Help an desperate Asian boy shooting for Ivy/T10

Chance Me / Match Me!
1

Demographics
Asian
Rising Senior
Midwest State
Top Prep Private school (not boarding, one of top-ranked in midwest, around top50 in nation)
Male/Asian/ upper-middle class
No hooks, sibling at yale

Intended Major(s): Still deciding likely will be Economics/Sociology/Math and at Business Schools will apply business (Probably social sciences)

GPA, Rank, and Test Scores
Unweighted HS GPA: 3.95 ish
Weighted HS GPA : 4.49, top is like 4.56 but anywhere above 4.45 is good enough
Class Rank: no rank, I’d say def top 10% out of 100
ACT/SAT Scores:
36 ACT
1530 SAT not submitting
both only taken once

Coursework: take the hardest available, small school so course selection in strict aka everyone takes the same classes for the most part just depends on honors vs regular

Awards
Pain

National Merit
Prolly Ap thingy
AIME? dont know if it’s an award tbh
 only person in school tho​:yawning_face::yawning_face:
National Spanish Exam Gold Medal😭
I’m grasping at straws guys
 I’m bummed I didn’t know abt scholastic awards until later
 prolly coulda gotten gold
Help me out with awards I can enter and win stuff, not like competitions I have to prep months for, but like writing awards/scholarship type stuff

Extracurriculars sigh here’s where I fall behind Also I’m not really sure how to order this

    1. Varsity Lacrosse Player - (potential spike? diversity in the sport
 starter on top 4 team in state)
  1. Community Service Event Leader - Raise over 12000 pounds of food and 7000 dollars for annual food drive (you know those rich parents love to donate)
  2. Starting podcast through school and alumni office
 the schools high class like that😈 I would be host and founder. Talk to famous alums, hopefully continues after I graduate
  3. Starting Chapter of Business Nonprofit student-run org this year
 basically business club but the schools not holding me back now​:eyes::eyes:
  4. Business Club President (def fell off since covid
 idk abt this)
  5. Debate Club Leader/President - reviving Club
 there were literally no meetings the last two years. Starting Model Congress Team and NSDA regional tournament team
  6. Math Club - This club is my ride or die. Joined middle school, I was always the best in the school at math comps mainly bc I went to a hella competitive public school where math competitions are like a cult. But yeah, I kinda slacked off in hs once I realized bc of the school load from a top prep school wouldn’t really allow me to continue to advance. Like I was a national mathcounts level person in middle school, and now I’m just AIME Qualifier. But within my school no one else comes close. It really means a lot to me honestly. Before me my brother kinda ran it so yeah. The problem is I don’t really like deep math subject stuff like theories and principles. I prefer the problem-solving stuff. Brings a tear to my eye every time I think abt the club.
  7. Mock Trial Varsity Member (I was lead witness last year but hopefully the teacher makes me captain. That’d be huge) Work with real successful lawyers. Parent connections coming in clutch
  8. OOh fancy community project, helping out building student network. It has helped over 300 students find opportunities
 cold emailing type beat
  9. Asian Culture Club Leader - self explanatory. Fundraise for annual dinner and make some presentations

Other Stuff don’t know how to include/order/cut
Leader for an Asian American Org outside of school: tutor, phone banking, interviewing
Cello - co principal in school orchestra
Played two other varsity sports - didn’t continue
editor/writer for school’s satirical magazine
Retail Job and Camp Counselor
History Research with a professor
potentisl internship
*

Essays/LORs/Other
*Should be pretty solid, I participate a lot. I don’t always produce the tippy top work of my potential, but I definitely carry conversations and work well with others

Also going to a prep school, there are smaller class sizes, and teachers have to write less. Also they are trained on what to write and I think mine are very intelligent.
8/10
7.5/10
Counselor IDK tbh lemme know what I should talk to him abt to make him write a good one
prolly 6.5/10

Cost isn’t really considered much, very blessed. Shoutout all the people who allowed this to happen man, truly inspirational

Schools

  • Safety IU kelley, literally everyone from school gets in, otherwise Mizzou
  • Target *BC, BU, Notre Dame (prolly mendoza), UMich( cas or ross), Washu - feeder *
  • Reach UCLA, USC, UC Berkeley plus other UCs, UNC maybe UVA or Georgetown
    Northwestern,
    UT Austin Business, Maybe Cornell Dyson or Hotel / Dartmouth, NYU stern( all prolly won’t apply)
    Harvard, MIT, Stanford, Yale, Princeton, Wharton, Duke, and maybe Columbia

Right now debating between where to apply early. Will definetely apply Umich, UNC, and Indiana, but Idk abt REA, EA, or ED

My thought is that my extracurriculars like the podcast and org will be more formed, so theyll be better by rd round. Also, at the top schools, I heard rea/ea doesn’t really help, so I’m not sure I want to submit my app when It’s not quite polished.
That being said, I do wanna apply somewhere early like (MIT, Notre Dame, or HPYS) bc if i get in “hopefully” can withdraw applications to lower schools

As far as Ed, originally thinking about them (Duke, Wharton, Columbia, and Northwestern) I just dont think I’d live with myself If I got in bc then I woulda had a shot at harvard/stanford tier which is what i want. Also Wharton has it’s flaws I’ve heard. so yeah

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should have a well staffed, knowledgeable and professional college advising office that can tell you where you’re likely to be able to gain admission.

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SCEA at Harvard certainly helps. Go have a look at the data from the recent lawsuit. But EA at Chicago doesn’t necessarily help, but ED1 or ED2 will.

I would say just pick whatever is your #1 choice and apply early. You say you’re top 10. But is that out of a class of 100? or 1000? Makes a huge difference. If your estimated class rank is top 1-2% then you would be within range for HYPMS. But if its top 5-10% then I would be more cautious.

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Nah nowadays you can’t trust the counselors, especially with COVID, they know like nothing. Theyre all stuck in the past. Also they got this higher moral standard when I comes to telling you your chances. They keep saying the same, I don’t know, you have a shot at all the places. In reality, it’s just the individuals at the school that are keeping the rep up.

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What do the dedicated college counselors who probably have plenty of historical knowledge and connections / insider knowledge say about how well each of the colleges views you in terms of fit (for them, not necessarily for you)?

Even if you are not recruited, a high level athletic EC may be attractive to a smaller private college that needs a pool of walk-ons to fill its sports teams.

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There’s only like 110 kids in my grade. I am estimating that I am at the top. With such a small number of people, many which are very smart, and limited flexibility and courses top 10% is very good.

In perspective, for last years class (where they’re going not got in)
2 going to harvard
3 to stanford
1 to columbia, brown, yale, princeton, mit, cornell
4 to uchicago(some were recruited)
2 to hopkins
2 to usc film

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Then your GCs know their stuff. Trust what they are telling you more than strangers on the internet who have no ability to judge you in the context of your school.

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Also, if you are a starter on one of the top 4 lacrosse teams in the state, why not pursue athletic recruiting?

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You are competitive at any university in the US (and the top schools in Canada would be close to safeties). However, “competitive” is not the same as “will get in”.

One recommendation is that you make sure that you are happy with your safeties.

The other recommendation is that you look at your reach and match schools, and think about which ones would be the best fit for you. Only apply ED if you are sure that it is your first choice and sure that you can afford it (which I gather means full pay in your case).

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Exactly. Talk to your GC about your list and strategy. To me (a total stranger) you lack a spike and your list seems way too extreme-reach heavy, but maybe you’re at a great feeder school. The track record you posted looks exceptional.

For most students, ECs like yours (broad, not deep, and mostly at school level) don’t move the needle all that much. And let’s face it, 20,000 students will have similar academic stats to you. AIME is a plus.

You’re thinking about it backwards. It’s not about your achievements or qualifications. It’s about what you can do for the college.

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This times 100.

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I think you need to emphasize this over some of the more pedestrian stuff. It’s the ONLY thing here that caught my attention. Do you spend a lot of time on this? Being editor is a big deal. Harvard has a very famous satirical magazine, the Harvard Lampoon. The history research might also be interesting. I don’t believe in spikes, tbh. I don’t think they are at all necessary. You have plenty on your resume.

The podcast idea, meh. You’re late in the game for that, IMO. Unless you can make it pretty substantial in a short amount of time, I don’t think it should go on your app. It’s going to sound totally fake, IMO.

Your list is too long. Are you going to be happy to attend your safeties? There are other schools that might be of more interest to you, which would probably be safe if you showed interest. What about LACs? I imagine Pomona, Amherst, Swarthmore or Carleton would like you. Maybe remove some of the obvious USNWR schools and add a couple of LACs.

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Of the schools he listed (he didn’t list any smaller private schools), I doubt even one has any walk on players, or would give a speck of preference to a possible walk on. Duke, ND, Ivies? Not lacking for lacrosse players and expecting walks ons is like expecting to walk on at Alabama football, much too rare to consider it when picking an application list. Several of the schools listed only have Club lacrosse for men (Stanford, UCLA, Cal, USC) and admissions doesn’t care about filling out a club team.

I’m not saying not to mention it on the app and I do think admissions will like to see that EC (and give the points for an athletic EC), but don’t count on it helping that much. At that level, you are either a recruit or not.

It would depend on the state. Top 4 in Maryland? A big deal. Huge (and coaches would be all over him by now). Top 4 in Wisconsin or Iowa? Not so much. Certainly could be recruited to SOME schools, but not Duke or Yale or ND.

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Wait. You think your 36 ACT is so low that you are seriously thinking of applying TO to HYPS but that applying ED will somehow make a difference? The sooner you get rid of this magical thinking, the better.

ETA: I don’t think squeezing a few more points out of more tests will move the needle. Don’t fall into the trap of applying ED to HYPS.

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He isn’t applying TO. He is submitting his ACT, but not his SAT.

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ED does make a difference to those schools.

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At a different kind of school, you would probably be described as “average excellent” and I would say that you needed to focus more on matches and safeties. A lot of what you have on your list, like Michigan, ND, and BC, probably need to be bumped up to reaches.

Given your school’s track record, though, I would say your list is fine.

Where your counselor can help, though, is knowing which school is the best fit for you and predicting where you will have the best ED/SCEA success (ED absolutely can make a difference for a student like you). If your counselor says that 5 of the top students are likely applying early to the same school, it’s useful to know because you may want to choose a different ED school. That’s information we won’t have.

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As others have said
your counselors will know better. But next to that, the record of the last couple of classes will give you some guidance. You’ve listed places people got in. Do you know what hooks they had? Are any of the successful candidates recruited athletes, legacies, URMs, first gen, celebrities’ kids, children of major donors or potential donors? Among the unhooked, do you know what their awards and ECs looked like? Are yours as strong? If students who had no hooks and no outstanding awards or ECs got into the top schools, then obviously, you’ve got a chance.

But if the kids who got into Columbia and Brown applied ED and you’re not willing to do that
realize that means they had a strong plus for admission that you lack.

Also, as others have mentioned, it may matter who else in your class is applying to the same college and in the same round. For example, if you aren’t willing to apply to Brown, Columbia and other colleges ED and there are people with as strong or almost as strong records as yours who are willing to do this, it will hurt, especially if there are multiple people applying ED who get in early. And while it shouldn’t matter, I think it will be self-evident to colleges that fin aid considerations aren’t what held you back. How are your teachers and counselors going to rate you compared to the other people in your class applying to the same schools?

Because truth is that from where I sit, your ECs aren’t strong enough to get you an admit to Harvard, MIT, Stanford, Princeton. A lot of your ECs seem to be things you’re just starting this year. Being captain of the mock trial team isn’t a great EC, for example. Thousands of mock trial captains will apply to the colleges on your list. It’s how the team has performed in competitions and your contribution to its record that matters. You say you’re reviving the debate team and it’s been dead the last two years
I assume that means you didn’t qualify for TOCs or win any major tournaments? You’re starting a podcast and some sort of non-profit this year? Too little, too late, I suspect.

What score did you get on the AIME? At the top tier schools, especially those that are very strong in math, qualifying isn’t that big a deal. It’s the score that matters–especially whether you are a USAMO qualifier.

Now, if your school is truly extraordinary, I may be way off base and you may have much better odds than I suspect. Again, your counselors will know much more about that than anyone on this board will. Or maybe your parents are potential major donors. Your counselors will know that too.

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Applications to BU and BC have increased a lot, so these would most likely be reaches. If you are a Michigan resident, UMich would be a target, otherwise, it would be a reach, and unless you are at a Catholic feeder school or you are a double legacy, ND is a reach. I’ll take your word on WashU.

Good luck!

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I have high respect for BC and BU, and they, especially BC, have indeed become much more selective, but in our school which is a highly respected private that sounds a lot like the poster’s it is incredibly rare for a student with those stats not to be admitted. I think viewing BC as target is fair, with BU as a safety.

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