So there’s this semester-long “mountain” program at my school on a separate campus with environmental/leadership/forest and ecology type of classes. I applied for the program and was accepted, but now I’m thinking about not doing it because all of the classes are pass/fail and I’d be doing it fall semester of senior year (next year) which is the last semester colleges see…I think having all those (four) pass/fail classes would hurt my admissions chances. If I don’t do this program I would most likely take German 2 (I took AP Spanish last year and German 1), Honors physics 1, CP Stats and a personal fitness class. My second semester classes are (most likely) AP Literature&Comp, German 3, and Comparative Religion (social studies elective). CP Stats is year long (that’s another problem… can’t decide if I should take AP stats or Honors Calc OR CP stats… I took pre-calc junior year)
My ideal schools are LACs such as Skidmore, Bates, Union, Wesleyan, etc… So what do you think, better to take normal classes?
Ask your GC whether it has helped/hurt students in the past.
Edited to add: If it was my child and he was interested in the program I would have him do it. I am not a big believer in doing stuff just for college admissions purposes. Getting an education and learning are more important to me than college admissions results. I am sure you will get into college if you do this program.
The whole program is pass/fail. That means that your HS guidance office knows how to describe it in their letters to the colleges/universities. It should not be any problem at all. Go there. Have a great time.
The program sounds great to me and I would not give it up so quickly. My guess is if it is an established program at your school then it won’t make a negative impact on college admissions (especially if it is for the second semester of senior year). I can’t imagine your school would continue the program if it hurt college admissions. And I’d imagine that the LACs you plan to apply to would take the time to read your application carefully and understand that you are in a specialized program. But I do agree that your guidance counselor will have the history of students who have done the program.
@happy1 I’d actually be doing the mountain program first semester in the fall which is one of the reasons it concerns me because colleges wouldn’t see any grades for it (and fall semester is the last semester colleges see before they admit you or not). This program is NOT known for attracting “academic” kids and from what I’ve heard a lot of people do it because they don’t want to do hard work (the program makes sure everyone passes the classes). I thought it sounded like a great program too, because of the hands on learning, but I’m not sure I want to be surrounded by students who are only doing it as an “easy break” from normal school. I’m just not sure…something else I have to consider is they just cut off transportation so I’d have to make the 40 minute drive there everyday and back by myself/:
Have you actually spoken with students who did participate, or are you working from things that you have “heard”? Pin down at least one student who participated, and get that person’s comments about the experience.
Is the drive 40 minutes each way (probably too much especially in bad weather) or is it 20 minutes each way (maybe do-able)? What have your parents said about letting you spend that much time driving every single day?
Don’t turn down something because you’re scared of the pass-fail (as long as you’re confident you can get the pass, of course). Especially not for college.
But if you MUST focus on college when deciding this, then the program genuinely shows your passion and gives you something to write about.
@happymomof1 Yeah I’ve talked to a few kids who participated. I love the idea of this program but the class descriptions don’t sound very rigorous - I might be better off taking an honors science course and another CP one I’m interested in. Also, if I go through with the program I won’t be able to take any math senior year because of scheduling conflicts - but, if I drop it, I could take CP stats or calculus. I’m not sure if this is true but people have said on this website that if someone is even considering a science major they should take calculus in high school, which creates a bit of a problem if I can’t take any math senior year.
Unfortunately it’s a 40 minute drive each way - transportation was a big concern for me but I was assured there was a bus to the campus everyday. HOWEVER, we were sent an email 2 days ago saying that because of budget cuts there will no longer be a bus. My parents really don’t want me to do the program unless they can somehow get the bus back - where I live the winters are pretty bad, I’d be driving home alone in the dark everyday, I don’t get cell service where the campus is (couldn’t use my GPS or get help if I got in an accident), and the drive there is difficult (back roads/windy roads). So my dad sent the head guy of the program an email and we have yet to hear back from him… I’m sure other parents have emailed too, as there are others in the program who live in my town and a lot of kids who do this program are sophomores (most of whom can’t even drive). So unless they somehow get the bus back I am pretty sure I’m not going to do it, and my parents probably wouldn’t let me anyways. That creates another problem though because the classes I would have wanted to take first semester might already be filled at this point. I feel this “notice” was quite last minute
@sunshine232 Yeah my guidance counselor told me the teachers there make sure everyone passes. That makes me think it would not be very challenging though. And don’t colleges want to see that you’ve given yourself the most rigorous options available to you? (In this case I could take an honors science course instead, and a math course). I’ve been wondering if this is a struggling program that “academic” students have not participated in for a reason… I know that the semester before last there were only 13 kids in the group and there are supposed to be 20-30.
My guidance counselor actually went out of her way to tell me NOT to write my college essay on this mountain program because she’s seen so many kids do it, and that “all of the essays are the same.” That put me off a little bit.
@MurphyBrown Yeah that’s what my dad said he would do, so I’m hoping they would let me into the courses.
I finished with all A’s and A+'s this year and my unweighted GPA is 3.98. I think for the most part I’d be able to maintain these grades as long as I keep working hard. That’s something else about this program, some kids just do it so there grades won’t get any worse. Colleges will see that I’m a strong student but I don’t want them to think “oh, senior year is when the vacation started…” because of the mountain program.
My guidance counselor told me that some schools I’m applying to will see the value in the program and some won’t because of their competitiveness. This worries me - she said with Bates, for example, I would be at the bottom of their pool with a program like this one (probably because there are no grades so it would be viewed as not rigorous/challenging). But I’m wary of anything my GC says because when my brother was applying to colleges she told him not to go to Union because SHE didn’t like the town it was in and she didn’t think he would get in… Well, he got in and just finished his freshman year there, and loves it! She also didn’t want him to apply to Skidmore, which he ended up getting into. As for me, she’s started doing the same thing - she told me: “I do not see you going to a college where there is an academically rigorous environment” and then she proceeded to say that basically all the schools I’m interested in have academically rigorous environments. I’m confused as to why she feels this way because I’m a really hard-working student - I took 2 APs last year and got the academic achievement award (goes to the student with the highest average in the AP class of a subject) in the subjects of those APs (English and Spanish) so that goes to show that I’m ready for at least some college level work.
My ECs are okay:
-Varsity cross country (3 years)
-Nordic ski team (2 years - 1 JV, 1 varsity)
-Varsity track (3 years)
-Spanish/German club/NHS (1 year)
-Volunteering at library once for Spanish-speaking club that meets once a month (a few months)
-had a seasonal job last winter
Sports take up a lot of time and doing them year-round makes it hard to participate in a lot of ECs. Another thing about this mountain program is that you can’t play a sport the semester you go because school ends at 4pm there, whereas on the main campus it ends at 2:30. So I wouldn’t be able to cross country or participate in any clubs because of that… I’d be isolated from the main campus which is worrisome during the college application process (being in touch with teachers and getting help revising essays) and because I would have zero ECs fall semester, the last semester colleges see…
I’d assume I could take math online, but I’m the type of person who REALLY needs to focus in math class and work hard to understand, so I think it would be best for me to take calculus in a classroom setting where a teach is readily available to explain/answer questions.
It sounds like you want to do this course, but are trying to come up with some, admittedly valid, reasons why you shouldn’t. First and foremost, LACs such as you are interested in, are holistic. I actually think this program would be very appealing to Wes, Skidmore, and Bates. (Not too familiar with Union.) If the rest of your transcript is full of rigorus courses and good grades (apparently it is), and your test scores are high, then I think you should do the program. All of those schools will offer Calculus. You do not need Calc to get into college, unless you plan to be an engineer I guess. My kid doesn’t have Calc, she got into 7 excellent LACs.
As for the other kids not being academic, I do not see how that matters. This program is clearly designed to teach something that cannot be learned in a regular class setting, and if anything, that gives you an edge. I guarantee there will not be that many kids applying to your colleges who will have a transcript like yours. Didn’t you have to apply and be accepted to the program? Maybe many of the other kids are not super academic, but they are no doubt good at something else and were accepted for a reason. And surely there will be efforts to organize some kind of carpooling system?
As for the counselor’s comment about the essay, I think that is so dependent on an individual kid’s writing ability. If in general some of the kids are not great students, that is a far better explanation as to why they didn’t write great essays. Your essay should reflect who you are as a person, and frankly, the subject is not as important as what the essay tells them about you. I like to quote the Columbia AO who said that your essay should be so like you that if it fell on the floor without your name on it, and a friend picked it up, they would know it was yours.
I am 100% confident that doing this program will not hinder your college chances. It seems to me like the chance of a lifetime and you might forever regret giving up the opportunity.