My son has 12 schools on his list, 9 of which fall within 1 USNWR category. 8 of those schools rank in the top 15 slots in the category, while the 9th ranked in the 30s. This makes no sense to us, as we visited the 9th school and it made a very favorable impression. As the top 8 schools rank so closely we assume they are all of roughly equivalent strength. Should we discount the 9th college given it is ranked so much lower, in spite of the fact our gut and minds tell us it’s a solid choice? Several of those schools in the group of 8 are safeties for my son, as is the 9th, so the 9th doesn’t need to be on the list.
@CTDadof2 the USNWR rankings use specific criteria and weighting to determine a school’s rank. It could be that 9th school falls short in one area that doesn’t even matter to you. You could spend hours combing through the data and determining what the source of that lower ranking is. Or you could just trust your instincts that this is a good option for him. I would go halfway in between and say you can’t totally ignore the USNWR rankings because there is data and a concrete methodology behind their results but that data may or may not be pertinent to your son’s education so do your own due dilligence: first determine what is important to him and you and then ensure all the schools on his final list have those programs/features/qualities. I sincerely hope no one takes the USNWR rankings as the final word on any individual school’s strength.
Unless the US News category you are looking at has the word “Regional” in it, the 8 schools in the top 15 spots would not be safeties for your son or anyone else.
But in answer to your question, the US News ranking methodology tells you something about relative level of prestige but very little about school quality.
We don’t consider ranking and our kids have not been negatively impacted by pursuing attendance at top ranked schools.
We have had a student graduate from an engineering school not ranked nationally by USNWR who has an excellent career and works alongside grads from school like UCB, UMich, NCSU, etc. No difference in career or pay based on institution; their careers are determined by job performance (and his excels). We have a ds who attended a U ranked in the 100s who is now a grad student at a top 5 school in his field. His UG institutional ranking did not hinder his grad school admissions.
Ranking of UG institution isn’t the defining factor in post-UG success. Individual performance, motivation, and pursuits as an UG can go a long way in propelling their future careers.
This old thread is a hilarious take on rankings: For all the hate the USNWR rankings get, they are as good of a ranking system as any for college prestige with employers and grad schools.
Or more appropriately, they are as poor as any.
Based on other posts, I think the USNWR category is likely Regional Universities North. The methodology for this category is summarized below. The primary criteria reflects a combination of selectivity, wealth, and “distinguished” reputation. I won’t go in to depth about the numerous flaws in this approach, other than saying that this specific weighting has little to do with what is important for the OP’s son, what should be an important factor in his college choice, and what would result in the best college and post-college experience/career in his desired field.
30% Graduation Rate
20% Survey asking if college is “Distinguished” or “Marginal”
10% Average Spending
8% Class Size
8% Test Scores
7% Faculty Salary
5% Alumni Gift Rate
…% Various
Yes and no. The USNWR methodology changes frequently, and there is a bit of gamesmanship with the peer surveys which gives some schools a boost. As for rigor, some live up to the billing while others are hard to get into but easy to stay in. We looked for schools that had top programs and ignored the overall ranking (though we typically stayed ~ T100). My youngest initially got hung up on turning down a ~T50 for a ~T100 until he realized the strength of the program he was interested in at the lesser ranked school was much more robust than what the ~T50 had to offer. Plus, the merit money and weather at the T100 were hard to beat. 
What type of ranking? The “overall” rankings are interesting, but the major-specific rankings can be much more relevant, when available. E.g., there are several very highly ranked, prestigious, national university that aren’t anywhere near the top 10 in Engineering.
USNWR is a useful metric to get an understanding of data about a school. When I was looking for my D, I found 9 other school rankings (Engineering, which probably has more than most) and looked at all of them to get multiple viewpoints.
As I recently wrote elsewhere - USNWR is not the Bible.
Always flaws in ranking systems. But- just because your superficial look at a school is favorable does not mean it should be ranked higher. You need to do your homework with schools. This means not only liking the campus but checking on the undergrad major. Compare courses required and available in the major and related fields. A look at those 25-75%ile test score ranges will tell you something about the peer group at the school. Opportunities in the proposed and possible other majors matter. Some schools rank lower overall but are gems in certain fields. It isn’t always the grad rate but whether or not the course content covers more or less than other options. Most people do not need the top schools in any category to get a good college education (or HS one).
And some depts have great subject specialists while others borrow folks from other interest areas for certain courses. So while looking at courses, look at professors teaching them.
USNws is our for USNews. Their rankings draw a lot of attention. but aren’t truly some absolute.
Data 10, yes that is the category at issue.
30% Graduation Rate
20% Survey asking if college is “Distinguished” or “Marginal”
10% Average Spending
8% Class Size
8% Test Scores
7% Faculty Salary
5% Alumni Gift Rate
…% Various
Thank you for spelling out the criteria used, I didn’t know this at all, and now see why everyone is so critical of this survey. I don’t think things like faculty salaries and the alumni giving rate say a lot about a school’s quality. Personally, I’d give greater weight to the graduation rate, class size, test scores, alumni salaries and…
One metric that I think is highly relevant is a school’s debt, but this seems to be ignored in this survey, and getting those current figures is challenging. Would anyone know of a site that contained the debt levels of various schools?
OP- you are still not correct in your choice of what counts. Class size does not mean anything- a small class with an average professor may not be as good as a discussion group led by a TA with an excellent large lecture. Who even knows salaries of grads? Most don’t fill out salaries, nor do schools track then ten years late I bet (they better have better things to spend their money on). Or cares? School debt- do you mean solvency of a college? Most are solvent. Student debt not a marker. Graduation rates can also be tricky and not mean anything for your student. ALL schools are regional- they are not the best for ALL students, even the elite ones. East coasters look mainly within their region, likewise the rest of us do so. Salaries also depend on cost of living and desirable cities may exclude places like NYC, Boston et al that so many drool over.
Your best bet is to not have the college search dependent on so many useless parameters. Look at how the school will educate the only person that matters to you- your child. Oh, and it’s your child’s life. You guide but do not do the search for them.
Wis75…I am entitled to believe what is important and what is not in evaluating colleges, as are you, and I do not appreciate your haughty and dismissive attitude. Yes class size is important. And the amount of debt a college holds is important, because in my part of the country, a number of colleges are closing this year because they are no longer solvent. And yes, alumni salaries are an important indicator of academic and student quality, and are measured by the federal government on their College Scorecard site. And yes, I know my son, and I have helped him extensively with this process, as have most people commenting on this site whether they admit it or not, and he has liked 8 of the 11 schools I have proposed to him as potential list members.
D1 made her own ranking methodology after she was satisfied that all schools on her list fulfilled the rigorous requirements of her major. Department visits and discussions with patient, engaging professors helped with that important step.
Then there is the question of “what experiences will you have outside of those with your department professors and classmates”. That is where your ranking system gets personal and complicated.
Here are some of the categories that create a life/work balance for her:
Minor and concentration of interest
Ability to take classes across whole university
Participation in novel research
4 year graduation rate (summers for internships and school year for on campus research) to have the cohesive class experience and only spend 4 years
Teaching style- traditional lecture, upside down classroom, project based
City or rural and campus safety
Community service partnerships that are easy to integrate on a weekly basis.
Libraries and other study spaces
Diverse and integrated student population - students did not integrate at all diverse schools.
Student vibe- how do they spend free time, collaborative or competitive.
Club sport of interest
Excellent healthcare
Ease of independent travel to/from home
Alumni network.
Sounds like your son had a list. Once a couple of schools bubble to the top for him, double check against rankings. They are probably not worth more than a verification.
My opinion…USNews rankings are…USNews rankings. The only important ranking is the one your kid does amongst the colleges he is interested in.
As noted above, there are colleges with “lower” ranking that are actually powerhouses in certain majors…or offer the opportunity to study with certain faculty in a discipline. In my opinion, for some students, that is more important than a full university ranking that might not have much to do with the student and that student’s actual interests.
In addition, there are plenty of colleges that fly under the radar screen where a student can get an excellent college education.
Our kids…and we parents…never saw an issue of USNews or read about the rankings if the colleges our kids were considering. Frankly, we probably would not have know about rankings…except that both colleges did send info via their school newsletters.
As it happened, one of our kids went to a college now ranked about 50…I think it was 60 when he enrolled.
Kid two went to the #2 ranked regional university in her region…it’s now number one.
But that’s not why they picked the colleges…at all.
One of the college admissions counselors told us that rankings don’t tell the full story,
Here is what he said heavily determines choice for a student:
- Weather on the day you visited school. Crisp, sunny, fall day with leaves turning gold vs rainy cold day in early April with muddy/soggy quad and bare trees.
- Quality of your tour guide and overall presentation.
- Personality of your host for the overnight,t.
- Cleanliness or smell of dorm rooms on the overnight.
- Experience sitting in on a class and/or and talking to a professor.
- Food in cafeteria on day of visit.
- Someone really cute smiled at them.
At best, #5 and #6 are somewhat indicative of the overall college experience one can expect over 4 yrs, but also may be subject to dumb luck. The rest…well…largely luck of the draw.
So yeah USNWR is one many ratings systems. There’s Forbes, there’s Washington Monthly.
The strength of a particular program is really important.
Isn’t there this consideration that overrides all others for most high school students wanting to go to college:
- Parent limitations on the student’s college choice, including, but not necessarily limited to, how much money the parents are able and willing to contribute for the student’s college costs.
The two biggest classes I took in college were with “famous” professors who in addition to their academic reputations, routinely won prizes for teaching and mentoring undergrads.
I can’t imagine opting out of these huge lectures-- which were incredible and life-altering and inspirational- to take a 15 person class with a hohum professor.
Sometimes the reason classes are big is because upperclassmen tell entering students “whatever you do, do not miss out on professor A’s class, even if you have to sit on the floor and even if they cap enrollment”.
So average class size is important except when it’s not. In my major- Classics- every class was small (and some were tiny). Bio- classes were bigger. Egyptology- the ratio was usually 1:1. Psychology- bigger for the first two years and then small.
These “averages” mix apples and oranges so you need to understand what you are looking at when you evaluate how important small classes are. You can never have a large lecture, depending on your major, or you may not have a small class until senior year when you’re in seminars and 1:1 teaching for your thesis.
People seem to care about the rankings, and our rankings bring students to the school where I work. So I appreciate the rankings from that perspective. But I would not pick a school for myself or my kids based on the rankings.