Re: #38 - Each school will have different protocols regarding visits. This time of year might be when a lot of staff take vacations, and so opportunities for individual meetings will be limited. Some larger colleges have on-line sign-up portals, while others simply list times and presume that they can handle the number of visitors who show up. Check each college you intend to visit. You can always drop in and take a short, self-guided walking tour on most campuses.
@Ohiodad51 - Is Kenyon still too close to home for your daughter? I remember them having a good theater program.
Yep, Kenyon is on the list, as is Denison. Those schools (and CMU as well) are really day trips for us though and I am thinking we can fit them in as time allows.
Among the schools that have been mentioned, Sarah Lawrence, Denison, Fordham, Yale, Northwestern, and Kenyon have strong theatre programs (Yale more at the grad than undergrad level, as far as I can tell), so the opportunity to take quality theatre-related classes or minor in theatre, see high quality theatre, be around theatre students, and take part in student-run productions may be there. As you know, Oberlin does, as well, but you said that it doesn’t interest your D at this moment. (My D is pursuing a BFA in musical theatre in the fall, so we’ve been immersed in theatre program discussions for a while.)
Among the schools that have been mentioned, Sarah Lawrence, Denison, Fordham, Yale, and Kenyon have strong theatre programs (Yale more at the grad than undergrad level, as far as I can tell), so the opportunity to take quality theatre-related classes or minor in theatre, see high quality theatre, be around theatre students, and take part in student-run productions may be there. As you know, Oberlin does, as well, but you said that it doesn’t interest your D at this moment.
(My D will be a freshman in a musical theatre BFA program in the fall, so we’ve been immersed in theatre program discussions for a while.)
Just thinking, if your D can get the interest, and the grades, for Haverford that may help you double up on trips to your son. Don’t know about the theater part there, but they probably have the rest covered anyway.
And if you’re looking Boston area, Brandeis might fit her expressed interests well. Tufts too but less on theater.
[Completely uninteresting digression: I almost went to Bucknell. I visited by myself, by bus, from the NYC area, and gosh was that an eye opener. The bus drove through areas of decrepit shacks, past threadbare people covered in dirt with no shoes. I half expected Jed Clampett would come out and take a shot at me. I had no idea there were areas like that in the Northeast. Bucknell, of course, was not like that, it was very impressive.]
Haven’t seen this mentioned in this thread: Take a bunch of photos at each school. Things will blur together when you visit several schools so close together, the photos will help you remember and distinguish them. I try to have the first one of each set have the school’s name. And I think it’s good to take photos that include the tour group and guide (and get their name) – that will also help make them stand out.
Getting back to the matter at hand, regarding city vs, more isolated:
To perhaps point out the obvious, all these situations are not identical. It partly depends on what she wants them for.
There is a big difference, IMO, between little school in little town (eg Colgate, Oberlin,… [many LACs]) vs much larger school in larger college town (Cornell, and then plus-size that with Ann Arbor). There are about ten times the number of students in Ithaca vs, these little LACs. The school is larger and the city is likewise larger. It all makes a difference, in terms of how much there is to do there.
Similarly all cities are not the same. Some cities have essentially no useful public transportation. Some cities are little more than a collection of suburban strip malls. Some cities have amazing theater and restaurants, and all of these are too expensive for the average college student to utilize. One of my kids actually transferred from a school in the biggest city to one in a college town, and was happier in the college town, in part for that reason.
Some suburban schools may be physically near a city, but have no realistic means of getting to/from there without a car. (Which is fine, if D has one). Also at some, if not most, suburban schools with ready access to their cities, the vitality of the campus itself drains away, especially on weekends, as everyone fritters off in all directions into the city. So ready city access can be the proverbial “double-edged sword”…
Which ties into the “frustration” part. Sometimes what they may think they want may turn out not to be what they actually want. But that may not be determinable except in retrospect.
On another matter, generally I think it would be better to set things up beforehand, so you are sure to get the relevant info sessions and tours.
If Haverford in on the list, theater activity is on Bryn Mawr’s campus. I know the OP’s daughter isn’t interested in women’s colleges, but Bryn Mawr has strong academics and one of the lovelier campuses I’ve seen. Both Haverford and Bryn Mawr have easy access to Philly (which does get utilized) yet active on campus communities. I think its the best of both worlds - bucolic campus with a major city, with its vibrant dining, arts, and music scenes, a very short commuter train ride away.
She should be asking questions about how often non-theater majors can take theater classes or how often they get parts in theater productions. The answer at my daughter’s program, if you ask the staff would be ‘of course, all are welcomed to try out, to take a class’ but the reality is there aren’t many spots available to non-majors and I don’t think many non-majors get parts in the productions. It is very difficult for theater majors to get dance classes even though they are required.
@ohiodad51, my older D goes to Carnegie Mellon and is active in their Scotch 'n Soda Theater. Kids from all majors participate and it lots of fun. Check it out.
Also, my two cents: my H and I always walked in the back of the pack on the tours and had our Ds walk towards the front nearer to the tour guide. You can hear better and the kids can then ask their own questions without comments from the “parent peanut gallery”!
I also agree with others on this thread to not say much, just observe your child and let them take it all in. In our case, we could tell right away that D2 loved Cornell and UChicago, but wasn’t that excited about Northwestern.
If you are planning a stop at Cornell, suggest your D check out the programs at the College of Human Ecology, in addition to CAS. From what you described, she may actually prefer that college’s offerings overall to the traditional liberal arts curriculum offered in CAS. Though CAS students can also take courses in Hum Ec, and vica versa. If Hum Ec does seem of interest and you can arrange an info session there it may be well worth it. She will get in-depth information about the college.
FWIW, for those who fit well and belong there, Hum Ec is typically a little easier to get into than CAS. Of course this a second order consideration vs which program of studies is best for her.
A couple posts above mentioned tour guides, this reminded me: try to warn your D, and yourselves, about getting overly influenced by the quality of your particular tour, and tour guide. There are whole long threads on CC to the effect of “schools my kid got immediately turned off of …” and an inordinate number were over trivialities like the tour guide didn’t open his umbrella for them when it rained, or all she talked about was her sorority, the tour group was too big, or [whatever other little affront somebody decided to take offense to].
First of all, in the summer they may well be training a bunch of new tour guides. Second of all, your D will probably not be spending the next four years with this particular person. there are probably other people who also attend there, many of whom may well have handed you their umbrella if it rained. They are just one person.
Suggest try to keep the focus on the big picture. Ideally I think the matriculation decision, where one should best spend the next four years, should hinge on bigger issues than merely which tour one preferred.
one other thing to add about groups - don’t let her get too caught up in the others looking at the school - they do not represent future classmates - the people walking around campus and the tour guide do.
Do the math - 10 kids on the tour - 5 apply - less than one gets in - a percentage of that one actually attends
I think it’s really important to consider how your impression might be affected by the fact that it’s summer and there aren’t many students around. I think this could be particularly misleading at Yale, where the admittedly less than lovely extended surroundings of New Haven might seem worse than normal without an obviously vibrant campus.
To be fair, while New Haven may be “less than lovely” or “dodgy” or even “yucky”, it does have Toads, which at least back in the day was an excellent place to see some music and maybe drink a little more than you should. Of course, I am sure my daughter will not have time for such diversions and will spend her time in class, the library, or church.
We had a really hard time judging schools when they don’t have the students around, and if interested at all had to go back for second visit to get the real feel, not just to check out the student body, but how crowded/impacted the campus feels. Last week, when visiting a sibling’s school that we have been to many times, my daughter said, “I like this school in the summer because no body is here, other times it’s way too crowded.”
OK, here is another question since this thread is getting some visibility. And the question is germane to constructing a list of colleges.
How would you all define a safety? Leaving aside finances, what is the definition of a safety school? I have seen it defined based on admissions rates and also on where scores fit within the 75/25 breakdown. The reason I ask, and recognizing that I am projecting quite a bit, my daughter likely will have test scores that will put her in the 75% range of a lot of schools she is at least preliminarily interested in, but yet these schools show admissions numbers well below 50%. For instance, assuming she continues to test as she always has and her ACT score is in the top 2%, which would be a 32 and she actually gets a couple Bs in high school, as much as that would horrify her, and ends up with a 3.8 unweighted GPA. Stats like that would put her around the 75% number at Bucknell, which I think would make her chances pretty good. But the admissions rate is 30% at Bucknell, and therefore it is hard to think of the school as a safety. Am I thinking about this the right way?
During the summer, it’s highly likely that the students you see around aren’t even students of that college. They could be high school students doing a summer program or folks renting out summer housing. I wouldn’t make any assumptions about the student body based on folks you see on campus during the summer. One of the reasons I don’t care for summer visits, although I realize they are often necessary based on travel schedules/free time for the applicant and his/her family.
My kids’ school defined a safety as a school where the counselor thought you would have a 75% chance of getting in. Not only do grades and test scores weigh in, but your school’s track record with that college (naviance) as well as other objective and subjective factors. Typically, I would think a school with a 30% probably shouldn’t be considered a safety for anyone without top stats and a really solid hook. Since your daughter has legacy status at Bucknell, perhaps that would help. I’m not sure how Bucknell treats legacy and whether or not you’ve been a donor. Perhaps its safer to call it a match or low match. This is where a solid college counselor can help. You mentioned your daughter going to a private school so perhaps she benefits from a strong college counseling office.