,000 - $30,000 for OOS if the student has something unique that the school is looking for.</p>
<p>In-state, I know other students receiving substantial grants upward of EVERYTHING beyond the $5500 fed, pell, etc.</p>
<p>So on a case-by-case basis, UMich <em>CAN</em> be very “generous” to students both in and out of state; and is generally reasonably (“comparatively”) good at meeting demonstrated need in-state.</p>