Personally? Harvard because of its architecture, proximity to Boston, and I feel final clubs are a little less elitist than Yale’s societies. I’ve had friends who have gone to both and loved it.
I dont know where you live, but if it is at all possible, visit all 3 before you apply. I’ve been lucky to visit all 3 which gave me a better feel for which I liked better. As I’m sure you’ve heard, dont judge places based on ranking from US News (albeit helpful). If you’re dead set on one lf the big 3, apply to one SCEA. It’s nonbinding and they’re all need-blind, so financial aid will be covered if you need it.
I don’t know about overall elitism, but the leading finals clubs at Harvard are still all-male, while all of the landed societies at Yale have become co-ed. I think all of the eating clubs at Princeton are co-ed, although some are very selective.
This question, and indeed this whole thread, is moot until such time as one gets an acceptance to any of these fine schools. Apply to all three and see what happens. If you cannot afford to apply to all three, request a fee waiver.
@Hunt You could make a good case for the Porc and Phoenix S.K. are elitist, but I also think most of the people interested in that type of thing could get in if they wanted. It’s all about differentiating yourself, which Harvard kids mist be good at if they got in. Skull and Bones just strikes me as elitism in its purest form, but then again they run the gov’t so
Even Skull and Bones is not what it used to be. There has been a proliferation of unlanded societies at Yale, and the landed ones have lost some of their cachet. Also, the fact that they are just for seniors (and are somewhat secret) means that their impact on student life is somewhat limited. When I was there, I never knew for sure that anybody I knew was in one.
I think they also lost meaning with the term “secret society”. We don’t know exactly what S&B’s agenda is, but theres video of their seemingly juvenile initiation and any Bonesman who ever became famous was pretty open about it. Even thoughs theres no known “secret societies” at H and P, there probably really are but they’re so underground and their members keep their mouths shut that we don’t know. That could actually constitute as more elitist.
Interesting that you precieve Princeton as less preppy - that certainly wasn’t true in my day! (I think all three colleges actually have very similar demographics.) I see no reason not to apply to all three if you like all three.
Really? Since you guys went to Harvard and Yale, respectively, would you mind explaining to me what kind of students actually attend these schools? I’ve always been under the impression Harvard was a mix of kid geniuses who would run large scientific institutions one day and legacies who were a little bit more preppy and elitist (The Gates vs. the Kennedys of the world) and Yale was more artsy but still followed Harvard’s reputation as a school for brilliant kids and legacies.
Princeton I could never quite put my finger on. Living in NJ and having a lifelong fascination for the college for just an ungodly amount of reasons, I knew more people going to P than H and Y. But I’m sure people look at P in New England since they know more going to H and Y.
Even in my day, Harvard had at least 40% public school kids, it’s more like 60% now. Most are smart, but really surprising few are brilliant. I only met one in my time there that I thought was a genius then. Brilliant and charismatic conversationalist. He went on to get one of those genius grants and is well known for putting on quirky performances of Baroque operas. There were probably some math and science genius’s including dh’s 15 yo roommate (I only found out 30 years later how young he was!). Even though I attended a prep school, among my roommates, one was an international and the rest all went to public schools. We all dressed in jeans and flannel shirts and t-shirts in those days, while people at Princeton had the reputation for dressing up more. Popped collars even then. My best friends nice lives, but most are not famous. One worked for Microsoft, others for the now long-gone Dec, a bunch became doctors, one plays in the Boston Symphony, another is a conductor, two became ministers, one also published a bunch of childrens books and fantasies, one guy I knew published a best-seller and never published anything else. One is a republic/conservative gadfly and another became governor of Massachusetts. My Yale friends are no different. I only know two people who went to Princeton.
I think there are fewer of the old money gentleman C types at any of these schools now, and the students have been forced to accomplish more in high school to get it, but I’m not convinced that they are actually much smarter than they were in our day. At least from the kids I know from our high school. They are all great kids, quite a varied lot. My kid who got into Harvard (but didn’t attend) was a complete computer nerd, but most of the kids who were accepted are your basic bright all round types, very accomplished, but you aren’t blown away by their wonderfulness either.
Do you think there is a merit to applying to all three even though I am not an extremely well-qualified applicant, meaning that I did not win a major science award, etc.?
I’m no expert in admissions matters, but have some familiarity with each of these three schools for various reasons, and would say that @mathmom’s take is solid. They’re each looking to build a vibrant, varied community of students, so if your stats don’t rule you out entirely, and the atmosphere appeals to you, I’d say you should neither count yourself in nor count yourself out. Give it your best shot, but be aware that if you’re NOT operating at the same level of intensity as some of these kids, the atmosphere can be intimidating, off-putting, and not the best place to thrive for everyone. (Plus odds of getting in are slim, so don’t get your heart set on anything.)
As for character, my impression of Princeton is about 30 years old, but I’d say that back in the day it was solidly more preppy than any of the others (and the town itself very precious and whitebread) so totally turned me off at the time, but people I know who didn’t fit that description thrived there academically, and I’m sure it’s changed since. Harvard always struck me as a magnet for movers and shakers, and some of the more overtly competitive kids, but one of the loveliest young people I know went there, and loved it. As far as I know she wasn’t winning a million science prizes – she just struck me as someone who glowed with curiosity and inquiry, and I’m sure that stood out in her record and interview. Yale was definitely a complete mix of everything. Name a type, you’ll find it there (something I’m sure is actually true of the other three). It was the most attractive school to me when I was looking, but again, beware the intensity and be sure it’s for you. The other kids didn’t get there for nothing.
Not to drive this into the ground, but again, from the original post:
“Also, is it true that the atmosphere at all these schools is very uncompetitive, welcoming, and friendly? That’s the ideal environment that I would like to be at”
Seriously, does anyone read that, and think to themselves “Yeah, HYP are a great match for what the OP is looking for?”
I am not trying to make the case that HYP students are a pack of heartless, overly competitive jackals, but does “very uncompetitive” (as seen through the eyes of a high school student) sound like a good description?
@porcupine98 Because I don’t live in the US, I haven’t been able to actually visit these colleges. Regardless, in the online community, I’ve heard a lot of positive words about Boston and the small town of Princeton. However, I’ve heard so many negative things about New Haven. Is it really that dangerous/ a huge downfall of Yale?
New Haven isn’t the prettiest town in the world, and there are areas with significant problems, but the area near the university has been cleaned up significantly in recent decades, and certainly isn’t a “huge” downfall. Some might argue that it offers up a more realistic experience of city life than most, including opportunities to get involved with a community that could use the help of some bright young people. Most of the campus is very pretty indeed.
Boston is one of the greatest cities in the US, IMO. So many things to do, sights to see. Te winters are dreadful but you’ll get that with pretty much all the Ivies.
Princeton is a nice college town, but the pickings are slim when looking for attractions. Theres good restaurants in the area, but it does have good proximity to Philly and NYC, which make for good day trips for students. (funded by the university, I might add!)
EDIT: FYI, Harvard (and MIT for that matter) are located in the nearby town of Cambridge, but the two schools are still close to Boston.
You’d have to be more specific, but if you’re really not an extremely well-qualified applicant, you’ll be wasting time and money applying to any of these schools.
I agree with Hunt, all this is much adieu about nothing if you are not very well-qualified. Assuming you can obtain admission, and that is a rather profound assumption (not being snarky, but this is the case even for the most qualified) a trip to each campus will verify either your opinions and/or all of the solid perspectives provided by many posters.
Bottom line, no campus is utopia and all have their respective attributes and shortcomings. For transparency sake, my daughter is at Y, I use to work at Y, and while it is not Greenwich, CT, I have no problems with my D being there and feeling quite at ease about both the environment and the collective safety of the student body.
Yes, the commute from Cambridge to Boston is trivial. (And Cambridge is a fun place to be all by itself.) From New Haven to NYC or from Princeton to NYC or Philly would be more of a day trip.
But be sure you’re at least in the running before you bother with any of them.
