Help!! He's only interested in 2 schools.

College Majors Music Major
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<p>People offered a lot of information because everyone on here in one way or the other is facing the same thing when it comes to music, it is extremely hard to find your way through this process. It is true you asked for a list of programs, but you also threw in that your son had changed his mind suddenly, and that is what drew people’s attention, that’s all. Part of the problem is you can’t just ask for a list of suggestions, when no one knows what you criteria is, there are literally many hundreds if not thousands of schools offering the Music Ed degree, all over the country, and at different levels, if all you want is a list of schools with music ed degrees you can get that off the net or in a college guide book <em>shrug</em>. </p>

<p>Might be better to frame out more what your son is looking for, simply saying a ‘good music ed school’ is still going to be way broad.</p>

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<p>Welcome to CC, and internet forums. Thats what we do, we over analyze everything, thats just the way that a lot of us roll.</p>

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<p>I believe the Hartt school would be worth looking at.</p>

<p>James Madison University in VA is strong for music ed and alums are successful in graduate performance program admissions.</p>

<p>May have missed it, but is your son a vocalist or an instrumentalists? What state are you in? In which state does your son want to settle and teach? Often state schools are very strong in music ed. Many are also very strong in performance.</p>

<p>Sent from my DROID RAZR using CC</p>

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<p>I will put in a second for Oberlin’s Master in Music Teaching program which lasts 14 months after the a BM in either performance or composition. It would mess best with a BM from Oberlin, but Composition or Performance BM’s from other schools can apply for the program.</p>

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<p>If my kid were interested in music ed I’d encourage him to apply to state schools in my own state.</p>

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<p>I tend to agree with GH on that one, to minimize the cost of going. For example U Mich has a great music schools (and I believe music ed), but as an out of state applicant, it would also be very expensive. Plus if a student is even thinking of teaching someplace in that state, might make certification easier.</p>

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<p>Plug for Jacobs at IU. My son is super happy there this fall, not music ed but we met extremely happy music ed students when we went for audition weekend, and some others at orientation. It’s a huge school, but feels cozy, with good support & a great vibe.</p>

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<p>It just occurred to me that it might help to find out where his middle & high school music teachers got their degrees, and what they think about it. My son is at his high school band director’s alma mater :)</p>

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<p>My daughter’s high school band director speaks very highly of his alma mater, St. Olaf’s, but again it depends on what your son’s instrument is.</p>

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<p>LOL. That’s because making a GOOD recommendation for you is just as complicated as analyzing situations over the computer ;)</p>

<p>Here’s a summary of what we need to know to recommend suitable programs – every program has a different flavor, has pockets of strength or lack thereof that can be instrument-specific - have other restraining or enhancing elements:</p>

<p>1) What primary instrument does your son play</p>

<p>2) How many years has he been playing; has he received regional and national recognition/award and had extensive private instruction (sounds like yes)</p>

<p>3) Does he intend to teach at the secondary level; or instead teach privately/at college level (sounds like latter - but uncertain. This determination is worth making in advance.)</p>

<p>4) Are there prohibitive fiscal issues – or is your family in a position to manage the expense of private/OOS school – or is it critical that he receive scholarship assistance.</p>

<p>5b) Is your family likely to qualify for financial aid? </p>

<p>6) What aspects of Cleveland, Curtis, NEC turned your son off those schools, and possibly off a performance path?</p>

<p>7) As you pointed out, kids change their minds. If he were to change his mind after a year, presumably you’d want him to already be at a school where he could switch into performance via audition, or have an alternate degree to pursue (eg. just for argument sake, math.) So IF he changed his mind about music ed, what kind of level of rigor would suit his academic nature, and what level of music school (eg. sounds like conservatory) would suit his performance capability?</p>

<p>8) What is his unweighted GPA and SAT score?</p>

<p>Of course, you don’t have to answer any of these questions. But if you do, I predict you may receive some bonafide guidance.</p>

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<p>One thing to consider is the primary instrument teacher at the college as even with Music Education that should be a key consideration. At colleges such as Penn State and Rutgers standards are the same for Music Ed as a Performance degree I believe. Indiana University, Temple and University of North Texas are other locations to consider but most large state schools will provide a great education in this area.</p>

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<p>Thanks kmcmom13,</p>

<p>1) Percussion</p>

<p>2) 8 years playing, yes to recognition and private instruction</p>

<p>3)ultimately collegel level teaching</p>

<p>4) scholarship assistance needed</p>

<p>5) yes some</p>

<p>6) wants a more rounded education then just working exerpts, has realized he doesn’t think he wants to play in a pro orchestra, more interested in solo marimba material/ teaching</p>

<p>7) definately conservatory level/ mid 90’s average student</p>

<p>Thanks again kmcmom13 your approach with me was great!!!</p>

<p>Bigdjp</p>

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<p>I have one more question: does he want to teach applied percussion at the college level or is he interested in teaching band/orchestra at the college level? That makes a big difference in how he should approach his undergrad. My husband is a university band director, got his undergrad in music ed, masters in conducting and PhD in music ed, but most applied professors have performance degrees for their undergrad and MM and DMA for post bachelors. So, where he eventually wants his career to lead is what should guide him…but, one’s career path can always change, as you already know!</p>

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<p>Awesome! I’d second sax lady’s observation and aim for schools where both approaches are possible, since kids do indeed change direction!</p>

<p>Has he checked out University of Michigan at all? Out of State tuition is very steep, but if a person might qualify for fin aid, and they have high academic stats as well, and they’re highly desired on instrument, there are cases where the school can be quite generous despite it’s official party line as a public that does not meet OOS need. Because it’s school of music is larger, there are a lot of course options for the “well rounded” effect, and a lot of academic avenues to pusue as well. It does offer conducting as a concentration as well.</p>

<p>My son attends the som, so I am more familiar with it than other
schools. I do have some pals on the east coast who are musicians and
profs that have told me the percussion is very strong at umich, but I
don’t know enough about percussion directly to corroborate.</p>

<p>I don’t know which state you’re in, but I’d also second the suggestion to
investigate in state programs. If there is an instate school with strong academics AND a conseratory level music school, I think that mifpght be
a good “fiscal” saftety of sorts, not that any music program is a safety.</p>

<p>I believe someone suggested Oberlin earlier. Oberlin meets full
demonstrated need, although I can’t speak to their definition of need. </p>

<p>Someone also mentioned Indiana Jacobs – again they ave a robust set
of offerings due to size – and their out of state tuition is IMHO much
more reasonable (compared to Michigan). In terms of academic rigor,
your son might be a titch above median, eg in the top 25 percentile)
which may qualify him for automatic entrance scholarships. Many educators and individual performers hail from Jacobs. I believe UNT
(north Texas) Has a similar scope.</p>

<p>There suggestions are all sounding midwestish I realize and I’m sure
folks will have more suggestions particularly as it relates to percussion.
On other thought that popped into my head was McGill in Montreal -
rigorous u. In a great city for musical variety, very strong music school
at shulich, very competitive pricing compared to US Schools.</p>

<p>If you’re looking for conservatory level and rigor, I’d be remiss not to mention USC. It’s private and not inexpensive but it is also a “meet need” school.</p>

<p>Hope that helps somewhat. I’m sure others will chime in who have searched specifically percussion programs. It is still really all about the teacher, so your son needs to take a look/listen at percussionists in studio at additional schools. When you’re shopping for best fit and best fiscal situation, you need a wider net than two schools – the resulting financial impact is just too great to narrow your choices like that.</p>

<p>That said, once my son was notified of early EA scholarship at his top program, which for his (multi) discipline was Michigan, he withdrew his
application from his other choices. (we didn’t have a full pkg info at that point, but he did find out about a generous academic scholarship in mid December, so that was enough to conclude it.) So if you start with
more, you then have options.</p>

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<p>Oberlin Conservatory and College do have good scholarships based on financial need. Many free-standing conservatories do not (they cannot afford this). Bard Conservatory would also. And others. State schools would, of course, be more affordable than privates if you don’t take financial aid into account, but often with aid, privates can be cheaper.</p>

<p>I could be wrong because I don’t know that much about music ed, but I thought that for college level teaching it would be better to study the subject as an undergrad, not study education. In other words, I would have thought performance would be a better undergrad focus, or possibly even a BA in music (theory, history, tech., ethnomusicology, composition etc.). The college professors we know either have their DMA or PhD. For some, an MM also gains them entry into a teaching job, at a community college for instance.</p>

<p>I think of undergrad music ed as being geared to k-12 teaching.</p>

<p>It helps a lot to have more information,so it’s great you were able to provide it. Otherwise, people fill the vacuum by focusing in what you do say, rather than trying to figure out what you don’t say. Your original post presented the switch from performance to music ed as a “problem,” and there are a lot of nice people here (the music forum seems to be one of the nicest) who will try to help people with problems :)</p>

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<p>Ps, if your son is into jazz, I believe Peter Erskin is at USC. I also forgot to mention university of Miami - Frost – top program with Richard Bravo on Latin. Two great schools where student body stats are similar to your son’s. I also may have underplayed UNT’s reputation for percussion since we never visited/applied there and I don’t know how rigorous the school is academically. A number of my son’s jazz friends did/have and it’s especially attractive to percussionists.</p>

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<p>PPs Here is a young composer/percussionist I enjoy [url=&lt;a href=“http://www.ericguinivan.com/html/biography.html]Biography[/url”&gt;http://www.ericguinivan.com/html/biography.html]Biography[/url</a>]</p>

<p>He went to Indiana Jacobs and then got his master’s at U. of Southern CA and is based in Los Angeles. He now teachers at USC.</p>

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<p>From your 8/31 post, it looks as though your son is more interested in college level teaching than K-12, if that is correct he should try for the best conservatory and teacher that he can afford without a lot of debt. If he doubles music ed (k-12) and performance, he will find that the learning the tech instruments will interfere with practice on his primary and slow down the progress necessary on his percussion instruments to be tops in his field. If he wants to teach K-12 then a music ed degree and certification and connections from a good music ed school should be primary in his search.
I recommend that he put Fredonia or Potsdam on the list as a financial safety especially if you are NYS residents. With music fees, books, tuition, room and board the Cost of Attendance (COA) for both would come in around $20,000.00. Since your son has good grades, both state schools would also provide academic scholarships and if he is gifted then they will also extend music scholarship money, too, which could easily bring overall COA below $10,000. Both state schools regularly send their grads onto top music schools for their masters degrees.</p>