<p>Why are trade skills (ex: managing or physically participating in construction) and entrepreneurship skills so underrated or nonexistant in most US high schools?</p>
<p>All students learn geometry, history, some unncessary busy work about memorizing how Louis the 10th participated in some obscure war, etc... but most of them dont seem to learn skills that would directly help them for their entrance into the real world.</p>
<p>One example is a friend who has started a successful clothing business in multiple European countries and in the US< but has mediocre grades. But he would probably he better prepared for business than most other high schoolers who obsess over grades, and little else.</p>
<p>Usually the vocational training is separated into Vocational Schools. Our county has a “shared time” program where you do part of the day at the HS and part of the day in vocational training at a different location. For example ours offers:</p>
<p>Allied Health
Automotive Technology
Carpentry
Commercial Art
Cosmetology
Culinary Arts
Dental Science
Diesel Mechanics
Electricity
HVAC
Marine Trade
Certified Nursing Assistant
Patient Care/ Medical Assisting
Plumbing & Pipefitting</p>
<p>HS should educate in “soft” skills. Then after spending (normally in a world!) 10 years in school, instead of 13 (in the USA), one may choose to go to a “trade” school. Also, as an option, one may choose (not here, abroad) to finish only 8 grades and go to a trade school wich is about 4 years but includes HS education. These are for somewhat advanced kids who can finish up HS in 1 - 1.5 years, ALL of Math (much more advanced than any HS in the USA), language, foreign language, all sciences (also more advanced than in the USA).
Putting everybody thru vocational training and make it a requirement is not a good idea.<br>
I wish that k - 12 is actually 1 - 10 and teaches them at much much higher level, at the level as most other countries (including many third world countries) are doing. In addition, most disciplinary problem are related to one simple fact - kids are bored at k - 12, and at the same time awefully busy with the stupid paper work that makes sure that whatever last drop of analytical skills kids have is gone for good. God forbid, they are able to think thru what is going on around them, nope, they have to be raised non-thinkers</p>
<p>My district had a similar system as @bopper’s, and it was quite popular, even though I’m not sure how good of a program it was - many of the people I know who went are not currently employed in the fields they trained in. I think a lot of whether or not people are willing to go to vocational schools depends on their socioeconomic status. Most people on CC come from upper-middle class communities where I would assume people are less willing to go to vocational schools.</p>
<p>As a recent high school graduate of a quintessential suburb, I can say while required vocational training isn’t the best idea, it should be more of an option. Everyone at my high school goes to college and if you were to go to trade school, you would get weird looks and people would think “he’s not going to do anything with his life” which couldn’t be further from the truth. Our guidance counselors only recommend community college and transfer instead of trade school. Personally, if I didn’t have high test scores or GPA, I would have considered trade school simply because it’s much easier now to get a job out of vocational school than spend thousands to get a useless degree. Everyone wants the big salaries/a job that they were promised out of college, but the jobs are seemingly disappearing unless you graduate with a certain major. Even though the salaries aren’t on par with what a college degree would get, someone could live off it. </p>
<p>I’d rather go to a trade school and make something of myself than go to a college that I don’t want to be at, wasting my parents money only to drop out and move back in with my parents. </p>
<p>Depends on where you live. Our economically diverse high school has trade school type courses: welding, culinary arts, auto shop. </p>
<p>@Jarjarbinks23 Where on this planet do you find entrepreneurship taught in a high school? And it’s totally a straw man argument to compare a budding businessman with a high achieving HS student. That’s baloney. How many failed businesses did you drive past on your way to school/work today? How many defaulted loans, houses lost to foreclosure because an entrepreneur’s dream turned out to be a fantasy? Certainly our economy is strengthened by a strong entreprenurial force. But to dismiss the nation’s need for college bound students is stupid.</p>
<p>And your derision of the learning , understanding and synthesis of history and your overemphasis on your clothing store friend’s superiority over college bound kids don’t portend well your “preparation for the real world”</p>
<p>Our high school also offers a variety of trades courses, maybe 20 different paths, and the kids get various certifications. Even at my own high school where the vast majority of kids attended college, there were classes in auto repair and other trade skills. Are there really a lot of high schools which offer no preparation for kids to get a decent job out of high school? College or minimum wage?</p>
<p>@T26E4 Let’s hear your point on trade skills, because all you talk about is entrepreneurship.</p>
<p>And many trade skills that are deemed “unprestigious, dirty” (ex: plumbing, HVAC mechanics) will be in high demand for a long time, yet everybody is obsessing over the sedentary office job.</p>
<p>Education is good as long as it doesnt depend mostly on rote memorization (AP Euro, APUSH), but high schools should provide a leeway for a “2nd option” (trade skills), if they find the typical cubicle job is’t fit for them.</p>
<p>@mathyone What country are you in? I’m talking about US high schools and I haven’t heard of any that offer students to learn trade skills ALONG with the traditional curriculum</p>
<p>These schools are in the US. At my kids’ school, in the areas of construction and business, we have have masonry and construction. We have marketing, business management, information technology (Microsoft office certification), web design, as well as a few coops and industry-specific business classes. There are a lot of other areas from cooking to health care. </p>
<p>The kids doing these programs take mostly regular high school classes. They are allowed to substitute a trade class or two for a small part of the regular academic requirements (electives, really) but otherwise have to meet everything the other students do.</p>
<p>Oh, there’s also interior design/housing, technical drawing and architectural drawing if you consider those related to construction. I recall that my high school also offered technical drawing.</p>
<p>^^^The county I reside in is the largest in our state as far as attendance for school districts. It is also one of the fastest growing areas in the US. In our district they do offer traditional coursework along with other routes to pursue “vocational” skills. For example, our local high school offers a “construction academy”, landscaping, interior design, a prep academy for future teachers, courses for HVAC, nurses aides, cs techs… Some of the programs offer certificates in addition to hs diplomas. There are 4 designated labels for which course program a student will follow and one of them is vocational prep.</p>
<p>These students can then go on to the local community college (which is in the same part of town) and is the largest community college in the state and pursue the same vocational studies they had in high school. With tuition at $50 per unit it is very affordable to complete the programs. The radiology tech program takes 18 months to complete and all graduates are assured a position as soon as they graduate. Those same techs can transfer to UNC-Chapel Hill’s BS radiology program with the knowledge that all their classes will seamlessly transfer. And this starts out as a vocational program.</p>
<p>The same is true with the textile program in high school then moves on to the same community college and then again another transfer to NC State’s School of Textiles for a BS. The concentrations there can vary from plastics to the emergence of nanotechnology. Again starting from a vocational certificate program in high school to a BS and on. The other positive about these programs is the step by step method that will allow for time in between and the abillity to support oneself while pursuing the different levels of education.</p>
<p>Other areas are also represented in the construction field, landscaping, architecture, healthcare, teaching, HVAC, cooking and in our area in particular, agriculture. Agribusiness is one of the most popular majors and can be started from some very “vocational” interests, such as farming, raising small ruminants, equine science, dairy, beef, fowl…the list is endless.</p>
<p>For those students who do not wish to purse the academics through the high school, the federal govt. offers Job Corps to those students all hoping to receive their hs diploma/GED and a certificate or apprenticeship in a vocational skill, ie. culinary arts, mechanics, welding, wildfire fighting, nurse’s aid…the list is long and it is available in all 50 states.</p>
<p>I think this issue goes more to how well acquainted you are with how much info you have regarding the availability of “vocational” programs in your area. In our area it is VERY prevalent. And very well accessed by the local population.</p>
<p>Kat</p>
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<p>You need to widen your focus, Jarjar. MANY high schools in the US have vocational programs ALONG with the traditional curriculum. I live in Michigan, and my local high school has an amazing auto shop program, along with great programs in the culinary arts, welding, and child care, among others. Students in these programs also take a full complement of English, math, science, etc - they have to fulfill the same graduation requirements as their “academic” colleagues.</p>
<p>I like the way our old district did it. In 8th grade, every student was required to spend a day at the vocational high school to see if they would rather be enrolled there or at the traditional high school. Kids who felt they had an aptitude for hands-on work chose the vo-tech; the others went to the regular high school. It’s all about what motivates a person.</p>
<p>I agree that far too many kids suffer through courses they aren’t suited for, but there are many who do find AP Euro interesting and relevant. It would be nice if the kids who don’t want a traditional educational experience were better supported in choosing a vocational school, but don’t assume that those who like math, history, etc. are wasting their time.</p>
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<p>In the US, my high school offered the same. Probably not 20 different paths, but some. There was one class that was like 3 periods where they go and build a house over the school year. At the end there’s a house. </p>
<p>In our area you could choose the high school you wanted to go to. We had three traditional high schools, one academy, one Bill Gates sponsored school, one less traditional school where people who struggled went to, e-school, and an engineering Project Lead the Way school which two of my sons went to. All the schools offer classes which will teach or at least introduce some type of trade. You could also go to the local CC or college to take classes which the school didn’t offer on the district’s dime. At my sons’ engineering school, some students chose to take a computer path where they could be certified as a Cisco technician. Some took classes which introduced them to a CNC machine (tool die) and different automated machines. Many of these were for college credit too so some of the student could basically go to the CC for one more year and have their degree or certificate. One of my son’s friends went out and found a job in a machine shop. Another got his Associates Degree in automotive mechanics, working part time as he goes for his 4 year degree. There are schools who do offer these classes…you just have to be lucky to be in the right district and know they exist.</p>
<p>In our state there are Technical High Schools that you can either attend full time or there is also an option of attending the regular public in the morning and going over to the tech school in the afternoon (basically you use up all your electives in the tech school). There is an electronics program there that I was looking into for my kid, but it wouldn’t work because the HS she goes to has a full day curriculum.</p>
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<p>In our area the district won’t pay - either the school has it explicitly on their curriculum as something you can pick as a cross-enrol or you’d have to pay on your own)</p>
<p>You are definitely misguided on the purpose of a good HS education. ALL citizens need an understanding of many different things, regardless of their post HS occupation. Learning history is definitely not memorization, it involves critical thinking skills. Much of what you consider “useless” is learning basic principles that apply to everyone’s life and useful in understanding technical information needed for most trades. Part of learning is learning how to learn, how to evaluate. You certainly want to be able to adapt to a changing world in the future, knowing why along with how things work makes it easier to grasp new material. You also want a good fund of knowledge to be able to evaluate what others try to sell you politically.</p>
<p>You are not just a worker but a member of society. All of that literature, history and other subjects you find irrelevant are your tools against being taken advantage of by those who wish you would just follow instead of thinking for yourself. You also are as entitled to a culturally rich education as the college bound student. Being in a technical job does not mean you can’t enjoy music, art, literature, politics or many other subjects. </p>
<p>I could go on but you should get my point by now. </p>