<p>I really, really don't know what went wrong, and I don't see anything on my app that would be an absolute killer unless it's the counselor recommendation, and she made it pretty clear that she had a really positive opinion of me.</p>
<p>I'm not just making excuses, I swear, I've looked over everything else and it just doesn't add up. Could it be my lack of volunteering? The fact that I didn't start my activities until 11th grade? That I didn't get into taking the absolute most rigorous courses until 11th grade as well? (I didn't take easy classes, just not the absolute top). A lot of this stems from my utter lack of self-confidence entering high school... I was the typical Dungeons and Dragons-playing, video game-loving, sci-fi obsessed nerd in the corner of the room who was scared of talking to anyone, and it took A LOT to get past this stage of my life. I guess no matter what happens to me, college-wise, I'll have that- the fact that I've come so far already and know I can go a lot farther.</p>
<p>I would definitely recommend calling Yale and (politely) asking them what you could improve/change on your app. (or is it too late because they are on break now? :( ) I think that most of the time they take the time to look over your app and give you tips. Frankly, I have NO idea why they didn't even defer you with the stats you have. </p>
<p>If your essays were good -- and i trust them to be -- then you need to look at the recommendation situation again. "Counselor Rec: Dunno." sort of raises a red flag to me. Counselor rec IS very important, and I hope you took the time to talk to your counselor after your denial about how/why certain activities are important to you, and why you want to attend X university, etc...</p>
<p>Best of luck on all your colleges! I'm sure you'll do well. :)</p>
<p>JW Muller I cant believe that site. i didnt think it was possible to get into Harvard/Yale with some of the scores i saw. My mind is blown away.</p>
<p>Werg, I think your biggest problem was it sounds like you portrayed yourself as a meek, introverted person which is not a bad thing, however the fact is, there are a million geniuses out there with stats similar to or better then yours who already fill up the position as the silent genius. I know you talked about coming out of your shell but if you didn't give enough evidence of this then I dont think they bought it. </p>
<p>I am also a URM, ecuadorian and white (i come from a jewish background on my dads side), but i devoted my entire high school career to bettering the hispanic community inside and outside of my school. what I am trying to say is that my URM status was not just some box i checked off when i was filling out the app. it was a common thread that ran throughout everything i did. </p>
<p>i am not sure what will happen with stanford's decision, hopefully if they are truly trying to build a diverse class that they havent filled their alotment of silent genius positions. good luck to you, no matter what happens your accomplishments are impressive.</p>
<p>p.s. i was admitted ea to stanford if in your mind that validates what i have to say anymore then a layperson's comments</p>
<p>I was accepted SCEA and am a urm with stats far worse than yours. You never know with Stanford but it is certainly possible, just dont count on it.</p>
<p>"Alternatively, maybe your parents are Mexican and Jewish respectively, while your SAT's are more demonstrative of the latter than the former. Admission committees, seeing your non-URM SAT's, might be thinking the URM contention is a ploy."</p>
<p>I resent that. I know plenty of URMs with OP's scores. That was a bigoted comment and was not appreciated.</p>
<p>Yeah, that was not a necessary comment.....the thing that colleges want from URMs is there uniqueness and difference of views, people who look at issues differently than the white majority in the US. A URM who has done well (like parents doing well financially, high GPA/scores) would, in my mind, be more attractive to colleges, especially if they show a large interest in their heritage.</p>
<p>"Alternatively, maybe your parents are Mexican and Jewish respectively, while your SAT's are more demonstrative of the latter than the former. Admission committees, seeing your non-URM SAT's, might be thinking the URM contention is a ploy."</p>
<p>I have to agree that this statement seriously made my stomach turn. I want to believe that you didn't mean for what you said to come across like it did (basically, that URMs that have high scores are in some way "phony" and that "authentic" URMs don't get high scores), but your second statement makes it apparent that you really meant what you said. Next time I'd encourage you to really think before you speak, as what you said was really insulting, at least to me.</p>
<p>"there are a million geniuses out there with stats similar to or better then yours who already fill up the position as the silent genius. I know you talked about coming out of your shell but if you didn't give enough evidence of this then I dont think they bought it."</p>
<p>I post consistently to keep statements like this in check. There are <em>not</em> that many geniuses out there. That's called tossing around a term very lightly, no results can come of that. The fact of the matter is that there aren't that many people who score as highly as this guy did, and if Yale or Stanford didn't take him, it's not because they have a ton of people with the same scores <em>it's because they deliberately want a different kind of class</em>.</p>
<p>Not every 2300+ scorer is the same. Some may be brilliant, others may just be good at the SAT. Now, a better question is if the OP made it evident that he is a sharp academic mind. Since academics are his strong point. </p>
<p>Either way though, part of the reason he was rejected <em>may just be that they don't want another student like him</em>, and that's probably the sad truth. Doesn't mean there are many students who match or outshine him score-wise. </p>
<p>Now, if you want to tell me the scores don't mean too much, sure, I discussed in a huge thread that the curricula for these tests force me to believe they can be "gamed," and thus mean less than we'd like them to. Doesn't mean, though, that the OP is just a good test-taker -- it may very well be that his brilliance does not come through in our limited application system!</p>
<p>And my opinion on this URM thing -- I mean, I think part of the issue is a lot of us <em>do not know</em> exactly how admissions officers make a decision.</p>
<p>I can state in an absolute sense that I favor looking at those more favorably for admission only if they faced some tough circumstances + overcame them really. However, I think it is definitely insulting to tell someone they were accepted purely because they were URM's, or to make other similar attacks. The fact is, we really don't know. </p>
<p>No doubt the admissions game is strange, but it doesn't mean we need to start guessing attacks.</p>
<p>I apologize, I honestly shouldn't comment on specific groups -- my view is somewhat underdeveloped here. As a general philosophy, I am in favor of students getting judged after their background is taken into consideration. Now, if I had to do admissions, I'd not be <em>so</em> bent upon admitting a diverse class...instead, I'd rather focus specifically on what people's background is, and how they succeeded within it. I.e. admitting a good student of some variety just because we don't have that many of that variety is not ideal to me. </p>
<p>While we're at it, I'd be a little more free with admitting people who are "purely intellectual" (maybe at the cost of EC's and stuff) and not necessarily of some polarized talent. Because I am of the firm view that not everyone with good scores and grades is the same intellectually.</p>
<p>So for instance, if it is highly unusual for a person of certain background to shine intellectually, and they do it, I see them having the "fire" to continue -- maybe part of this background can subtly involve what background these come from.</p>
<p>And mathboy, you raised some interesting points. I didn't necessarily overcome hardship, so that might kind of eliminate the URM factor.</p>
<p>And, as for my scores... I achieved everything I did with no prep classes and a minimum of studying. I wasn't even aware that there was an essay on the SAT until I had to write it. So at the very least I certainly wasn't "gaming" the system or whatever. I am a good test taker, in that I tend to perform my best under pressure, when it matters the most.</p>
<p>Yeah, I understand mathboy's points, but I also think that colleges look for members of URM communities that do have very high scores (like you) and are somewhat "well-off" in American financial standards. However, I think they want people like this to bring something unique to the school and who have been in touch with their heritage......also, URM applicants like you are probably more appealing because you are the kind of person who can help eliminate problems in your community.
At least this is what my CC told me, don't hate me if it's completely wrong though!</p>
<p>Well to iterate, and make it clear, I hardly know how it <em>is</em> done, only have some opinions on how it should be. I mean, for such things as helping out your own community, etc, honestly I'd not be in favor of admitting someone just guessing that stuff, unless there were legitimate interest in such endeavors in essays. Other than that, I'm sure most of us have some good will towards our communities anyway. </p>
<p>I would of course be very much in favor of admitting the OP, don't get me wrong, but mainly because of his academics. One of my qualms is how easily a student far more academic than your typical high scoring type often doesn't make it into these private schools with consistency. I'm not sure if the OP is one of these, but it seems he very well may be. And I wish that there were more consistency, is all. </p>
<p>BTW, to the OP, I dunno if it's on your list, but if you don't make it into Stanford, consider Berkeley. It's also a school that's sort of "good at almost everything," but it's known mainly for its terrific departments + elite research faculty than for overall undergraduate name. Good school to consider if you're a highly academic student who'll consider grad school -- you can easily do as much here as you could in a school like Stanford. If you get into Stanford, obviously my best wishes are with you. But I mention Berkeley because it's much more consistent in taking high scorers like you, and few schools compare to Berkeley and Stanford in the simple wealth of top departments they offer. They're truly good at a ton of things.</p>
<p>Also, I guess my point about the tests is that...schools will <em>have</em> to be wary of them, because many can game the system [regardless of how you did], and honestly a few points on tests which aren't that deep don't make a ton of difference. Now I don't know if this is the reason there is less consistency between top scores [note, there actually statistically are NOT that many at all who score as high as this OP, despite the common "billions get 2400's, all can't be accepted" misconception] and admission. I guess I wish the really exceptionally intellectual student could get recognized just from their school + test performance to a higher degree. But in all honesty, I don't think schools like Stanford <em>want</em> to admit more of these types than they are now. They look for a diverse array of strengths.</p>