<p>Wasn’t that a character in Cats? Oh wait, that was Mr. Mistoffelees. Never mind…</p>
<p>… Channeling Emily Litella…</p>
<p>Could you imagine the uproar if this was a ceremony mocking the Muslim faith? Smh</p>
<p>Seems like there’s a breaking incident of supposed Christian “patriots” disrupting a Senate prayer because it was presided over by a Hindu clergyman:</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/07/12/AR2007071202007.html”>http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/07/12/AR2007071202007.html</a></p>
<p>It remains to be seen whether there will be evenhanded outrage from the more reasonable Christians who complain about their religion being supposedly mocked or whether we’ll hear crickets or possibly even some expressions of approval…</p>
<p>Granted, this is arguably worse in some ways because the Senate prayers have had a history of allowing clergy of different faiths preside over them and this prayer.</p>
<p>I don’t think something that happened almost 7 years ago would be a breaking incident ;)</p>
<p>But it certainly is a ridiculous and totally inappropriate incident which seems unrelated to a thread about a Satanic ritual at Harvard.</p>
<p>They have as much right to do this as do nonbelievers to do other’s religious things (eg seders). None of us have the right to control others’ legal behaviors, no matter how offensive we might find them. Why not ban most religious groups activities because they are offensive to someone outside of them? There are so many offensive ideas and practices in every religion unless it is your personal one. It doers not matter how sacred believers find them nor how many years/centuries they have pursued them. No matter what the belief system is it is not universal, provable or correct in someone’s eyes. Who cares what Catholics, Jews, Muslims, et al think? The only danger is unlawful retribution by some.</p>
<p>No organized religion owns any set of behaviors. Anyone can do a seder, mass, or other ritual- it just won’t be recognized as official by someone. I would be pleased if someone thought it worth doing a seder (purposeful use of small letter). Just because some group considers something sacred or profane does not mean it is to all. Freedom of religion means we aren’t prohibited from doing something because some religious body has declared we can’t.</p>
<p>The caveat is to stay lawful. This country has made, and continues to make, laws to protect rights. Just as people have the right to believe in mythologies, including the dominant Judeo-Christian ones, nonbelievers have the right to consider them erroneous. “Respect” is earned, not automatic. ETC. You got me on my soapbox.</p>
<p>^ Excellent post. According to the Bible, which is the primary source material for information about Satan, Satan is a liar, and a prowling lion whose main goal is to destroy mankind. In addition, he was a being who epitomized delusion and hubris, incorrectly thinking he deserved to be equal with God. So no, I wouldn’t accord Satanism respect because it entails glorifying a declared enemy of the human race.</p>
<p>Jesus was a Jew, the Last Supper was a seder, Christianity has its roots in Judaism, and Christians share Scripture with Jews. It most definitely does make sense to some Christians to hold a commemorative seder, particularly for Christian congregations with many Jewish members. My Christian church’s associate pastor is Jewish, and thus he frequently says the Communion prayers (which are seder prayers) in Hebrew. The churches that do hold seders tend to invite a Messianic Jewish rabbi to preside. Regardless, none of us truly “gets” why people of other religions believe as they do. </p>
<p>The people doing the re-enactment ARE satanists–the students went to the source. Not only are they satanists but they have an agenda–they want a satanic statue outside the OK state house. The part about the bread is to say it’s “not the real thing”. Very small distinction that I’m sure the Catholic church does not think is a big enough distinction to turn it to educational vs. a worship session. Anyone with belief in good and evil as specific beings should be able to see how performing a ritual specifically designed to worship the devil wouldn’t be a good idea. Especially on campus sanctioned by a university.</p>
<p>Why don’t people just ignore this event they way most now ignore the Westboro church creeps?</p>
<p>I think part of it is that actual rituals are to be performed in the guise of “education”. And the rituals are meant to summon evil. A lot of people believe in the power of ritual–it doesn’t matter if you believe in the ritual or not.
There is a difference between learning ABOUT a ritual and PERFORMING a ritual. Most people don’t worry about ritual for “good”.</p>
<p>“Do people actually do that?”</p>
<p>Yes, there have been news stories about churches who did not involve Jews in their Seders. Of course they have a right to do this – that’s not in question. I said that I found it to be in bad taste, which I stand by. </p>
<p>We don’t know how these Satanists conceive of the Devil or whether they believe in the Bible. My own Hebrew Bible also describes actions on the part of God that I consider evil. Some Hindus revere gods who bring darkness and destruction to humans, like Kali and Siva. A lot of deities are pretty complicated. I don’t think “Their god promotes evil” is a good way to determine which religions to respect.</p>
<p>
Paradise Lost is also a primary source. ;)</p>
<p>GFG- which communion prayers are actually seder prayers?</p>
<p>Given that there are different forms of and beliefs surrounding Communion even within the Christian universe–transubstantiation, yea or nay? being the most basic–I don’t see that anyone has a claim of owning the correct form.</p>
<p>
I am kinda guessing its not “give us this day our daily bread”. L-) </p>
<p>OK, enough religion threads for now! Please don’t start any more!</p>