<p>For someone educated in American schools his whole life, how does the difficulty of getting into Oxford/Cambridge measure up to the following schools:
UPenn (Wharton)
Princeton
Columbia
Duke
UVa
Carnegie Mellon (Tepper)
Also:
Which is better for econ/bus for undergrad? Oxford or Cambridge?
Which is easier to get into? Oxford or Cambridge?
What is financial aid like to those schools?
How does Imperial College London compare to Oxbridge?
If you want to see my stats: <a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/what-my-chances/1562128-ivy-chances-2.html%5B/url%5D">http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/what-my-chances/1562128-ivy-chances-2.html</a></p>
<p>For non-EU/EEA citizens, there is almost no financial aid at Oxbridge.</p>
<p>Imperial College London is very prestigious. If Cambridge and Oxford were equivalents of Harvard and Yale, then Imperial would be Columbia.</p>
<p>Your extracurriculars mean nothing to UK schools, except for those directly related to your major. </p>
<p>Anyway, it is obvious you have done NO research on Oxbridge and are drawn only by the prestige (don’t be like that). You should know, for instance, that under Oxford, there are many colleges that (somewhat) operate independently. Therefore, what matters is not what the university in general is reputed in, but what is strong at specific constituent colleges. Oxford’s Wadham and St Catharine’s Colleges are considered strong for economics. I know neither about Cambridge nor about business. </p>
<p>PS Business is a vocational degree. Eww.</p>
<p>You can’t compare the schools. In the UK, you only take classes in your branch. You have fewer hours of class and you have one-on-one classes once or twice a week. You apply to a major and typically you’d need 5 AP5s or 750s (or combination thereof) . After that there is a test for which you need to register (it’s november 6). Those who make the first cut are invited to an interview which is like intense drilling in your chosen major. You’ll have to demonstrate that you’re well-read in that subject (roughly 10 books that would be part of the freshman program in the US). You can only apply to one (not both) and you need to choose colleges within each university.
The application deadline for the first cut is October 15 so hurry. But seeing how you don’t know much about them, it’s probably too late.</p>
<p>@International95 Yes, I know nothing about it, that is why I am asking. Also my extracurriculars are almost exclusively related to economics so most of them would be considered. I am also a Swiss citizen and although Switzerland is not part of the EU do you think I would have financial aid available?
@MYOS1643 I will have 10 APs by Graduation and 5 by the time I am applying and they should all be 5s ( I already have a 5 in two and I am really good at the 3 I am taking this year, almost guaranteed a 5 on all of them) and hopefully I will have some 750s as well. I would choose Wadham or St. Catharine’s College (not sure yet, but I’ll do more research before I apply, if I apply). I am junior this year, so I won’t be applying until next year. With all this information in mind and my stats (<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/what-my-chances/1562128-ivy-chances-2.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/what-my-chances/1562128-ivy-chances-2.html</a>) do you think I stand a chance? (I am very good at economics, so I think I should do well on the test and I have a whole year to read 10 books as well).
Thanks for your feedback!</p>
<p>Ok I thought you were a Senior wondering, 3 days before the deadline, whether they’d apply to Oxford. Kinda for kicks, really. 
If you have over a year to prepare, you’re good to go. It doesn’t mean you’ll get in, but it means you stand a very decent chance.
You have to read the websites carefully, then prepare. The fact you have EU citizenship will also help a lot (especially since you’re automatically granted the state loan and the living allowance.)
In that case, LSE, UCL, and NCH should also be considered.</p>
<p>Seconding most of the above, and adding some bits and pieces…</p>
<p>1.Oxbridge rates considerably higher on international scales than most of the ones on your list, but anybody who has the ability to get into those schools theoretically has the ability to get into the UK schools. The things that will make it easier or harder largely relate to your ability to demonstrate your suitability for the course you want to study and for the tutorial
system. I know people currently at Yale, Stanford and Princeton who did not even get an interview at Oxbridge; equally I know people who would not have gotten into Columbia or even Duke who are currently thriving at Oxbridge. If you test well, have a passion for your subject, learn well independently and learn well through intensive discussion Oxbridge might suit you. If you do better with lots of smaller assignments, lecture based learning, or aren’t ready to study only one subject then it might not.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>There is no meaningful difference as to Oxford or Cambridge being ‘better’ than the other in absolute terms, nor is one easier to get into than the other ( though some American students find Oxfords application process easier to navigate ).</p></li>
<li><p>Oxford has essentially no financial aid for US students, Cambridge has some. Most courses are three years, though, not four, so your total cost can be less.</p></li>
<li><p>Neither Oxford nor Cambridge offers a business degree. Cambridge offers an Econ degree (for which you will need a 5 on that AP Calc); Oxford offers 5 Econ degrees, but they are all joint degrees (such as history & Econ or philosophy, politics & Econ, etc). </p></li>
<li><p>As MYOS pointed out, for Oxbridge, the first 2 cuts are based on numbers. Looking at what you have:</p></li>
</ol>
<p>Achieved 5s: Euro, Psych
Predicted 5s (before application): Micro, USH
Predicted SAT (before application): 1800-2200
Predicted 5s (after application): Bio, English, US Gov, Spanish
Predicted 4 (after application) Calc AB</p>
<p>First, you need an SAT of <em>at least</em> 2100 to be in with a chance.
Second, there are two ‘tiers’ of APs ( see here: [Advanced</a> Placement Programme - US & Canada | UCAS](<a href=“http://www.ucas.com/how-it-all-works/explore-your-options/entry-requirements/tariff-tables/app]Advanced”>http://www.ucas.com/how-it-all-works/explore-your-options/entry-requirements/tariff-tables/app) ) so some of your APs won’t carry full weight (though they can contribute). Assuming you get the SAT score and the 5s you expect this year, you will be applying with 2 APs in history, plus the psych and micro, and no math (which all the econs will want). An SAT2 of 750 in math2 might help push your application into the interview category, but you should assume that if you got an offer it would be conditional on some of your senior year AP scores (it is normal in the UK to get an offer conditional on your final year exam results).
Third, as posted above, there is the TSA exam that you take in November of the year you apply, which is a huge factor in making the cut for interviews.</p>
<p>“have a passion for your subject, learn well independently and learn well through intensive discussion Oxbridge might suit you.” This describes me very well.
One thing I need to address as well is that I will also have an AP score for Macro (probably a 5) when I apply. How do Oxford joint degree programs look to employers/grad schools?
So if I: Get 2100+ on SAT, 750+ SAT II Math, and 5s on APs this year, Do great on TSA (Are there any study books for this?) I have a chance at an interview?
And if I nail the interview (which I should, I am great at interviews) I have a chance at Oxford?
Thanks</p>
<p>yes, that’s it, although AP Calc (Ab or BC) really is a pre-req since all British applicants will have it. A Math2 750 will indicate you’re able to catch up but you won’t be at the level they expect. Calc is more important than Econ.
The “interview” isn’t an interview like for American colleges, it’s like a loooong oral exam where they drill you mercilessly about everything related to your subject (hence the importance of reading lots of books related to it).</p>
<p>Interesting, I didn’t know all British applicants would have Calc. I know how the interview is and I still think that I well do well on it. Any ideas of where to find books to read? Should I just go to my nearest university library and read some college level books on Econ?</p>
<p>Actually, you should focus on sending out your application. The deadline is in two days!</p>
<p>@conflicted88 I am actually a junior so I have over a year before I am applying.
Thanks anyway!</p>
<p>Don’t read texts on Econ! Read ‘real’ books that relate to economics, or more importantly relate to what you find interesting about economics. Read the course descriptions at the various unis you are interested in until you hit one that sounds like something you would enjoy. Be very clear that Oxbridge are looking for students who are <em>interested</em> in what they are studying, and who will be interesting to teach. As one tutor says on an admissions podcast (find them in iTunes)- ‘we don’t really care if you are well rounded- we want you to love our subject as much as we do’. </p>
<p>They do not expect any Econ in advance, but MYOS is right about the maths- Econ has a strong math component, and is a competitive (popular) course, so most successful applicants will have a math A level / AP ( and only 5s count for APs). The SAT 2 would just help you get you over the interview hurdle.</p>
<p>As for how Oxford degrees look to employers and grad schools- it’s OXFORD!! Tbh, it is the internship that you do between the summer of your 2nd and 3rd year that really sets you up for jobs. Yes, you have lots of help finding them through the university. </p>
<p>There is a LOT of information online. Oxford’s Econ department has a list of suggested reading (though do not let that list limit you- every other eager candidate will be be reading them, so use it as a starting point, then follow your own interests). Definitely start reading the Economist regularly, and not just the Econ section (there are some stereotypes about how insular Americans are- a little broader perspective will be helpful). For TSA, there are online practice tests but no books that I am aware of. The university websites have a lot of information- just keep looking. And the student room, a UK version of this forum, has threads on Americans applying to Ox, Americans applying to UK unis, 2014 applicants to Ox, PPE applicants, etc (btw PPE is the most common course to which Americans apply).</p>
<p>Thanks so much for all the information it has been incredibly useful, now I know exactly what I need to do to try to get into Oxford.</p>
<p>Princeton, Wharton, Columbia, and (to a lesser degree) Duke are all very selective. P, W, and C all have acceptance rates <8%. Duke is still very selective at 12%.</p>
<p>Eeps, just saw the bit on citizenship and fees- be clear that unless your parents have been tax-resident in the EU (or Switzerland) for the last 3 years you will NOT qualify for the EU rate even though you are a citizen (unless they lived there full time until they were sent overseas on government business, such diplomatic service). The citizenship makes other things easier of course- visas, etc., but will not help financially.</p>
<p>Unfortunately my parents are not tax-residents so I will not receive finaid which means I will not be able to attend Oxford. Thank you for all your help @collegemom3717</p>
<p>Chance me? <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/what-my-chances/1563616-chances-cornell-dyson-ed.html#post16463724[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/what-my-chances/1563616-chances-cornell-dyson-ed.html#post16463724</a></p>
<p>Over on the United Kingdom thread (on CC) there is a frequent poster (uscamstudent) who is currently at Cambridge and either has a scholarship or knows about getting them. You might go post over there and see what you can learn.</p>