First time post…I’m greatly troubled by the FA my daughter (17) has been offered following Professional Judgment review and I’m wondering if my expectations are just way off base OR if the fact that this is a review/appeal is reducing what I should expect from FA. I lost my job over a year ago (but after the period covered by FAFSA); I remain unemployed. That reduced our family total salaries by 90%! We’ve had to sell a number of assets, which with capital gains and all resulted in a 2019 AGI of about 90K for family of 4; I’m 62 and wife is 58 and youngest is 12. There are certainly people WORSE off than we are; I’ve fortunately put away some retirement funds and have had to start soc. sec. but we will be in a bit of struggle, especially w/ college for 2 kids. I calculate (online) our EFC as ~$22K. Daughter was accepted at NYU/Fordham and one other (YAY!!!). We’ve given up on NYU due to cost, even after FA and now are focused on Fordham. Initial FA offer (prior to appeal numbers) was ~ 23K/yr (TC is ~80K). Post appeal offer is an additional 5K (total of 28K/yr; resulting in family cost of ~52K). I’m shocked and expected significantly higher aid. (1) Am I way off base in expectation even though EFC suggests EFC of 22K? (2) Are we likely to get more FA next year when FAFSA (from start) reflects greatly reduced income? I’m so disappointed as daughter has heart set on Fordham and I just really want to make sure I’m not missing/misunderstanding anything. Much thanks for any input!!!
You are looking at $50,000 a year in net costs…is that affordable? What about that other acceptance? Is it affordable.
You have appealed and gotten the results for Fordham. I’m not sure there is anything else you can do regarding Fordham at this time. Either you can pay their calculated net cost or not.
If not, then your student needs to choose a more affordable college.
I don’t believe Fordham guarantees to meet full need for all accepted students. If that is the case, there is no guarantee you will receive additional aid in subsequent years…but maybe you will.
I would suggest you call the Fordham financial aid office and ask them. They won’t be able to give you a guarantee answer but they probably can at least give you information.
In my opinion…lots of colleges will be facing thousands of college students with reduced or lost income in the years to come. Even the most generous colleges will likely have trouble meeting all these additional needs.
Thank you thumper1!
I realize we need to make a decision that doesn’t put our family in severe financial hardship. All 3 schools have very good programs; my daughter (and we) are blessed to even have the options.
My experience w/ NYU soured me a bit; they indicated I should expect the exact same aid next year (indicating no negative impact due to it being an appeal…even though it appears the school then needs to find additional funds later in their process…when they have less funds/any? available. I will certainly call Fordham Monday to ask the same question of them; I’m not hopeful they will give us any hope of getting more aid next year; to do so only creates risk for them.
I agree…colleges are going to be under ridiculous pressure given fallout from Pandemic…and again, I’m thankful that so far the worst problem we have is determining if our daughter has to go to her 3rd (last) choice of schools!
Thanks for your feedback and stay safe.
This is a difficult situation. Aid is based on prior, prior year information. Are you in NYS? With a $90k AGI it sounds like you’re eligible for the Excelsior. That covers tuition at a SUNY.
Fordham does not meet 100% demonstrated need. Don’t look for 100% of your need to be met in year 2/3/4, it is just not going to happen.
I think that you and your family will need to look at a financially feasible option for 4 years as you will have to apply for aid for 4 years.
The worse thing to happen is that tour daughter would have to leave during junior senior year because the cost of attending is not sustainable fir your family.
austinmshauri: Thanks for the comment. We ARE in NYS! and recognize we probably eligible for free tuition. The research I did early on caused me to believe we would get more aid given our situation…so we let daughter go forward with the 3 schools she prefered. That said, SUNY Purchase has a very good program (Theater) as well. At this point we’ll probably find a way to have her start at non-SUNY and see where we end up in a year (job/ Fin Aid) leaving open the potential transfer option.
Thanks!!
Sybbie719: Agreed. We certainly weren’t looking for meeting 100% of aid needed…but thought we would certainly get something higher (closer to 55% versus the 30% we were offered). Online information seems to suggest their AVERAGE aid is a minimum of 5k+ more than we are getting and thought we would get over average.
You mention that you are 62 and taking social security. Make sure you are getting the additional social security benefit of having a child at home that is under age 18. This is an often overlooked government benefit and DOES NOT reduce your benefit. It is additional dollars provided and you must use it towards your child’s expenses - even private school tuition, a car, clothes, etc. It will last until your child turns 18. It seems crazy on many levels - but offers more funds for older parents.
coffeeat3: YES! Thank you! I’m aware of that excellent benefit that is very helpful at this time…roughly an extra 50% of my full SS from now till he turns 18. Never expected to need to dip into SS at 62, but this benefit helps!
Is the NYS Excelsior available for transfers? Is your daughter on board with the idea of transferring out of Dream School if money is not forthcoming later on? Does she really understand that this could be a possibility? If she is planning on a career in theater then you might want to save the cash to support her in low income work for a while post grad - and she may want/need grad school too.
We couldn’t afford our EFC and daughter took the merit scholarship at a large southern state school which we would never have considered is not for the $… she is getting a great education, is having a good time and we have spare cash to assist with study abroad, internships and other programs.
If your student is a theater major, i would suggest she start a program and stay there. That way she can sort of make a name for herself…and get more opportunities as an upperclass student.
Purchase has a fine theater program.
With the theater arts as they are now (completely shut down) this student and you do not need any debt at all when she graduates. It’s going to be hard enough for current theater employees to keep jobs. New entries will have even more difficulty in my opinion.
If your kid is a theater major, tell her to get as many courses and resume building experiences as possible in the tech parts of the industry…lights, sound, sets, stage managing, etc. Those folks have more varied job prospects.
@happymomof1 would you like to add?
Check the rules of Excelsior. I think it’s good for $3k at private schools, but you have to apply now or I don’t think you can get it in years 2-4. I think once you qualify you could transfer to a SUNY and get the entire grant. Check HESC for details. @sybbie719 will know how it works.
That is if Fordham takes excelsior.
Many privates who take it would have to freeze tuition. i dont believe that they participate in Excelsior.
i just googled fordham university excelsior. on their site they show excelsior and the benefit at SUNY/CUNY.
i dont think they participate in excelsior
Here is the situation, which others have already addressed: the two schools involved here do not guarantee to meet full need. Even schools that do so do not meet full need as defined by FAFSA EFC, and its always a throw of the dice when it comes to professional judgement due to a job loss. Though you may not think it the case, most folks in this country would think the $90k you lived on after job loss as a mighty rich salary. In financial aid offices, there would be many professional judgement appeals where job loss and other financial hits truly brought catastrophic financial results.
The fact of the matter is that you somehow CAN afford to pay the $50k+ bill for these schools this upcoming year. So these schools are not off in their reckoning. There is also a decent chance you’ll cough up the difference each subsequent year somehow if DD is happy and doing well. This is an old story and the colleges know it well.
It’s up to you to decide whether you are going to make that leap into paying those amounts that are going to involve loans and other stretches, or go with what’s more affordable. You are lucky to be living in a state where most of the tuition is waived in state schools under your circumstances. You want to go the private route, you pay.
I vote with @thumper1 on this. Students from my area (DC suburbs) often go to SUNY Purchase for theater. It has a very strong regional reputation.
It is much better to begin at a place that she knows she can afford for all four years so that she builds up the connections in the department for increasingly valuable casting/tech assignments. Happykid began at a community college that has a very strong theater program, and walked into good assignments at her transfer school because of the connections between her CC and that university. Transfers from other places weren’t so lucky.
I also vote for all the stage management and theater tech work that your kid can fit into her program wherever she lands. Happykid and her tech/design pals have always found work in theater while the acting-only students were cashiering at Trader Joe’s. The stage managers have all been able to find jobs that use their management and organizational skills when they have been between long-term stage management gigs.
Wherever she does end up, it is almost certain that the fall semester will be online, and that there will be no conventional productions until 2021? 2022?. That is what the people I know in college theater are getting ready for. With the conventional performance spaces closed, new forms of the art are being born as we type here. So perhaps her questions for Fordham and Purchase should include the faculty’s and students’ plans for contributing to the development of Theater of Zoom.
I greatly appreciate the quick response with answers, advice and philosophy on this subject. Obviously there is more detail than I could put in initial post…the 90K AGI last year was due to significant selling of assets (Cap Gains). AGI would have been about 55K w/o CGs. I fully understand we are not the family in the MOST need; but we are well within the ranks of those who get financial Aid. We hear anecdotal stories from others in the schools involved and it “appears” they got quite a bit more aid for what “appears” to be families with similar situations.
As such, my main question is trying to understand what the impact, if any, on our aid amount was due to having to go through Professional Judgment process versus if our initial FAFSA reflected our new, much lower income reality.
Are we likely to get more FA next year when FAFSA process (from start) reflects our new, greatly reduced income? If anyone can shed light on that it would be very helpful. Thanks to all for contributions!!!
Sorry…I should have mentioned my daughter is targeting Theater Production…focus of Light Design (has 1.5 years hands-on experience beyond highschool productions.)
My son went to a university that did not meet full need. When his little sibling began college, his FAFSA EFC dropped from the full cost of attendance to $22,000 a year which was less than 1/2 the cost of attendance. He got a rousing $250 added to his merit award, and Not a nickel more of need based aid.
I would not count on getting additional money, and certainly not a substantial amount, in subsequent years. This school does not meet full need. Their only real obligation to you in terms of aid is the Direct Loan your kid can get. It will be $6500 for her second year.
I think you are hoping for grant money…I would suggest you not hope for that.
Purchase used to have a fabulous theater tech program. As @happymomof1 noted, there will be some changes to how these programs need to operate given that the lights are dark at all performing arts venues right now.
My husband was a theater techie who freelanced in NYC for a number of years. We still have a number of friends working in the industry. They are all unemployed right now, and are very worried about the future right now.
That being the case…I’d go for a place where the cost is affordable, and hopefully college debt can be at a bare minimum to none.
If the colleges don’t meet need then I wouldn’t expect more aid. Colleges are losing lots of money right now. I don’t think they have a lot to give.
You don’t mention a few key variables, notably home equity and non retirement savings. Those could have a big impact. FAFSA is pretty much irrelevant for school based aid if they use the css profile. Run their NPC with your current info and play around with the numbers to see the impact of savings and equity. If the result based on your actual numbers differs a lot from what they’re offering, it’s probably worth a follow up to ask why, and whether the NPC estimate will be more accurate for future years. But as others have said, Fordham doesn’t promise to meet need, and they’ll also be hit pretty hard financially so I’m not sure I’d expect things to get better. You’re fortunate to have SUNY access at a great cost. You might consider how you’ll feel stretching financially if the fall or entire year is online, both of which are quite possible.