Don't knock the B.A.s!

College Majors Musical Theater Major
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<p>Speaking as a current B.A. theatre major/didn't pass the B.F.A. audition student, I have to say and feel I should bring up here that being a B.A. was possibly the best accident of my life.</p>

<p>Yes, I was and probably everyone else on this board is rushing around, trying to find themselves a monologue and practice thier dancing and pull together 32 bars of a song while searching for that perfect school but there's a reality that you may get rejected or that two years down the road, your school may have a sophomore barrier that you get blocked by. Or, you might want to do theatre, but like me, have no Broadway or Hollywood ambitions. </p>

<p>THERE IS MORE TO THEATRE THAN JUST BROADWAY! Or National tours and Equity. The theatre world needs people who will bring theatre to the people: directors, playwrights, theatre educators, actors, technicians, etc.. And being a B.F.A. won't guarantee you anything more than being a B.A. would. </p>

<p>I'm just finishing up my first year as a B.A. theatre student and I wouldn't have traded it for the world. I took acting classes and dance, I built sets, made costumes, was an assistant stage manager, usher, crew for load-ins and strikes, learned filmwork, student blogger, a student actor for the directing class, wrote plays, did workshops, studied stage combat, I worked for our student theatre company, and all-together, was involved somehow in approximently twenty-five shows or filming. I was taught just as much as any B.F.A. freshman and maybe learned more than some of them. </p>

<p>True, I plan to re-audition in the fall (because I lack the ability to choose to not audition. If I get a second chance, I'm going to take it). But I haven't decided if I want to change my major to B.F.A. if accepted. Plenty of B.A.s at my school have been cast in shows or done more out there in the real world than B.F.A.s </p>

<p>Embrace the possibility, of making your own opportunities!</p>

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<p>Well said!!</p>

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<p>We found some BA programs that offer as much professional development as one would expect from a BFA. I mean everything - showcases, hot shot Broadway connections, auditioning/resume classes, intense vocal, acting and dance training - anything you would require or expect from a BFA, some BA courses offer too.</p>

<p>Most of them were in smaller private schools, so although they were not admission by audition (though they did audition for scholarship) the programs aren’t going to have that many kids in them anyway - by which I mean, not too many kids to allow for plenty of individual attention - and all of them that we liked did have a review after freshman year. In these cases, it wasn’t a review to go on to the BFA program because these schools did not offer any BFA. But rather, to assess if the student is progressing - to put it bluntly, (though the schools did put it more tactfully) to let the student know if pursuing MT was perhaps not the best place for their particular talent set and to explore where they might do better. </p>

<p>I like that review idea - after a year or so, if my D isn’t improving and learning I think it would be a huge disservice to continue in that area, anyway. None of these were capped cut programs and they weren’t compared to their peers as in competing for spots to stay in the program or anything - just compared to themselves, basically, and on their own work ethic and such and how they are growing and showing potential. So if there’s someone who is just not serious about it and is dragging the program down, that issue would be addressed, which is good. </p>

<p>D ended up choosing a BA program and without even considering that her electives will be largely MT related, the degree ends up being a fifty fifty split between core and major classes - more than the “typical” BA is thought to be. But that’s my point - so many programs are really not “typical” once you look at them.</p>

<p>Not only is the ratio of classes a huge variance but also the kinds of classes offered. Once you get down and dirty and pour over the catalog and the actual class descriptions, you start to see that there are some BA programs out there whose professional development isn’t different than some BFA’s.</p>

<p>And then there are BA programs for which those things don’t hold true, of course. My D would not have been happy at one of those. (though some kids would be!) What she ended up with was somewhere in between a “typical” BFA and a “typical” BA - probably more than halfway closer to BFA than BA if you put it on a scale.</p>

<p>There was another BA program she (and I) absolutely are crazy about too, but she didn’t get quite enough money to attend that school. ~that’s okay, we are very happy with where she’s going :slight_smile: </p>

<p>You really have to look past the labels…it doesn’t matter what they call it. It matters what they teach and how they teach it and how well that matches up to the experience you want to have.</p>

<p>I always did think that D would do best in a BA/BFA hybrid but of course we applied to the BFA’s because I think you should never close yourself to any options. I think had she gone into a BFA she’d have loved it - but I think she’ll love her BA too.</p>

<p>I totally agree - don’t knock the BA’s!! I think the quality of the professors and the curriculum is what matters most!</p>

<p>Thanks for your post, SongSearcher. I’m feeling good about D’s choice but it’s great to hear from someone who is having a wonderful learning experience in a BA program.</p>

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<p>University of Northern Colorado is a BA with a BFA curriculum. Also with summer stock theater opportunities, a NY and LA showcase. Apparently in the state of Colorado - there can only be 1 BFA program for MT. We looked at 4 programs - 3 BFA’s and the BA at UNCo - the UNCo program held it’s own against the BFA’s.</p>

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<p>Wonderful thread! My daughter is also one of those that auditioned for many BFA programs, was waitlisted at several schools…but in the end just didn’t end up with a BFA program. Since she had done her research on safeties, she is very excited about her upcoming BA program. The course curriculum will closely match several BFA programs she looked at, performance opportunities will be many, and the school has a solid academic reputation that will help her get into a grad school. The professors are all working professionals and she will be able to take dance/voice as minors. AND…being a small private school the scholarship money was a nice added bonus. A three month internship program in NYC sealed the deal…she feels that is a better way to judge talent than a 5 minute showcase.</p>

<p>She plans to see how this year goes and possibly audition for a BFA program again next year (again not quite willing to give up on that option) but she will certainly think long and hard about leaving her BA program. While her concentration will be performance, she is excited to explore the options of theatre education and directing-two thing that have always interested her. You never know what the future will bring and she is hoping this puts her in a more “hireable” catagory while she waits for that big break that only happens to a few.</p>

<p>Many professionals have told her that there is more than one way to make it onto a larger venue stage…she is hoping that attaining a BA at a school she loves will be her way. But if not, she knows she will be ready to still take a place within the arts community and be part of bringing the arts to many people.</p>

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<p>Could you all list these BA programs? They sound like great options for many!</p>

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<p>^^^^^^
Just go to the Musical Theater major sub-forum and look at post #2 of the Big List of MT Colleges thread:</p>

<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/musical-theater-major/801037-big-list-mt-colleges.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/musical-theater-major/801037-big-list-mt-colleges.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>It list all of the programs by state and if it is a BA/BFA as well as other great information.</p>

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<p>mompop, make sure you also look at some of the last posts on the big list that list programs, including BA’s. that have yet to be added to the big MT list.</p>

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<p>I agree that it is unwise to create a list composed of only BFA programs… but not only because you might not get accepted into an auditioned BFA. Since most kids create their list the summer before senior year, they may find that by the time it’s time to decide (sometimes 9 months after the final list was made) they’ve realized they actually prefer a particular BA program over any BFA. I know several kids that happened to this year.</p>

<p>Many kids in BA programs purposely CHOOSE them over even the very best BFA programs,which many kids in BA programs were also accepted to. Some kids decide that, for them, a specific BA program offers them more of what they want than a BFA would.</p>

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<p>MomCares - exactly. This happened with us. Her final choice was a close second (and we are very happy with it) but after every school, her first choice was a WONDERFUL BA program and only the fact that she would have had to have more debt than we wanted kept her from picking it. And she did have several BFA options. But she (and I) absolutely loved this program and it has everything that any desirable BFA would have. ~her final decision is similar, though not exactly the same - but it has some other qualities that are unique, such as being an Equity program which none of the others were, so it’s kind of apples and oranges.</p>

<p>But my point is that you shouldn’t assume that a BA is a compromise, necessarily, in the quality of the training or how well it prepares one in a preprofessional way. That is not necessarily true.</p>

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<p>Thought it was worth reviving this discussion for those who are finalizing your school lists. </p>

<p>Some of the extremely talented kids D knows who chose BA programs over top auditioned BFA programs they were admitted to this year (and this includes kids with recent Broadway credits) did so for many great reasons, among them (in no particular order, and these are only the reasons I’ve heard some of these kids mention)… </p>

<p>1) Wanted to complete a double major in 4 years,
2) Wanted more challenging academics,
3) Wanted a degree from a more prestigious University,
4) Wanted more control/flexibility in course selection over the 4 years,
5) Wanted the full traditional college experience,
6) Fell in love with a particular school,
7) Wanted more career-diverse classmates (didn’t want to spend 4 years largely with the same 20 theatre people… wanted to meet future doctors and lawyers and scientists and…),
8) Wanted to share classes with theatre kids interested in directing, writing, designing, producing, etc. and not spend all their time around other MTs,
9) Got a better financial offer from a BA program (certainly NOT the case for our D ;-),
10) Wanted stronger Acting training than they found in certain MT BFA programs,
11) Did not want to pay University prices for what they considered to be Vocational training that could be gotten more cheaply elsewhere. One kid said he wanted a “real” degree (which sounds bad, but someone in Admissions at Yale did once tell me they prefer BAs for their MFA programs)</p>

<p>Also, as has been mentioned before, there is NOT a continuum of quality of MT training that places all BFA programs above all BA programs. There are kids in BA programs who spend 80% of their time in college getting top-notch performance training, while others spread their time between dual majors or various aspects of theatre. </p>

<p>As you finalize your lists, be sure to consider adding at least one BA in case your desires change in the coming months, or in case you haven’t considered what a particular BA might offer you.</p>

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<p>Thanks for bringing this up again Momcares!</p>

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<p>@SongSearcher – You’re welcome, and thank you for starting a great discussion!</p>

<p>Our D surprised everyone (including mom) last year by deciding a BA was her top choice, but in retrospect I think it was a very wise choice in her case. Since she made her decision, I’ve spoken to many of her friends around the country who did the same thing. They chose great schools like Yale, Brown, Princeton and Northwestern, and are all pursuing MT/Theatre while also seeking well-rounded educations in a traditional college campus environment. Some of these kids have performed their whole lives and, in addition to great performance training, wanted a “normal” college experience and so far it seems to be working out well for all of those that I’ve heard updates from.</p>

<p>And let’s face it – especially for girls, who seem to outnumber guys in this business by at least 10:1 and compete for about 1/4 as many available roles – in a profession where (I’ve heard) only 2% of Equity Actors can make a living, leaving college with a widely-marketable degree (or two) will rarely turn out to be a mistake.</p>

<p>I’m glad D had thought to keep some BA programs on her list BFA-heavy list!</p>

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<p>One of my professors actually wrote a (not very positive though) blog post arguing against the BFA, based on many of those facts and I have to agree. Sometimes I feel that the BFA is just too specific towards playing tours and Broadway that the students would never consider anything else in the world of theatre! Of course, that is not the case, but rather an impression. </p>

<p>Here’s the blog post for anyone interested: [a</a> poor player , Archive The BFA Musical Theatre Degree Should Die](<a href=“http://www.apoorplayer.net/2011/07/the-bfa-musical-theatre-degree-should-die/]a”>http://www.apoorplayer.net/2011/07/the-bfa-musical-theatre-degree-should-die/)</p>

<p>On another note: the BFA degree is intense. More so than most people seem to realize. My school, we are allowed up to 18 credit hours and anything over that, we need signatures and forms signed. Most theatre majors, regardless of your actual degree, do go over, I think I’m taking 20 credits this semester. But between classes, shows, rehearsals, private lessons…I actually had a professor tell one of my BFA classmates this week that he would refuse to let her take more than 18 credits next semester because she was going to crash and burn the way she was going otherwise (and next semester happens to be her barrier semester!). I’m not saying that the BA is so much easier because it’s not, we still have a lot of work, but depending on your interests, you can generalize or focus it more so that a BFA could.</p>