Fiancial Aid

Parents Social Lounge
1

<p>Hello all,</p>

<p>I just wanna get some insight as I was totally blown away at info given at a finacial aid seminar (Charles Potter DFS). Here goes:</p>

<p>1.Don't apply for minority based scholarships,you limit yourself.For race always check other.Now I would agree with thatbecause I've seen where my daughter would click AA and fewer Scholarships would pop up.
2.There are rich kids in River Oaks,Houston's affluent neighborhod, that get full ride scholarships so don't believe that income is a factor.
Sholarships are not good as some jobs offer incentives to pay off loans .So get Loans.It's okay.</p>

<p>My head was swirling as I never heard of this. Can someone chime in?</p>

2

<p>Where is the advice to print out the FAFSA formula and run your own numbers on paper? <a href=“http://www.ifap.ed.gov/efcformulaguide/attachments/101310EFCFormulaGuide1112.pdf[/url]”>http://www.ifap.ed.gov/efcformulaguide/attachments/101310EFCFormulaGuide1112.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Where is the advice to spend a year tracking all of your family’s expenses so that you know exactly where your money is going and so that you know exactly how much you can pay for your child’s education?</p>

<p>Where is the information that the EFC you receive from FAFSA is almost certainly the minimum your family would be expected to pay?</p>

<p>Where is the advice about how to talk with your spouse and your kids about the money issue?</p>

<p>Where is the big, bright arrow pointing to your affordable local community college and/or in-state public U?</p>

<p>Where is the advice to get close and comfortable with [Project</a> on Student Debt: Home](<a href=“http://projectonstudentdebt.org/]Project”>http://projectonstudentdebt.org/) and [FinAid</a>! Financial Aid, College Scholarships and Student Loans](<a href=“http://www.finaid.org%5DFinAid”>http://www.finaid.org) ?</p>

<ol>
<li><p>There are more scholarships out there that anyone can apply for, than there are scholarships for a specific minority group. Go ahead and apply for any minority scholarships that you qualify for, but don’t limit yourself to that category of scholarship. Apply for ANY scholarship you qualify for.</p></li>
<li><p>There is need-based financial aid and there is merit-based aid. Rich kids can get massive merit-based scholarships because of their grades, ECs, etc. So can poor kids. Poor kids can also get need-based money, or merit-based scholarships that have a need component.</p></li>
<li><p>Debt is slavery. No one should finish college with more debt than the equivalent of the maximum Stafford Loans. No one can guarantee anyone a job at college graduation, let alone a job that will give you “incentives to pay off loans”.</p></li>
</ol>

<p>The presenter was either a fool, or trying to sell you something. Your nonsense meter sounded a huge alarm. Your instincts are good. Congratulations!</p>

3

<p>You have already figured out that some of this sounds odd, if not downright wrong. Why encourage somene to take out loans? Scholarships are always the best way to go because they do not have to be paid back. Do not cut out any possible opportunities for scholarships, including minority scholarships. It’s not usually either/or.</p>

4

<p>*Sholarships are not good as some jobs offer incentives to pay off loans .So get Loans.It’s okay.</p>

<p>*</p>

<p>This may be true in a limited number of situations. But, not typically true. If it WERE true, would we be reading so many posts from kids who can’t make their loan payments because their incomes aren’t high enough???</p>

<p>*There are rich kids in River Oaks,Houston’s affluent neighborhod, that get full ride scholarships so don’t believe that income is a factor.
*</p>

<p>The guy is confusing “merit based full ride scholarships” with “need based full ride scholarships.” Rich people are not getting need based full rides from ivies or other schools that don’t give merit scholarships.</p>

<p>The only rich kids that are getting full rides are one who are accepting MERIT based full rides to some schools that offer them. Those aren’t the top schools like ivies, MIT, Stanford, etc.</p>

<p>I don’t know if this guy addressed this…don’t think that just because your child is AA that he/she will get a “free ride.” I live in a neighborhood that is about 1/4 black. It’s an affluent neighborhood and no one is getting free rides based on income. These kids can only get merit scholarships. If they go to a top school, they are full pay.</p>

5

<p>That is alarmingly bad advice. Truly alarming. </p>

<p>-Fewer scholarships may have popped up but your daughter will be competing with a smaller pool for those scholarships. It’s the same for scholarships offered to only residents of a town or children whose parents work for a specific company, etc. </p>

<p>-Income has nothing to do with merit aid. Did he explain that? And that most of the top tier schools (none of the ivy, etc.) offer merit aid?</p>

<p>-Has this person not heard of the recession? If there were companies out there paying off undergrad debt, they were few and far between and now there are even less of them.</p>

6

<p>I had to find out who Charles Potter and “DFS” are so I Googled him. Here’s his story:</p>

<p>"About DFS
By Charles Potter, Founder DFS</p>

<p>"In September of 1989, I went to a college financial aid office to see why my daughter was not getting financial aid. I handed the individual my Student Aid Report and without opening the letter, she said I made too much money to get financial aid. How was she able to determine that without opening the letter? I would not find out until a year later.</p>

<p>"At a special college workshop, I met a man that had a unique company. The mission of his company was to show upper-middle income and above individuals, “Rich People” how to get financial aid. That is right! Rich people could get financial aid. To my surprise, there was nothing unethical or illegal in what he did. He simply explained the financial aid formula and applied it to the individual’s circumstance.</p>

<p>"Here is one strategy. In 1990, to classify a student as independent, the parents deleted the student from their income tax return two consecutive years in a row. The student would not have to enter parent’s information on the financial aid application. People who knew this simply dropped their student from their 1040 when they were sophomores in high school. Their student could ride in their limo to pick up their financial aid.He also pointed out how some one living in a housing project not knowing the financial aid formula, would be told they were not able to get financial aid to attend a community college.</p>

<p>"After spending eight hours with him, I knew what I had to do. I had to show everyone I could what the total process for selecting a career, a college or university, and how to get the selection funded.</p>

<p>“One of the most profound statements made in the workshop was, “Financial Aid is not education welfare, all working Americans contribute to the U. S. Department of Education via their tax dollars every April 15th whether they receive financial aid
or not. You owe it to your family to master the process so some of your tax dollars benefit your children when you need it. We are commited to helping you, your family, your church, or organization. Let us show you how by attending our award winning “12 Steps to College Success” seminar.”</p>

<p>Mr. Potter is apparently telling parents that financial aid is a mysterious maze that can only be worked to one’s advantage if one knows all the secrets and tricks. Not surprisingly, he maintains that he has all the secrets and tricks. And even less surprisingly, the “12 Steps” can be yours in book form, a $49.95 value but available on his website for only $29.95!</p>

<p>Great.</p>

7

<p>To the OP, your time would be better spent educating yourself about how the system works than listening to this type of misinformation. For the most part the system is clear cut but it is involved and takes time to understand. Mr. Potter isn’t trying to help you, he has just found a way to make some money for himself.</p>

8

<p>

</p>

<p>Dear Lord…this man is clearly delusional if he thinks that all working Americans pay federal income tax and even more so if he thinks that all of them can qualify for federal student aid…unless he’s talking about unsubsidized Stafford loans! Or does he think that institutional aid is also funded through tax dollars? Who in their right mind would ever think that it’s better to borrow than to have a scholarship which pays the cost up front? And what is the point of citing an example from 1990 which does not pertain to the way things work today?! His true quest seems to be to mislead as many people as possible…gotta wonder how many have fallen for this garbage and have been unpleasantly surprised later!</p>

9

<p>Regarding “checking AA” and having fewer scholarships pop up, this rings a bell from when I did some searches on scholarship websites a few years ago. Some of these sites LIMIT you to what you click. So if you click on AA, it will only bring up scholarships where that is one of the criteria. For scholarships open to everyone (not just a specific minority group), they are filtered out when you choose that.</p>

<p>So I would spend some time on those sites trying different filters. I would run the AA filter (as your D presumably is eligible for some of those scholarships). But try the running it with it off, and with some other criteria that she fits as well. Those sites can be pretty frustrating and time consuming to look through, given those types of filtering issues.</p>

<p>It would be silly NOT to apply for scholarships where she meets the criteria (be that minority status or other). Can’t think of any scholarships that are mutually exclusive (apply for one, and you are not considered for another), so how could that be a problem for her to apply for some minority focused scholarships? Just don’t limit yourself to those.</p>

<p>In generally… you will find it is an advantage for her to mark her minority status on college and scholarship applications where it is requested. Colleges are bending over backwards to find qualified minority students, and often provide substantial scholarship or grant money when they find them. </p>

<p>Fact is, you D’s best bet for scholarship money comes from the colleges themselves where she applies. Of course you can find outside scholarship money and should pursue it when the odds appear reasonable that she may get it. But good grades and test scores improve her chances for earning scholarships from her chosen college, so that should be her top focus. If she is in the top 1/3 of the applicant pool for her statistics, that improves her chances at many schools of getting more aid. And have her apply to several schools so you can compare financial aid offers. </p>

<p>Be sure when you have those offers in hand that you understand EXACTLY which parts are grants or scholarships that do not need to be paid back, and which are loans. Also that you (and she) clearly understand the terms of the loans. Keep asking questions until you are sure, don’t be afraid to call the financial aid office at the colleges as many times as you have to. </p>

<p>Listen to Happymom1, she has lots of good advice in her post. And good luck!</p>

10

<p>

</p>

<p>Maybe in 1990…but times have changed and this is NO LONGER TRUE.</p>

<p>I had to explain this to someone I worked with a couple of weeks ago. Their child was not able to return to school this year because of finances (OOS public but an inexpensive one). He was living and working in the college town, planning to declare himself independent (he’s 21) and get mucho financial aid. I explained this was probably not going to work. Then we looked at the college website where it clearly stated…NO it was NOT going to work.</p>

11

<p>Thanks for all your replies. They were just as I expected.I was invited to go along with a friend who seemingly expressed doubt in the tips I shared with her in securing aid for her daughter. I told her that those seminars are the livelihood for the spokesperson. Most have an agenda. I had already explained to her how there was need based aid and merit based aid. She wanted to hear what this guy had to say. I went ,too, because I was curious. I’m always open and receptive to helpful ideas of others. She was hooked. I saw straight through it.
Book promotion. Okay I get it. I consider myself a pro on the financial aid process. I successfully secured aid for my son( scholarships, school aid ,grants , no loans)a senior in college and now my daughter. She is a senior and is in waiting phase. I’m not worried yet. I mastered the art of FAFSA and scholarship hunting years ago when I was in college. I just wanted to see what you thought of this because I couldn’t believe how my friend so readily accepted his information.</p>

<p>btw. I forgot to discuss another point that was made.All that essay writing for scholarships is a waste because the children don’t even get the money. It goes to the school. Duh !!</p>

<p>Thanks guys.</p>

12

<p>So since the OP doesn’t need this, it is for others reading this thread. In addition to Happy Mom’s link to the FAFSA formula (which I intend to look at ASAP!), there is an electronic pretend FAFSA calculator. <a href=“https://fafsa.ed.gov/FAFSA/app/f4cForm?execution=e1s1[/url]”>https://fafsa.ed.gov/FAFSA/app/f4cForm?execution=e1s1&lt;/a&gt; I highly recommend it.</p>

13

<p>^^^</p>

<p>Is there another link…that one’s not working.</p>

14

<p>The FAFSA calculator at College Board .com has given us estimates that were exact-to-the-dollar both last year and this year.</p>

15

<p>

Merit scholarships are not based on need, but on achievement</p>

<p>

This doesn’t make sense. Scholarships are free money; how can not taking them be a good thing? You can’t count on some job offers.</p>

<p>ETA: I missed a couple of posts in skimming the thread. Sorry. In any event, this is a scam.</p>

16

<p>

</p>

<p>Maybe it’s time to show her this thread and hook her up here!</p>

17

<p>That was my reason for the OP. I wanted to show her the thoughts of other people that are definitely in the know about this whole financial aid process. I will definitely hook her up here!! Thanks all</p>

18

<p>I totally, wholly agree mafool.</p>

19

<p>I’m sorry I posted a bad link. Just Google FAFSA 4 Caster for a great head-start on the FAFSA. You can experiment with numbers and even import your info when it’s time to do it for real.</p>