<p>Thank you for reminding me about 3/2 programs. I have a question about taking prerequisite courses for a graduate program outside the structure of an undergraduate program. Would that place him at a disadvantage when applying to a graduate program? Most graduate programs seem to specify a BS in engineering, mathematics, chemistry or physics as a prerequisite.</p>
<p>I am not clear about your question, but…</p>
<p>Your student surely will be required to take basic undergraduate courses as part of any engineering master’s program he is admitted to. And it may well be that while the department will require completion of those courses, the department will not count those credit hours towards the graduate degree.</p>
<p>Once he receives his master’s degree, potential employers won’t care a wit about the order in which he completed his course of study, as Purple Titan suggested.</p>
<p>At this point if he’s a senior he is not eligible for a 3/2, IMO. Plus, 3/2 programs are not particularly fruitful for most students.</p>
<p>You need to check with each school. My dad is an engineering prof and said they would not admit a student to a master’s degree program if he or she didn’t already have a BS in the same engineering discipline. He is a civil/structural engineering prof.</p>
<p>Also, he could consider getting a double major in physics and then getting the MechE Masters.</p>
<p>People correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe that is a decently-common pathway (granted, taking all physics/math classes at once would be tough, though).</p>
<p>However, adding a physics major would require about four full semesters’ worth of courses, though the prerequisite sequence may be as long as seven semesters at some schools.</p>
<p>MaineLonghorn, that was our impression, based on looking at various school websites. The only exception we have found is Boston University’s bridge program LEAP.</p>
<p>A guy I work with had a MS in biology, went back for an engineering BS and it still took him 3 full years. None of his math classes counted as they were not the more rigorous math/engineering (stats “light” instead of Probability and Statistics, for example). He will need to find out which of his courses would likely transfer and plan accordingly.</p>
<p>Here is another bridge program…</p>
<p><a href=“http://catalog.njit.edu/graduate/programs/mechanicaleng.php”>http://catalog.njit.edu/graduate/programs/mechanicaleng.php</a></p>
<p>BU suggests contacting other engineering programs…</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.americangraduateeducation.com/articles/en/transitioning-engineering.htm”>http://www.americangraduateeducation.com/articles/en/transitioning-engineering.htm</a></p>
<p>I do not know anything about Masters in Engineering and purpose of it.
there is a value of BS in engineering and then PE. They take Professional Engineering certification exam to become a PE.
I was in engineering myslef, my H. is an engineer and a PE. As far as Masters degree, we both have an MBA. While it is NOT required for our jobs, it is an easy to obtain and definitely broaden one’s horizon and more so if one did not have any business classes before. It also has helped me to find many jobs, although everybody is aware that I do not need it to perform at my job. Frankly, we both never heard of anyone having Masters in engineering, maybe it is a new thing.
Another point to consider is that engineering firms usually hire locally. And again, engineering degree will give you some background, you will have to learn whole lot on your own at every specific job. Being exceptionally strong in math is absolute must for engineering and I would say that it is even more true specifically for Mechanical Engineering, probably the hardest of them all. Both my H. and I (for me in a past) are EE.</p>
<p>If he plans to get a Master’s degree in engineering, the particular school where he gets an engineering BS is not too important, as long as it is ABET accredited. His future job prospects would be based more on where his MS engineering degree is from. If he set on that path, I would suggest finishing the second BS wherever it would be quickest and cheapest. Different schools have different transfer credit policies and graduation requirements, so there could easily be a 1-2 semester difference in time to graduate at different schools, so this will require some research to figure out. And his last semester at his current school he should try to take as many math and physics classes as he can.</p>
<p>However, is he really sure that he wants to get an MS in engineering? A BS in engineering already opens up a lot of career doors. He could start working after a BS in engineering, and then get a part-time MS later.</p>
<p>The student needs to compare the length of a second B.S. program versus the length of a Master’s Engineering program. Presumably the core curriculum from the first B.S. will eliminate similar classes ordinarily required for the second B.S. That will some what shorten the length of the program for the second major.</p>
<p>MS Engineering programs do not cover any of the material covered in a BS program. They all start where the BS leaves off. Even if the student could get admitted into an MS program, they would be completely lost without the necessary background.</p>
<p>In an engineering BS curriculum there are essentially three tiers of technical classes.
Basics - Calculus I, II, Differential Equations, Multivariate Calculus, Physics I, II, and Chemistry, Computer Science
General Engineering - Materials, Dynamics, Thermodynamic, Fluids, Intro to Design, Engineering Processes
Major Focus</p>
<p>Basics can be taken anywhere, and, as long as the course is rigorous enough, the principles will apply. The thing to be careful of is that some liberal arts programs and many community college programs are not intense enough to provide the tools needed to succeed later.</p>
<p>@LakeWashington - It is everything else that the MS student without a BS background is going to miss. Basically, the final 2 1/2 years of undergrad engineering education forms the background material for a masters level program. It’s the stuff that gets covered in the first two lectures as “here’s a quick refresher of what you should already know.”</p>
<p>Finally, engineering schools often have a very different culture than many other programs. For example, there are a lot more classes where test averages are in the 60%'s and there is a lot more team and project based learning. These are things that will take some getting used to. Engineering MS students have survived four years of this and they tend be ready to hit the ground running. Someone coming in without that background will be at a disadvantage.</p>
<p>Thank you all for the additional input. I am getting the sense that a BS in one of the engineering fields from an ABET accredited program is enough preparation for a career in that field. An MS would seem to be icing on the cake. In fact, that is my concern regarding BU’s bridge program leading to the MS. Although prerequisite courses are taken, they do not lead to a BS while preparing the student to begin studying for the MS. What kind of job would such a degree be good for?</p>
<p>Dreadpirit; the point is that graduate schools that do accept non-engineering degree holders require such students (typically Math, Physics and Chemistry majors) to satisfy the foundational engineering courses as part of their M.S. program. This is why such people will spend additional semesters earning that M.S.; longer than their engineering undergrad-straight-to M.S. classmates.</p>
<p>An M.S. Engineering student can do any job that a B.S. can do. Keep in mind that the graduate degree is a ‘specialization’ degree.</p>
<p>Engineering really is a self-contained curriculum. It’s sort of like wanting to become a MS nurse practitioner when you’ve not yet studied nursing (or given anybody a shot). There are lots of gaps to fill.</p>
<p>OP, I have heard that having the MSE can work against you as a job applicant, if you do not have experience in the engineering profession to go along with it – the idea being that most practicing engineers enter the field with the BS, and then they might pursue the MS later, but with practical experience and contacts in the profession through their BSE employment. So if somebody wants to enter the profession for the first time with the MS, but no experience, employers can shy away, unsure of giving them the additional pay or responsibility that a MSE would normally expect when they are really just new to the profession. You should get feedback on this from practicing engineers.</p>
<p>I understand that your student is in an unusual position, essentially deciding whether to change majors at the last minute (knowing that it will add an additional few years to the bachelors), or finish the last semester of the originally-contemplated bachelors and then stay on as a post-bac undergrad to either earn a second bachelors or bridge over to a MSE in the few schools that will work with somebody who wants the MSE without the BSE.</p>
<p>This is probably where financial planning, and financial safety, become issues. There is a lot to be said for just finishing whatever bachelors degree he’s almost finished, now that it is only one semester away from being finished, so the kid will at least have a bachelors, in the event that engineering does not turn out to be his cup of tea, or if the realities of life should force him into self-supporting and full-time employment before he can finish this rather long engineering Plan B. </p>
<p>And then in terms of deciding between the BSE or taking supplemental undergrad courses to go straight to the MSE, the latter seems to have two practical ways that it could go awry: few places where it can be done (meaning that transfer opportunities could be limited, if the first program doesn’t work out for financial or other reasons and a transfer must be made), and then the potential hiring problems that I mentioned above, where they may be unwilling to pay for the MSE in somebody whose background is solely academic.</p>
<p>Finally, if the person can find a way to skip over much of the normal BSE coursework and get into a MSE program, how will they do in the MSE, and later in the field? Higher ed is a business, and the schools are sometimes willing to enroll you in something that sounds good, but might not realistically get you where you want to be in life. We have to be critical thinkers, as consumers of higher ed. Taking dynamics and statics and strength of materials (all that time-consuming BSE stuff), and really taking the time to assimilate it and develop the necessary automaticity before having to build upon it, is probably very valuable.</p>
<p>Am reading on my phone so apologies if this has been asked and answered, but does his school have a 3/2 arrangement with another school whereby he would complete the last 2 years at the school that would provide the engineering training? I realize he is a senior, but perhaps it might be worth looking into this as an option. BTW, have 2 engineer sons (mechanical and chemical) both of whom started out majoring in something else and transferred into engineering their sophomore year.</p>
<p>And re: post 29- since you claim repeatedly, miamidap, that anyone can learn and be good at math with the right teachers, it’s interesting to see you finally admit that one should be “exceptionally good at math” to pursue engineering, and that perhaps not all people have the same innate capabilities in this regard. </p>