Some of the most striking art pieces are really, really, simple. Let’s not forget that Maya Lin got a B on her project for the Vietnam Veterans Memorial, but it works, doesn’t it?
Stepping back from politics and blame, this project is quite successful in its simplicity and its message. It is controversial and it generates discussion about the issue without being a simplistic one-liner. All that leads to her getting an A (although art projects like this should always be pass/fail IMO).
Your last sentence makes me think we might be somewhat on the same wavelength. A poster in another thread reminded us that we sometimes forget that the vast majority of the comments on this board relate to students with an age range of 17-23. The adults on this board are most likely in their 40’s, 50’s and 60’s. It is helpful to take a step back and try to recall our 20 year old selves when reading some of their posts or evaluating the issues that come up in these threads. We can’t project our knowledge and experience onto these kids, although as a parent I know I try every day with my own.
I am as far from an “artist” as one can be, so I am probably not qualified to comment at all on “performance art.” But I do have a few friends who are artists and I can say with certainty that they speak their own language. It is not one that I always understand, but for sure they understand each other. So if Emma when speaking of her project expressed herself in a way that you or I would not, I think that is to be expected. She is half our age and also sees the world through a lens that might be unfamiliar to us. She certainly takes the project seriously, so I do perceive she has a sincere belief in what she is doing.
So I guess what I am saying is that I am prepared to give her a “bye” if her expressions describing her project are somewhat foreign to me. While you or I may perceive she speaks in riddles when referencing pillows versus mattresses, perhaps her audience understands her perfectly.
Her performance art involves harassing another human being who was found not guilty under the Columbia criminal justice system. She chose not to bring charges in a criminal court. I don’t understand why “taking her project seriously” gives her the right to harass someone. I don’t care how old she is - I would be ashamed if my daughter chose to spend her college years treating someone else in this way.
I agree that no matter what our individual thoughts are of the performance itself, it has been an undeniable success in getting people to focus on the issue. After her appearance at the SOTU it seems the president also decided it was an issue worthy of his attention:
And the president of Columbia seems to be focused on it as well:
I I think that getting people to focus on an issue not worth anything , if it means sacrificing due process and the legal rights of the person who is accused. If that were you or your son whose name was publicly paraded for a year and a half and you were found not guilty, do you seriously think that your (dubious) cause is more important???
It isn’t up to me to decide whether a" cause" is more important than a student’s right to self expression. That’s really up to Columbia. And certainly anyone is free to avail themselves of legal remedies should they wish to get some sort of judicial or administrative ruling on that issue. I do not see that happening here.
What exactly is it that “you don’t see happening” Emma Sulkokowcz pressed charges at columbia and they went through with the case. She DECLINED to pursue anything through the outside court system. So what do you want to see happen? You think the administration should rule that, in spite of what they found, they should find him guilty anyway?
My point is that Paul is free to pursue legal/administrative remedies through Columbia to obtain a ruling on whether the art project constitutes harassment and potentially put a stop to it. I do not see that happening here.
He was already found NOT GUILTY. Columbia is at fault for allowing all of this to go on. I am glad to see that he is speaking out. I hope he pursues it further, and presses legal charges.
As performance art, I think Sulkowicz’s project is strong and compelling. As a metaphor for the weight of social injustice carried by victims of sexual assault, I think it’s quite effective.
Where I have a problem – as do other posters on this thread – is when the project becomes a personal attack on Nusgesser. I can understand why Columbia may not be able to censor Sulkowicz, but I think the university is getting on shaky legal ground when it allows its faculty to get involved in smearing a student as Sulkowicz’s adviser has done either directly or indirectly. I also think the Kirsten Gillibrand was out of line when she called Sulkowicz “a woman of great courage who got no justice.”
A hearing, an appeal and an investigation by the OCR does not equal “no justice”. You’d think a US Senator would know the difference.
I agree with the poster (sorry I forget who) who speculated that Nusgesser will file a civil suit against the University once he has his diploma in hand.
Back to the way back and post #543: I think both Jezebel and New York magazine are conflating the OCR’s Title IX government organization with Columbia’s internal Title IX organization. The more I think about it I don’t see how an individual could file a complaint against another student with the OCR. This would be impractical both because there would be no end to the number of complaints the OCR would be bombarded with and because the OCR doesn’t have the mechanism to hear a proceeding against an individual.
Adam may have filed a complaint with Columbia which is currently under investigation, but it seems odd to me that this information hasn’t been more widely reported and reacted to.
My guess is that there’s no complaint – at least not yet.
It equals no justice if she really was raped, and her rapist went unpunished. That’s unjust. (I’ll repeat that I have no idea if she really was raped.)
^^As usual, I agree with everything you are posting.
I, too, am wondering if Jezebel got pranked. It is looking more and more likely Adam doesn’t exist. However, I’ve been imagining this scenario: Adam calls his parents and tells them for the first time about the sexual assault. And he tells them he spoke with Ryan and intends to provide more information to her or other reporters. His parents say “Please slow down! We need to get you some expert professional advice on disclosing your story. Please please please wait till we make some calls and arrange some meetings. We want to protect you” The Jezebel story appeared Friday. It hasn’t been a week.
On the other hand, if reporters went to the school, it seems they would have uncovered something about Adam. It is very difficult for me to believe no one followed up that story.
I seem to have reached a state of being where I can simultaneously believe and disbelieve in the existence of Adam, and also simultaneously believe and disbelieve in the stories of Emma and Paul. Since I know women raped and assaulted, and don’t know men falsely accused, it is easier for me to believe Emma.
Do we only think justice has been served if we get the result we want? It seems (from her project statements) that she would not feel the process was just unless he was expelled. If he was expelled, he would continue to proclaim his innocence and say the outcome was not just. If the hearing was fair, if it was too much trouble, or there was not enough evidence to go to court, if her appeal was rejected, does that mean that the outcome was unjust because he wasn’t expelled?
I know Emma and her family think the process was stacked against her. There is not enough information out there to really understand if there was evidence that was not allowed and would have swayed the hearing in her favor or if those failings meant the process was improper and thus not just.
Basically someone has to protest unjust rules and unjust decisions. There are groups of women now protesting what they perceive as the injustice of the college tribunals. A couple of young women from UNC seem to have made it a full time job. All this protest is increasing rape awareness and encouraging the sort of immediate reporting to police for which everyone is hoping. But, as dstark keeps telling us, there is injustice there as well.
Injustice seems to be built into the system for women who have been raped and want to see their rapists punished. I agree we don’t want innocent men punished. However, a whole lot of guilty men seem to be avoiding punishment, unless, of course, we believe 40 to 50% of rape reports are false and go back to the idea a woman cannot be raped by someone she knows. As I have posted many times: On my southern college campus int he 70s, fraternity men were incapable of rape, and acquaintance rape did not exist. Women who found themselves in these situations were labeled as sluts.
I think we’re fine as long as we either maintain or develop social language around what constitutes criminal sexual behavior and the colleges do a good job of defining what sexual misconduct is. I’m not sure there is a clear understanding yet among young men and young women what those subtleties actually are. And as I said earlier that needs to be fleshed out long before college. A good percentage of kids are sexually active before they hit the college campuses. Supposedly our lawmakers in each state are responsible for state law, so if people are unhappy…that is the place to apply pressure. Criminal sexual behavior and punishment is a state matter almost all the time.
And I have a gripe that just as you morally can’t walk around gathering media attention and claiming you have cancer (if you don’t), you really shouldn’t morally walk around claiming you’ve been raped, if you haven’t. I can’t say whether Emma has played fast and loose with the language, I suspect her lawyers have cautioned her about this, but I don’t have the time or inclination to comb through everything published about her. She has certainly portrayed herself as someone who has been raped but has declined to pursue the only way to validate that claim in the eyes of the public. It is her life, her senior project and her conscious and the history she will take into her future employment path. I don’t agree with it, but I’m entitled to my opinion just as she’s entitled to her opinion. Personally her parents had the financial wherewithal to sue the college in a civil case and had the financial whererwithal to pressure the police. I think they know deep in their hearts or at a minimum under legal advisement that she doesn’t have a case and the best they could do was “publicly” complain with a letter to the editor in the college newspaper.
Again, I think we can blame the over zealous advocates for the confusion in the public, and most likely that is going to backfire because the mainstream public is just starting to question why colleges are “handling rape.” Rape has a long history of meaning in this country. It is criminal behavior. We have a system for dealing with rape preexisting. Had advocates not played fast and loose with the language and the statistics I think they’d have much more support in the general public for letting colleges and universities work toward better solutions. As someone said earlier rape advocates represent but a fraction of the entire population. They don’t speak for all men or all women. I think everyone is missing the boat by focusing on colleges and universities instead of our greater society and high school students in particular. Everybody goes to high school…not everybody goes to college. Still might happen that most colleges and universities ultimately choose to work with the police rather than go-it alone in clear felony violations and handle the noncriminal or misdemeanor “stuff” on their own and still meet their Title IX obligations. I’m sure their risk managers and lawyers are making those recommendations. Personally I hope Emma doesn’t drag her mattress to graduation, if she was my daughter I’d probably beg her to leave it home, but again she’s the one that will live with the photographic memories long into her adult years.
It is impossible for me to understand your posts when you won’t answer Cardinal Fang’s question about how you define rape. I have no idea what you consider rape.
ETA: It’s like you are writing in code and I don’t have the answer key.
You are concerned about language usage. Is “rape advocate” a deliberate choice? You use this phrase more than a couple of times through the threads. I have been assuming it is just a typo. Is it?
ETA: I am not trying to be ugly or play gotcha. I am trying to understand your posts. If you want me to understand, you are going to have to help me out with a few definitions.
Alh: Agree, although as I have said I think there are more grey area cases among college kids that I might not consider rape, but there are too many guys getting away with sexual assault, either because women are not believed or are not reporting. I just don’t know how to fix it, without completely disregarding the rights of the accused. I think that is what the colleges are wrestling with - how to decide the he said/she said cases, particularly when the complaint is not filed until months later. I think young women need to understand that the only way to make the process work in their favor, even though affirmative consent is and should be required, is to loudly and clearly make their No known (obviously not if the guy has a weapon). Tell someone or several people right away. Confront him as soon as they recall the event in front of witnesses. And, again, report it right away. Unfortunately, even then the outcome will not always be in her favor, but much more likely than if it is not until months later that she determines the activity was non-consensual.
Not blaming the victim for not being the correct victim or acting in the correct way, but the reality is that any fair process will require something beyond the victim’s statement to properly convict the guy.
^Yes, mom2and. I have no idea how to fix it either. It doesn’t seem to me our legal system works with regard to rape, unless we are okay with a majority or rapists going unpunished. I have no idea what to do with that fact.
There’s an interesting article in Cosmo that I read the other day while awaiting a doctor’s appointment. The author was a senior (I believe) at Dartmouth whose premise was that the fraternity hazing process was dehumanizing and contributed to the culture of disrespecting and abusing women. When he was a pledge at his fraternity, he and the other pledges were subjected to really degrading experiences (being placed into a tub of urine and feces, etc.). He believed that this made the pledges less respectful of others and also desirous of seeking power over others. There was pervasive and extensive anti-women language used in his frat and he saw a marked change in personality of some of his fraternity brothers. For example, he mentioned a reserved polite student who became someone who talked about what orifice he wanted to claim when he and some of his fraternity brothers engaged in group sex with a female. Perhaps really cracking down on hazing would help diminish the rape culture.