<p>“I have met HS grads in FL that cannot spell beyond 3 letter words.” </p>
<p>Totally true. After 9 years in FL (not there now) I am stunned by the state’s overall education system! Really really bad in some communities. Not much better in the ‘best’ communities. A girlfriend of mine just moved her family out of Tampa because her 4th grader went the entire year in one of the ‘better’ public elementary schools with no Science education! No Science! </p>
<p>The biggest problem that FL colleges and universities have (in looking for national respect) is that we know what they know. The majority of their students are coming out of a very questionable public school system!!</p>
<p>No science education? Again, not the fault of the school. NCLB has mandated that students pass only reading and math assessments. AYP is connected only to reading and math, with severe penalties for schools whose students do not meet state standards. What else do we expect schools to do? Elementary schools in our high poverty district have a 3 hour reading block and a 1.5 hour math block in order to drill and kill all year long for state assessments. Throw in lunch, a 15 minute recess, and specials classes, and there’s not much room for science and social studies. Our district hasn’t taught science at the elementary level in years (beyond reading a story about polar bears in the basal reader)!</p>
<p>Kids in high poverty areas come to kindergarten already 1-2 years behind their middle/upper class peers. They haven’t been read to, exposed to a print-rich environment, or taught that learning is important. Many schools have adopted the 3 hour reading block because these kids are so far behind at the very beginning, and again, state reading tests are looming starting in 3rd grade. However, try telling a kid who’s reading 3 grade levels below and has to worry about where his next meal is coming from how important it is to fill in the bubble next to the metaphor on some ridiculous test. Why should he care?? Nevertheless, schools are doing the best they can with what they have.</p>
<p>The schools respond to the government mandates - if you don’t like it, write your congressmen.</p>
<p>"Kinda defeats the purpose of the standardized test doesn’t it? "</p>
<p>-How about "Kinda defeats the purpose of the most expansive public education, unless the goal is to provide government jobs to as many as possible? "</p>
<p>Miami, you always misspell the word expensive. Expansive has a completely different definition and makes your post mean something you may not have intended.</p>
<p>Skydivemom- I really hope you don’t think I was blaming the school for no Science. The FL legislature (and governor frankly) are completely to blame. The whole entire system down there is completely messed up big time (in my honest opinion!) People in education in the State of FLorida are truly doing it for the LOVE of the profession and the kids they are teaching - and not much else!!</p>
<p>I do wish that Florida parents truly understood what FCAT (and the testing/data mentality that goes with it) has done to education in the state. I know I can’t speak for all schools…and that is really part of the problem, too much is being done as a ‘one size fits all’, but at the schools where I have worked, the students who do not pass the FCAT, and then have to be retained (3rd grade), would have been retained anyway. The sad thing is that most of them should have been retained in 1st or 2nd grade, but administrators are understandably reluctant to let students be retained during those years because they may have to be retained again because of FCAT in 3rd.<br>
FCAT tests are poorly designed. The reading test does not just test reading, it tests critical thinking (something that some students are just not developmentally ready to show mastery in) and it tests test skills. At some schools much time is dedicated to teaching test taking skills.<br>
The math test is as much a reading test as a math test. Each problem begins with an unneccessary back story (to make the problem ‘real world’) that the kids must read through to get to the actual math problem. The math problem will likely then be a problem that includes test ‘tricks’ or is a multi step problem, that again, some 3rd graders just aren’t ready for, even though they have practiced and practiced them in class.<br>
All of this leads to a year filled with a race to prep for a test instead of a year filled with mastering important foundation skills. We have to ‘get through’ x number of skills before test day (with fewer days than we used to have since several are now practice test days), so many skills get introduced so that 'at least they will not see things on the test they have never seen before). If students do not seem to be getting a specific concept…sorry we have to move on, we only have X number of days to get this all done.
I suspect that parents of the top students don’t worry too much about what FCAT has done to education, after all their kid can pass, no problem! But, imagine what those kids could be doing in class if the majority of the class time didn’t have to be devoted to getting everyone else in the class ready for the test!
I have yet to see any individual student data that truly surprised me. All the data collection gives us numbers, but it ends up just confirming what we knew anyway. We (teachers) can tell you before the results of any test come back who is at risk and needs more help.<br>
A standardized test can be used, if it is actually used as a diagnostic tool, but it should not be a high stakes test for the student or the teachers. The environment that has been created is one of ‘gotcha’ for the teachers, always wondering what we will be blamed for next. If Florida (or any state) want to improve they need to foster a environment of support for teachers and students alike, not one of competition and fear.</p>
<p>shoboe,</p>
<p>Well put. Here again, you are a veteran of trench warfare and you speak eloquently of the battle scars you bear and the atrocities you’ve seen. </p>
<p>I wasn’t in FL when the FCAT was put in place so I don’t recall the debate, if there was one, but my guess is that it was some politician, Jeb Bush probably, trying to lesgislate accountability in the public school education. As a general idea, that sounds okay. But how they did it, with as you said, a “high stakes” test with everything on the line is where they messed it up. You suggested it shoudl be used as a diagnostic (or formative) assessment not as a summative assessment that leads to someone beling held back if they fail. And, again, the idea of tying funding to academic results is foolish because anyone who teaches knows that you cna pressure the teachers all you want but of the students are lazy nothing much will happen. It is like pushing a string. You can push all you want, you can’t solve the problem by pressuring the teachers, because the teachers aren’t the problem. </p>
<p>So some politicain was trying ti impress voters and now FL students and teachers and taxpayers have this burden. </p>
<p>Both my sons did pass it. Both thought it was laughable easy. My youngest son’s first and second grade teachers BOTH recommended he be held back. In one case it became clear she hated hispanic people (we are). In both instances I went into conferences with the teacher and the principal and in both cases I insisted that he NOT be held back. I had all my comments typed up and I was completely calm and prepared. I won both battles and now my youngest son is well ahead of his peers in GPA and standardized test scores. Both teachers insisted his “gap” would only get wider if he wasn’t held back and they both felt he would fail the FCAT. One point I used was just what you said … if you hold him back now and he fails the FCAT he’ll he 25 years old by the time he gets out of elementary school. </p>
<p>I knew their data was BS. </p>
<p>I knew they were just trying to pad their FCAT scores by having kids attempt the 1st three grades multiple times. Other parents in my neighborhood fell for it and let their kids get held back without a fight. </p>
<p>I knew my son would read just fine even though he got off to a slow start. </p>
<p>That is yet another downside to the FCAT, having kids held back preemptively, that God my little son had me to fight for him.</p>
<p>Acccelil,
I suspect you live in Miami/Dade area. I honestly have compassion for teachers who are teaching kids who speak Spanish at home and neighborhood. As you well know, you cannot get a hospital job, social work, retail, legal job without being bilingual. How much harder for teachers to prepare kids for third grade FCATs in English when that is not their primary language. </p>
<p>You knew your kids could catch up with English grammar and spelling, but it is asking a lot for most kids.</p>
<p>No.</p>
<p>I live in Orlando, FL. </p>
<p>The reason my little son was behind early in his education was because his older brother got a gameboy and toys like that so my wife and my mom (his grandmom) gave the little guy the same stuff even though I said he shouldn’t get it yet. He was trying his best. </p>
<p>My wife does speak spanish at home but his primary language from day one was english. He was being lazy. He was guessing at words and ideas instead of reading them. </p>
<p>I am sure you are right though, teachers in the Miami area have a hand full.</p>
<p>I am not in Dade, but son’s school was a third Hispanic. It is so much harder for young kids when all their relatives speak Spanish, and newspapers, tv shows, etc., in Spanish.</p>