Here’s the situation: My son is a hs senior who has applied to FAFSA-only colleges, as well as to those that also require the CSS Profile. My income is low enough to qualify for the Simplified Needs Test, so I didn’t have to fill out the asset questions on the FAFSA. But I do have to complete the asset questions on the CSS Profile, which is due between Feb 1 and Feb 15 for these schools. Originally I had decided not to file the Profile because I have significant assets from a couple of inheritances. I am sure I wouldn’t qualify for any institutional need-based aid. Is there any reason that I should file the CSS Profile? If I decide to file the Profile, can these colleges take away the Pell Grant when they see I have assets? Can the CSS schools share my asset information with the FAFSA-only schools? In this situation, is there any down side to filing the CSS Profile? Thank you in advance for helping me.
Your student would remain PELL eligible and also entitled to direct loans including the subsidy for them even at the PROFILE school, as those are entitlements that come from the federal government. The PROFILE is for money that is controlled to some degree, or completely by the schools themselves. It is entirely possible and happens often enough to have even a zero EFC and get full PELL, Subsidized Direct loans, state monies and other money that hinge only on the FAFSA and be in a situation where a student is not eligible for a dime of institutional aid.
A close friend of mine has two kids who were in that situation. They could get PELL, state aid, subsidized direct loans based on her financials everywhere, but no school funds from those schools that wanted a NCP supplement.
There is no down side to filing PROFILE. Your student will still get PELL and direct loans at the PROFILE schools even if the PROFILE info does not make them eligible for school aid.
Thank you very much. Would there be any up side to filing the CSS Profile?
No, federal and state aid that is based on Fafsa alone will not be taken away based on assets entered on profile and no, schools don’t share your financial info with other schools.
Thank you. I have a follow-up question. If I were to file the CSS Profile, do you think these schools would take into consideration that I am totally disabled and have no ability to earn money? The inheritance money is the only money I will have for retirement and to send a younger child to college as well. Unfortunately, I have not put the money into any accounts earmarked for retirement.
Run the NPCs for the schools your student is considering and see what they expect the family contribution to be. That is the best, closest way to see what you can expect. That you don’t have the money into any qualified account means that they are NOT sheltered assets for PROFILE purposes. The schools are not likely to take your disability and lack of ability to earn money into consideration from what I have seen.
I have a friend who was/is in your situation. He was disabled, and retired early, got large settlement from employer and parlayed it into realestate. The houses/apts were his retirement nest egg and the income they gave, modest but sufficient (about $60K a year) was what the family lived off of. Harvard supposedly gives full freight for families earning less than that amount, but his son did not get a dime. He appealed the case to no avail. The problem was that if he sold any of his holding and used proceeds to pay for college as Harvard said he could do, the income from that unit would be gone, reducing family income, not to mention diminishing his retirement possibilities. Borrowing (which was not likely due to the type of housing this was) would cause the same cash flow problem since the loans would have to be repaid. But Harvard, a school that is known to be most generous would not budge.
I get what you’re saying, cptofthehouse, from your story about your friend. My son is looking at some expensive technical schools - RPI, WPI, Stevens. I ran the NPC’s and we would get nothing in financial aid. This leaves me in the position of paying almost full freight for him (and for his younger sibling) which I think is a bad idea given the situation. But my other alternative is not great either…telling him he can’t go to these schools. He was accepted into one of these schools, but only got $11,000 in merit aid. We’re still waiting on the other two. I am a single mom and I feel like I have failed him.
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I am a single mom and I feel like I have failed him. <<<
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No, you haven’t. You aren’t obligated to spend your savings on college. You’re going to need that for your future. Actually, it could be argued that you would fail your kids if you didn’t prepare for your retirement with your inheritance, and instead became a burden to them.
Your son will do well no matter where he lands.
Intellectually, I know you are right, mom2collegekids. Yet, I still feel badly about it. Thanks for your reply.
I was in same boat as you, except I was laid off. The profile schools had a huge range. Both kids were high stats so they got merit up to 30K, but at a 50K school that is not enough. FA varied from none at several prestigious schools to quite a bit from Denison and Case Western, which may use their own forms. I found the NPCs to be quite accurate. One of my sons ended up at the state flagship (FAFSA) for engineering and the other at a lower tier FAFSA LAC for chemistry. Both got substantial merit, partial pell grants, sub loans, WS and some institutional financial aid. Neither school met FAFSA EFC but they were a lot cheaper than the profile schools. Both thrived. I did tell my sons up front that if the numbers weren’t there they couldn’t go. They viewed it as a challenge to find the best school for the cheapest price. I did feel guilty owning a house and getting Pell, but schools never embarassed me about it and it passed verfication.
It helps to know I’m not the only one in this situation. I’m glad things worked out well for your sons, sportlich. I think I’m going to give your challenge to my son (find the best school for the cheapest price). I just wish he had applied to more FAFSA-only schools.
If you are eligible for the full Pell Grant, then you have a FAFSA EFC of $0. If you would be full pay at a Profile school, this means you would be paying more that $40,000 a year in costs…maybe even more than $50,000 in costs.
Assets are not assessed at full value even at Profile schools. This means you have quite a bit in assets to have a family conribution that is full pay.
Are you saying that all of your assets will be used up if you use them to fund college costs?
I’m not eligible for the full Pell Grant. Eligible for less than half of it. If I pay in full for two kids at Profile schools, I would still have some left over, but not enough IMO since I’m only 55.
I’m not an expert on how much you can annually put into a retirement account…but perhaps you should consider that. Do the annual maximum.
Are your kiddos strong students who might be able to get good merit awards someplace? That is also worth consideration.
And lastly, are your instate publics more affordable, since you hope to have both money for college and money for retirement?
ETA…income threshold is only one of the simplified needs test criteria. Did you also meet the other…eligibility to file a 1040a or 1040 EZ, receipt of a means tested benefit like free or reduced lunch or snap, or dislocated worker? I’m assuming yes, if the FAFSA skip logic skipped those asset questions…but just asking. You don’t have to reply here.
There are schools that are more holistic than others in giving out financial aid and may make exceptions for circumstances. They can do what they please with their own money. So do appeal your case to each school fin aid office. The more desired your student is as a “catch” , the better the chances at some schools that aid can be granted. I have seen some merit awards for which eligibiliity is to be PELL eligible or need eligible, but the amount could be more than the need by school formula. So by all means, give it a go, but be aware that it may ot happen.
I feel that there is a huge difference between two families making the same income but one has substantial assets, even if those are “meant for retirement” but not in retirement accounts.
However, I do think that having a parent on full disability should be taken into account as well. Harvard “not budging” meaning the friend would be paying $240,000 of their inheritance assets, that aren’t even liquid, was amazing, but again, not being in a 401k or IRA probably hurt tremendously (heck, one can use other assets for anything, right?).
As for “deciding not to file Profile”, RPI requires it I believe, or your son won’t get any financial aid. I didn’t think there were any schools that were CSS Profile optional, just those that only needed FAFSA and those that needed both FAFSA and CSS Profile. To be honest, it sounds like you are trying to hide your money from the colleges (and based on the story about Harvard, I could see why).
Also - you mentioned “assets” - there is a difference between:
- cash in the bank
- an open HELOC with substantial loan potential from home equity
- owning properties
- owning properties AND getting rental income from them
As for “CSS schools sharing info with FAFSA schools” - that’s kind of ridiculous. FAFSA schools want FAFSA, and colleges are busy enough without wanting both but not asking for both but snooping around because they really want to know…
I’d say he should look at several FAFSA only schools, and then you can compare.
I’m not trying to hide assets from the colleges. If that was my intent, I certainly wouldn’t post on here. If my son is entitled to Pell, then he should get it. If he is not eligible for institutional aid, he won’t get any. It’s as simple as that. I want to do things honestly and legally. I was trying to avoid filling out a long, complicated form (CSS Profile) if there would be no benefit to doing so.
@Flash789 My son is in the same situation. Only got 10k off for WPI. That still leaves ALOT and we can only do 25 a year. We won’t touch property or investments. He doesn’t want any debt. He has several state flagships to chose from. I went to one and RPI for grad. He can go wherever he wants for grad school. That is life.
Flash789, if you do all the forms without the insurance money, will he qualify for Pell? Just using your income, his income, other assets? How about if that insurance money is your asset (or in a 529)?
If your son takes a gap year and works, he may work himself out of a Pell grant too. Next year (for 2015) you will file as a single/head of household. YOUR asset protection will go down a lot, to under $10,000, so if you just move the money to your accounts, much of it may not be protected. It will also not be protected from creditors if you owe medical bills.
It is a balancing act. If you get Pell one year, that may be enough to push you out of the funds for the following year, or lose the AOTC, or some other tax/financial aid consequence. Just make sure the financial gymnastics is worth it.
My son is a high stats kid. WPI was his number 1, but he only got $11,000 merit. He has other choices, including two state universities that accepted him. He doesn’t want any debt either. He applied to another Fafsa only school today, and will do another one tomorrow.