I normally don’t ask people personal questions here, however, you are the one that brougt up your experience, and how it factors in to your assessment of tenured professors, union employees and civil servants. Obviously, you wouldn’t make a reckless statement like this unless you’ve been in high level leadership roles in a university, a union environment and a major government agency. At which university, unionized company and government agency have you worked?
1 Like
I don’t think anyone denies there is “dead wood” in academia, government, or unions, or in any job that offers extreme employment protection, just like those in jobs with zero employment protection are likely more anxious than others.
2 Likes
So with your disdain for unions and Government Civil Servants I hope you don’t need a Police Officer, Firefighter, don’t want to fly on a commercial Airplane, watch Pro Sports or need anything delivered by UPS.
Move the conversation forward please. We don’t need more posts equating tenure with unions.
Has there been an exodus? Has there been any objections or suits from the faculty?
I get the feeling you haven’t gone back and looked at everything linked in this thread.
Here’s one more-than-likely intended consequence:
1 Like
But I thought the original post was about tenured professors having to defend themselves after tenure with writing and other work. The Critical Race thing is another issue. This assistant professor is in a pickle as he is up for tenure but teaches a controversial subject. That’s hard, but until you get tenure you don’t have a lot of protection.
I worked on a case about a professor not getting hire for a position with tenure. I got to review all the nominations for tenure at the Univ for the prior 10 years. Not so much controversy about the Ag or Business professors teaching weird theories on farming or accounting, but Political Science? Harder to get tenure. To be fair, the Ag department also made sure their nominees had completed all the requirements, published the required number of books, had the peer reviews and LORs. Other departments were sloppy and tried to sneak things by.
1 Like
That is the whole point of the law. This is a DeSantis political move. Are there real issues with tenure? Sure. Are they concerned about them? Not really. The purpose is not to address concerns about dead weight faculty. The purpose is not to increase the diversity of voices on campus. The purpose is to silence them. I can’t believe that anyone is seriously debating this. DeSantis is pretty open about being a cultural warrior and doing everything in his power to forward his social agenda.
12 Likes
The purpose is transparency. If you have to hide what you are teaching and do not want parents to know what you are teaching, then maybe one should not be teaching it.
Edited to add - students should also be able to know what the class is truly about before deciding to take it.
This is college-level! Are you really saying CRT, or any other supposedly controversial topic that does not get full-throated approval from every mainstream resident of Peoria should not be taught? At college???
6 Likes
There are actually many parents who are concerned about what their offspring will hear at college since it doesn’t fit their religious or social views. They call it brainwashing. It doesn’t matter if any of it has an awful lot of data backing it up vs just parental beliefs. These parents will often severely restrict where their kids can go or not let them go at all. Many kids are super frustrated TBH. It can put a bit of a wall between their relationship.
ps I’m not one of those parents, but I have been working in a high school for over 20 years…
7 Likes
As the child of two people who might as well be from Mars, our opinions and beliefs and cultural mores are so different, I believe you. But even they would not have thought to restrict the curriculum. And my brother, who also has advanced degrees, remains firmly on the other end of the political spectrum.
This blaming professors for how their child turns out — because that’s really what we’re talking about here, isn’t it? — is a recent phenomenon.
4 Likes
These students are legal adults. They should be choosing their courses, not their parents. If they don’t like the topic of a class, then don’t take it. I don’t get a “report card” from my son’s school. It is up to him if he wants to share his courses or grades with me.
If these students, who are adults, don’t like a certain course, then they shouldn’t take it, but don’t take it away from students who do want it because it doesn’t fit someone’s agenda.
6 Likes
Please give an example, of any course at any university, where you know for a fact that the contents of the course were deliberately hidden from prospective students.
8 Likes
Professors do NOT want students in their classes who do not want to be there. Often times we tweak our catalog course descriptions if we sense that students are getting the wrong ideas about the class when they register. I’ve done that myself when I’ve had students who are in over their heads in my classes before. I would have though that someone who hates biology wouldn’t take an upper-division neurobiology elective, but 
. It serves no one well to have a mismatch between the course and the student.
I know of no one who would obfuscate what they intend to teach. That’s a recipe for misery all around.
7 Likes
I can’t open the story but it appears to show…at least in some people’s opinions that yes some are having to change classes. Looks like you can get a free trial if want to read.
I did not say anyone did for sure. Just said the they asked for transparency. “If you have to hide” does not state anyone has. This should not be of concern if everyone is teaching what they say they are.
As an educator, I am asked about curriculum all the time.
So, out of the blue, you just happened to say:
“The purpose is transparency. If you have to hide what you are teaching and do not want parents to know what you are teaching, then maybe one should not be teaching it.”
You said this in defense of the ‘anti-woke’ initiatives of DeSantis. Just like DeSantis, you don’t know if anyone is doing this for sure. You don’t know, because no one is doing it. It is nonsense. DeSantis is executing an anti-science agenda and people like you never hesitate to rush in to his defense without evidence or cause. You are an educator? That is unfortunate.
4 Likes
Please give an example of any course at any university where the students don’t know what the class is truly about before deciding to take it.
3 Likes