<p>Everyone in the forums and even at my school emphasizes the need to have outstanding ECs and how you need to be the part of, or the president of NHS or the captain of the basketball and football team. Now, my question is, are ECs overrated? I'm sorry if I've offended you by any chance right now that you're grades and SATs are garbage so you now have to rely on ECs to bolster your confidence because that's exactly how I'm thinking right now. Some of my classmates at school have even told me "no one can get into nyu, johns hopkins, or any good school like an ivy if you don't have extracurriculars". </p>
<p>They're loaded with ECs like crazy. They're part of nhs, and the wresting, Basketball, and math team. Now what is the point of joining so many clubs? I only have 2 clubs as a sophmore right now, red cross and math team. If the advice that ECs are important as your academics then right now I basically have lost hope of getting into any ivy. </p>
<p>It’s what you do and the level at which you do it that matters most. A star performer in multiple school plays, a jazz musician in the band with well regarded performances both within the school context and outside, a ballet star, the school president who has led major initiatives for the school, etc. – these roles are likely to have a significant impact on admissions. They demonstrate leadership, effectiveness, and talent.</p>
<p>Colleges are looking for students who will add something to the college campus. having a number of extracurriculars shows that you are the type of person who gets involved. Add to that some leadership roles in the ECs and you have a student who not only gets involved but makes a difference in his/her environment. Couple that with good test scores and a high GPA and you have a package that is attractive to colleges. </p>
<p>Thinking that by joining a lot of clubs you have the ECs they look for at very selective schools is what you hear in the lunchroom regarding college admissions. Adcoms call these kids a mile wide and an inch deep. Actually the most selective colleges they are looking for depth more than just participation. Stanford, for example, says
<p>One thing to keep in mind about ECs, they only come into play (generally) if you can make it to the starting line with your test scores, GPA, and rigor. (The exception is recruited athletes.) I’ll never forget the kids at a mid to low level performing HS telling me they didn’t have time to study and do their homework because what really got them into college was ECs. They, and your friends probably, can’t be convinced otherwise, but pay attention to grades first. Then concentrate on ECs you really care about - leadership and depth will naturally flow from those.</p>
<p>To be honest, academics and test scores are a lot more important than your extra-curricular activities at most universities. ECs tend to only meaningfully come into play at the top universities because of an overwhelming amount of qualified candidates applying, unless you’re a recruited athlete. You did imply that you wanted to get into an ivy, which definitely takes into account ECs. I would advise finding what you’re passionate about, and remembering the adage “quality > quantity” when it comes to ECs.</p>
<p>Very Cliche, “quality>quantity” but what does this ambiguous statement really mean? Do you have to hold a leadership position or be a president of an organization to get into cornell caliber colleges? I’m not that overly ambitious. I’m not planning to be the big shot going to harvard and yale. Cornell is my dream school. </p>
<p>I don’t have any leadership positions whatsoever. I’m just a regular participant in Red Cross and Math Team. I don’t see how unique i am right now. My grades are also pretty decent. 94 average in freshmenyear; this year (soph) 97.5 avg but with no aps. My october PSAT score was a 193 (76M, 55CR, 62W). I’m still improving; SAT target score 2200, but i’ll aim at a 2300 just to be safe. </p>
<p>so what are my chances? what other clubs should i join next year? I think a leadership position would consume a lot of my time, since i’m planning to take 2 SAT iis next year, and 2 or 3 APs. </p>
<p>Also, most students accepted to ivy leagues usually had at least one leadership position like captain of basketball team or something. Well… I don’t have any of that… I feel very hopeless now because there’s not much i can do now. Junior year is a few months away and I’m not athletic, nor do i think i stand a chance at obtaining a position like president of nhs since all the popular clubs have already filled their positions. If i continue to have regular ECs do you think i can still make cornell? of course, i’m just gonna take everyone’s advice with a grain of salt, but any further suggestions?</p>
<p>I think EC’s matter less than we thought now that my S is a senior. However, some colleges do put weight on them toward merit scholarships (some just based merit money on scores, grades, but some value leadership, continuity, and things that will add to the college when the student arrives there). I will have my daughter focus a little less (but still substantially) on EC’s than I did my son. She is also more of a traditional school kid–whatever the assignment, she’ll focus and ace it. I am not talking Ivy’s or the like here, though, just really good colleges with admission rates of 25% to 40%. His EC’s were mostly life skills, though, so I don’t regret the time and effort-Eagle Scout, Black Belt, leadership, etc. </p>
<p>If you are not a leader type, you don’t have to hold a leadership position. Don’t try to be who you are not. Imagine the class of 20xx entirely made up of leaders. There is nobody to follow!! You can be a wonderful follower/collaborater who listens, observes, and thinks to support the leaders.</p>
<p>You should read Cal Newport’s book “How to be a High School Superstar: A Revolutionary Plan to Get Into College By Standing Out (Not Burning Out)”. You do NOT have to participate in tons of things at a very high level. But it helps a lot to do something that is different from the rest of the crowd. Colleges are aching to accept students who are genuine and interesting, as long as they also feel they can handle the work. Read the book, it will help you get some perspective on the “rat race” of academics and ECs.</p>
<p>And do NOT worry about the leadership issue. My D2 had no leadership positions at all on her applications last year. She was a pretty top performer in some individual ways (top 5 in state in both an academic and an athletic endeavor). But not a single leadership position. And she got in everyplace she applied, including U of Chicago, Swarthmore, and Harvey Mudd. And with a 3.7 GPA, unhooked (but great test scores).</p>
<p>wow, phew! kinda relieved from the need for ecs. i’m reading some stats on CC and accepted cornell applicants didn’t have that great of ecs. grateful. </p>
<p>As others have said, it doesn’t mean leadership necessarily. I had no leadership activities and was accepted to multiple Top 50 US News schools, even with a 3.8W GPA! I had high test scores, but I think my EC’s helped a lot because they were quality and specialized. If you have two EC’s, but both are focused in an area you enjoy and are significant commitments, colleges will like that. Even more so if they correlate with your academics.</p>
<p>Basically, don’t add more clubs just to add them, colleges hate that. As you go through high school, find a small handful, maybe even just 1-2 that you truly enjoy and commit to.</p>
<p>I’m much more extracurricular focused, and while I was accepted to all of my top tier schools (Yale, Columbia, and Stanford), I was rejected by some lower tier schools (for example, Cornell). My experience is that the very top schools, HYPS, want something more than just great academics, and they will go for someone who is less strong academically who they believe will contribute more to campus. But I wouldn’t say that it’s so much having a laundry list of extracurricular activities, but instead a passion for commitment. You need to have a passion for learning and a passion for what you do, such that you are able to express it and appear extraordinary. Top schools want to create classes of “doers” not “not doers who stay in their rooms all day and study.” So yes, activities are important, but only if you are passionate about them. </p>
<p>Speaking as a parent of a high school junior, I’ll just add two thoughts. First, don’t let your GPA slide and then think that you can compensate by being president of 6 clubs. Second, pick EC’s that you actually enjoy and care about. Extracurriculars should be something you’d do even if adcoms didn’t know about it. Then your passion and enthusiasm will show through, and you won’t get to your senior year and ask: why did I waste all that time doing something I hated.</p>
<p>Whether they fit your def’n of “overrated” or not, selective schools look to populate their classes with interesting contributors. Some of this is through examining what was important to the applicants when they were in HS. Some of it is shown through extraordinary talent. The vast bulk of people won’t be accepted into selective colleges that weigh these issues and thus, don’t have to worry about faking or resume-padding.</p>
<p>Since you’ve placed Cornell on your list, you need to understand that they are looking for students who will contribute. What about your application will show that? Your competitors are parading their attributes. What will you show? Cornell certainly isn’t wrong to desire to see and evaluate the best and brightest.</p>
<p>My D is not a big club joiner. She did well in the college sweepstakes this year and here is my take on the EC issue. Commitment that shows a college who you are is important. D taught ESL four years and worked a food bank for two summers. Book club for four years and became defacto president senior year. Not flashy but you know who she is by what she does.</p>
<p>In the old days ( my time) I’m sure I got in MIT for my demonstrated devotion to theatre, in school and out and my H is sure he got in because of his summer jobs at a mortuary. And he got in HY and wait listed at P.</p>
<p>So don’t worry about leadership or sports or a particular club. It is too hit or miss to try to guess what any school is looking for. Pick something that you like that you stick with. If you care, you will show leadership even if you are not president. </p>
<p>I feel pretty inadequate right now. I don’t see how my 2 clubs reflect my interests? math team and red cross. so i like mathematics and going to red cross events. how does this reflect my character? </p>
<p>does being on a PSAL sports team help you in college admissoins? you don’t have to be like the top player or captain but what i’;m saying is that i’ve seen a lot of people get into ivies just because they were on the track team, or basketball. idk… but i’m not athletic, sports just isn’t my thing. but i don’t know what is now. Junior year is nearing so closely and i have no idea what to do for next year. </p>
<p>What should I do at this point? join more clubs I like? i’m gonna try to join nhs. i also want a volunteer job. but idk where i should volunteer. i’m probably going to major in finance in college but i have no idea what volunteer job relates. maybe a math tutor? but that doesn’t seem unique. i don’t wanna watch little kids at a day care because that has nothing related to me, nor do i want to do that. waste of my time. </p>
<p>Okay, this is my new favorite reason why someone thought they were admitted to a top college. :)</p>
<p>OP, the students who get preferential admissions due to sports skills are WAY better than anyone could ever be if they just joined a sport in high school. Do not bother if you are not an athlete already (or at least don’t join because you think it will help your applications).</p>
<p>Places my kids volunteered: food bank, political campaigns. Other kids we knew volunteered at hospitals, senior centers, labs, tutoring, museums, local nature centers, library. You might try an online search; if you live in a larger city, there are websites in many of them that match volunteers with opportunities.</p>
<p>Have you ever heard of Junior Achievement? For kids who want to be business majors it is a good EC. One of my brothers was really into it.</p>
<p>But math team and Red Cross volunteering (I assume you volunteer there) are also perfectly fine ECs. To me they should (1) an interest in quantitative topics (which finance is, so that is good), and (2) compassion (do not underestimate the value of this in the eyes of an admissions committee!). Can you step up your participation in either of those areas – add another closely related responsibility or activity? Can you step up your participation somehow in the summer? Or maybe attend a math class or take some online classes in areas of math that interest you?</p>
<p>Don’t let CC or your classmates make you feel inadequate. Do things that you are interested in, and try to do them well. That is all you need to do. </p>
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