How do the best girls schools compare to the coed ones?

Prep School Admissions
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<p>As a recent graduate of MPS, I can tell you selectivity has nothing to do with it. I've found that girl's schools like MPS and Emma Willard provide a strong sense of community and an extremely challenging curriculum. MPS challenged my analytic skills and writing skills in ways I never thought possible and the school gave me a good foundation for college, which is easier than high school for me.</p>

<p>Also, as far as the lesser number of courses goes (compared to andover, etc.) most of the girls schools are less than 50 % the size of these schools. It
is hard to offer 30 million languages and aps if you only have a population to fill a small percentage of that.</p>

<p>Personally, mps and emma willard are on par with the top bs co-eds and I think you'll find that you won't regret going to one.</p>

<p>feel free to pm me, with questions.</p>

1 Like
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<p>Yes, that was my point..</p>

<p>They offer a unique community.</p>

<p>But because the co-ed academies appeal to a much, much wider range of students (and not just those that want the distinct single-sex education), they can take their pick.. and do so. The large academies have more courses, sports (esp. co-ed sports like sailing and other sports like ice hockey for girls), programs like Washington internships and commune/farm living for a semester, etc... more "opportunities" because they have more kids, and a more diverse group of kids also.</p>

<p>To some, MPS and EW will always be superior because they offer the one opportunity that matters most to some girls -- being surrounded by girls 24/7. I'm not included in that bunch, but I understand why some would choose a single-sex education.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
Again, what does selectivity have to do with getting a great education?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>I agree. At the prep school I was accepted into for next year, the average SAT score is 1320, and the academics are really hard, at least to me when I sat in on classes there. Everyone goes to really good universities, too, but I think that if this school were a boarding school or in Boston, LA, or NY then it would be much more competitive.</p>

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<p>I don't know what that article actually states, but according the Exeter's strict and extensive requirements to graduate and the engaging Harkness method, I just don't know how the education would be lacking... esp. if the reason is because students are allowed to study what they're interested in after they've filled requirements. To me, enrolling in interesting classes is an amazingly useful privilege, albeit a demanding one.</p>

<p>Exeter's standard requirements to graduate:</p>

<p>Arts
Three term credits. Two terms must be in studio and/or performance courses. At least two areas must be studied from among art, music, or drama. </p>

<p>Classical and Modern Languages
Nine term credits in the same language, or pass Language 330 or
its equivalent.</p>

<p>Computer Science
One term credit, earned by taking CSC305 or CSC315.</p>

<p>English
Ten term credits in the regular English sequence: English 120/130; 210/220/230; 310/320/330; 410/420.</p>

<p>Health and Human Development
One term credit, earned by taking the course throughout the ninth-grade year. (See note under Health and Human Development.)</p>

<p>History
Six term credits. Three term credits of U.S. history, three term credits of non-U.S. history, at least one of which comes from the following list: 100, 101, 131, 165, 167, 270, 436, 445, 446, 465, 467, 477 and 486.</p>

<p>Junior Studies
One term credit.</p>

<p>Mathematics
Nine term credits, or pass a mathematics course numbered 330 or higher.</p>

<p>Physical Education
Ten terms, including three terms of the Junior physical education program. Students may elect to take either two or three terms of athletics in each of the Upper and Senior years.</p>

<p>Religion
Two term credits.</p>

<p>Science
Six term credits. Three term credits of biological science and three term credits of physical science.</p>

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<p>The "selectivity" implies that each school gets to choose the best of the applicant pool. That's why I noted it.. the larger co-ed schools have more interested, they get to pick out the best.</p>

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<p>According to peterson's, Dalton's acceptance rate is 12%. Wowww.</p>

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<p>But interestingly enough, blairt, most of the larger co-ed schools end up choosing the preppier, richer kids over other kids who the majority of the world would deem more interesting. </p>

<p>Not to point fingers or say anything bad, but look at this year's acceptances on cc. You're from a well-connected family and you're pretty waspy (at least according to what you've said on cc) and you're going to Andover next year, aren't you? And then there are kids who are even more brilliant than you are and they get waitlisted/rejected like everywhere. It's probably something like that at the girls schools, too, but you're saying that selectivity makes a school great, and really, it doesn't. Think about it. It's only really when you get to college that you get "the best of the best."</p>

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<p>Wow.. I'm pretty sure I got in on merit (98% SAT, 4.0, "accomplished equestrienne" as they put it, unusual background, and really amazing recs... and a great essay that was probably what got me in above others) and merit alone. No, I'm not going to Andover.. my application was late. I'm going to Exeter.. The reason I ended up not liking Andover was because there were so many kids who probably wouldn't have gotten in if it weren't for their parents. I know OF one, who is a nice girl and everything, but she's horribly studid.. (uses the word "like" WAY TOO MUCH, etc.. just totally naive and airheaded, theres no doubt about it) yet, her father is a famous billionaire, so she's in. I didn't like that (she wasn't an anamoly). Exeter, it seems to me, has wayyy fewer kids like that. 45% of the recently admitted students got aid!! That just blows me away. 5.6 million given away for diversity. I think that's amazing.. that's a place where I want to go. Exeter is entirely need blind, so a family's ability to pay was not a factor.</p>

<p>Olivia was a great applicant. SHe really was.. and she REALLY loved Choate. And she</p>

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<p>Exeter does have less kids like that than Andover is, but even if Exeter doesn't look at your taxes when they make decisions, they do look at your address. And I'm not saying that you aren't "worthy" of Exeter, you are! It's just that there are so many kids like you and even "better" than you, kids who have done really incredible things who haven't gotten in. If you're friendly with the president of the united states, I'm sure it helped at least a little bit... You can deny it all you want, but you might not have gotten in (despite the fact that you deserved to get in, sure) if you didn't have that extra... perk. My point wasn't that you didn't deserve to get in. I was just saying that there were kids on CC who were equally or even possibly more talented than you who didn't get in, and although yes, these schools have a lot of options, they still end up choosing mostly white people on the wealthy side. You horseback ride. That's lovely, it really is, but look at some other kids on this board and you'll see, it's really not why you got in.</p>

<p>And I totally agree with you about Olivia. She definitely deserved to go there...</p>

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<p>I didn't finish my post above..</p>

<p>Olivia was a great applicant. She really was.. and she REALLY loved Choate. And she knew a powerful Choate trustee/alumna, who I believe wrote her a letter of rec, as well as an Andover alumnus (who donated a building?) who I believe also wrote her a letter. She didn't get in! This goes to show that connections (accompanied by amazing grades and scores and EC's and everything) matter very little... if at all! And possibly, they could count AGAINST an aplpicant (for appearing too privileged).</p>

<p>my grandfather is friends with him. Exeter would have NO way of knowing that (I did not ask for a rec). And it's not like I refer to him as "Georgie" or anything.. we are NOT friends.. or relatives. Plus, it's George Sr. who my grandfather is close with. I consider myself middle class.. I'm not rich.</p>

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<p>Maybe you're not rich, but did you get any FA? From what I understood, you didn't seem to need much of it. And boarding school's mad expensive. And you may not be really wealthy, but you associate with people who are. I mean, you're an old-school prep. Not that it's bad. I'm a little preppy (not very, but a little...) and I won't criticize. My point was, though, that most kids at boarding school are like that. And you don't need to send in a rec from Bush for them to figure it out. When you talk about horseback riding and your summers in cape cod or martha's vinyard or wherever, they can kind of tell. Whatever. It doesn't matter. Really, we could argue about this forever. Congrats on your acceptance! :)</p>

<p>It makes you wonder, though, if she didn't get in, then who does get in? And I know people at boarding schools. They do have some minorites and stuff, but most kids will be white and somewhat wealthy. I mean, think about it- schools are proud of themselves if they're 1/3 non-white, and that includes asians... This is more of a side topic, though. It's something we could discuss for hours and we wouldn't get anywhere. And it has nothing to do with the girl's schools I wanted to know more about...</p>

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<p>Could we get back to the co-ed vs. all girls boarding schools discussion? By the way, blairt, not all girls that want to go to girls schools want to be surrounded by girls 24/7. Sometimes people (like me!) feel like an all girls school can offer a more personal, better education. Now, I know this is not the case for everyone, and I do agree with you that Exeter has better subject offerings then most all girls schools... but exeter also has better subject offerings then a lot of co-ed boarding schools.</p>

<p>Blairt, congratulations on getting into Exeter!</p>

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<p>"Exeter is entirely need blind, so a family's ability to pay was not a factor."</p>

<p>that's not true. The ability to pay the extra (wink wink) matters at any school. You would find as many wealthy students at exeter as you would at any other schools.</p>

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<p>Thanks, Blair.... :) I've been meaning to PM you to talk! </p>

<p>Actually, stupid enough, I only got the person at Andover to call after I was WLed.... well, my dad wanted me to at first but I didn't want to, but then I thought, why not? And the person at Choate said they were going to, but didn't really... so, just to clear that up, technically, I didn't get help the first time around. </p>

<p>Thanks though. :) I haven't been on CC lately actually. I'm PMing you now ... Blair. ^^</p>

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<p>hmm....you can't really argue which education is better...as I've said many many many times before, it really depends on the person. </p>

<p>Think of the boarding school situation as kind of like what happened to the colleges...originally all single-sex, but gradually, most became coed. Before, places like Emma Willard and Porter's were THE place to send your girl, but that gradually changed. Think of Porter's as kind of like Wellesley. The point of an all-girl education is not because we think boys are nasty and awful but some feel that girls will become more confident and become better leaders inside and outside the classroom without boys....which I can say for certain that it can be effective, but not every girl needs it. And not every girl can actually survive at a single-sex school. </p>

<p>I admit I miss boys....their boy humor (how else to describe it, really?), flamboyance, easygoingness...oh well. </p>

<p>I was initially against applying to MPS, because like most girls, I was instantly repelled by the idea of single-sex. My mom pleaded for me to apply, not necessarily to go, but just to look at the school. She had gone to Barnard, which explains it. </p>

<p>Needless to say, I was not at all enthusiastic about applying. My opinion was still tepid until I actually visited the school. This is why I often encourage people to actually visit the school and get a sort of concrete idea about the school instead of just paper statistics. </p>

<p>I loved the school, atmosphere, people, (oh, the library!) and it became my top-choice alongside Hotchkiss. So when I got waitlisted from Hotchkiss, I had no problem going to Porter's instead. </p>

<p>I'm having a fabulous time. The academics and standards are extremely high, but I think that in time I will be able to do well and most importantly, develop an articulate voice. </p>

<p>So maybe Hotchkiss does have nicer buildings, higher HYP-admit, etc., but perhaps I might be at the right school for me. </p>

<p>And that, is the most important thing to consider when applying to a high school, when you're in the possibly most awkward and difficult developmental stage of your life.</p>

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<p>I had my D apply to Miss Porter's. "All girls’ school?" She resisted. </p>

<p>When we went for the revisit, both my D and I were very impressed with the quality of the students - intelligent, articulate, warm, caring and full of traditions which they could not share unless you become a student. They even had an alumna on the panel along with a student from each grade. The panel was student run and separate sessions for student and parents. The parents’ panel asked lots of tough questions and students answered them independently, one by one. All the parents were so impressed and at times speechless at maturity and poise of the students.</p>

<p>What was so impressive about the young alumna is that while she was a student, a teacher at MPS told her that she should try engineering because she was good at math and science. They helped her enroll in the pre-engineering program at Trinity College and faculty took turns driving her to Trinity College for the pre-engineering program. Eventually, she got her engineering degree from Trinity and now is the only women in her engineering group at Pratt and Whitney. </p>

<p>Even my daughter who did not want to visit the school at first came away with such positive view of the school - meeting such high caliber students made her change her mind about the school. I mean she was actually thinking about enrolling at MPS at the end of the day.</p>

<p>The arts, dance and music performance were top notch. There was one student who has won the first place in piano in Connecticut. Many attended Hart School of Music. Wow! I am sorry to say Hotchkiss has a nice music building but the performances for both dance and music are sub par vs. Miss Porter's. The nice buildings do not equate to a better quality.</p>

<p>To borrow my brother's comment to my daughter, "you know, girls' schools are tougher (academically) than co-ed." </p>

<p>Here is a quote from a study on this:
"The academic environment of a student is essential to creating the right learning atmosphere and ideals. Girls' self-esteem and their development as leaders are strongly influenced by the way boys perceive them or the way the girls think boys perceive them, and this greatly effects their performance in the classrooms. Many times girls act naïve or hide their intelligence and abilities because they think this is the way to be socially accepted and popular with boys (Sills, 63). At an all-girls school however, these temptations to be ignorant are diminished because girls are in classrooms only with female peers. This enhances participation and confidence in the classroom, as well as helps to void many of the gender stereotypes which exist. Students from the Philadelphia High School for Girls say that "girls avoid the pressure to 'play dumb' for the boys who don't like the smart girls" (Koepke, 46). In this all-girl academic environment, students avoid the temptation to suppress their intellectual sides, and therefore do not get caught up in the traditional gender and occupational stereotypes."</p>

<p>I would not go by the acceptance rate to judge a school because many simply cannot (boys) and will not apply to girls' schools. That does not mean the quality of the school is lower than a co-ed.</p>

<p>If you look at the Common Data Set of colleges, you will notice that more girls apply to colleges and it has become more competitive for girls.</p>

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<p>polyglotmom-
your daughter sounds like I did before I went to MPS. :-)</p>

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<p>I love my all-girls' school; you could not pay me to go anywhere else. =D The special attention and personal care I get are amazing and worth every penny. I've found it very nurturing, but also <em>really</em> difficult academically. Also, the sports are great. Don't be afraid that boys will disappear; girls here see them all the time and are just as obsessed as everyone else, lol.</p>

<p>By the way, bearcats, how DARE you say that single-sex schools are of a "different breed" than Exeter or Andover? You haven't gone to one, and I seriously doubt that you have any real facts (aside from admittance percentages) or personal experience to back that statement up. Guess what? Just because you don't go to Deerfield or SPS doesn't mean you're not accomplished.</p>

<p>God, that actually really ticks me off. =/ Stop your stupid elitism. The kids on this forum are what, barely 14 or 15? That's way too early to encourage them to be snotty about their schools.</p>

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<p>A dose of humility is a good thing to have. Being humble is one of the greatest gifts anyone can posess. I'm not sure if it can be learned though.</p>

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<p>iriseyes - all girls' schools are different than co-ed schools. that would make them "of a different breed." </p>

<p>clear synopsis:</p>

<p>TOP SCHOOLS OFFER A GREAT EDUCATION BECAUSE THEY CAN AFFORD IT, BECAUSE THEY ATTRACT A WIDER GROUP OF APPLICANTS, AND BECAUSE OF THEIR SIZE AND DIVERSE STUDENT BODY (WHICH HELPS ALLOWS THEM TO SUSTAIN MANY PROGRAMS AND EC'S THAT A SMALL SINGLE SEX SCHOOL JUST COULDN'T MANAGE). THEY CAN CATER TO THE MAJORITY OF STUDENTS BECAUSE OF THIS. THUS, THEIR POPULARITY AND DOMINANCE.</p>

<p>e.g., Hockey probably wouldn't be popular at MPS or EW.</p>

<p>BUT, NOT ALL SCHOOLS CAN OFFER WHAT A SINGLE-SEX SCHOOLS CAN. ALL-GIRL'S SCHOOLS OFFER A GREAT COMMUNITY AND A PLACE WHERE YOU CAN RELAX IF YOU ARE AT ALL AFFECTED BY THE OPPOSITE SEX'S PRESENCE IN THE CLASSROOM. TO STUDENTS WHO DO NOT NEED/WANT AND ACADEMY'S EC'S AND MANY COURSES (WHICH ISN'T GOOD NOR BAD), BUT WOULD RATHER EXPERIENCE THE UNIQUE COMMUNITY OF A SINGLE-SEX ENVIRONMENT, EMMA WILLARD, MISS PORTER'S, ETC. WILL ALWAYS BE THE BEST FOR THEM.</p>

<p>Activities like "Ladies of Vitality" and "Sister-to-Sister" are found at girls' schools.. that probably wouldn't last at a co-ed school. If you would like to join a club like that, or play badminton or go riding often, MPS offers that! Exeter doesn't!</p>

<p>MPS has a course titled "Personality Theory." I haven't seen that at other BS schools. They also offer a Jewelery class (2 levels)! And portrait photography. And textiles. However, math classes don't go beyond Calc BC.. and the science offerings seem to be lacking in my opinion. You give, you take. That's what I'm trying to say. It's about what you want to take, and what you're willing to give up.</p>