<p>She is in plenty of ECs. I guess I had thought these things were important. But, other than the French one, which she and the teacher seem to really get along (the teacher keeps telling her that she needs to go to her alma mater and wants to write the recommendation), the others are not an interest. But, she already has a full schedule without adding those in. Plus, she does community service, and has been doing it, since well before anything about NHS came along. So, NHS just would have been a label. I just thought it was perhaps an important label. But if it does not matter much, then I will let it go. Schools she applies to will see that she has the good GPA, the volunteer work, plenty of EC, the test scores, and so on.</p>
<p>“the others are not an interest”
then it’s time to say “ta-ta” to them. And leave them to those who dont know the score…
Colleges care about the EC’s that your daughter REALLY cares about. Period.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>I beg to differ. Your anecdote for your situation flies against a broader view on this. NHS is akin to “Honor Roll”. Yes, there is some requirment but for the schools that value ECs (i.e. very selective ones) NHS is nothing per se. How many people in the final round of evaluations at the Yale admissions office either are in or qualify for NHS? 99.9% of them? So how can it be a “tie-breaker”?</p>
<p>At colleges w/ broader acceptance criteria – it’s simply a formula (GPA + SAT/ACT) – again, NHS isn’t evaluated – not a “tie-breaker” – and in my opinion very “pufferish” unless substantial actions/leadership accompany it.</p>
<p>Editing to add…OP, I would suggest you read the book Letting Go. It is an excellent book that really is about parents letting go when their kids leave for college, but it does talk very nicely about the process of kids growing up, and parents letting go. An excellent read!</p>
<p>Lmkh, in my opinion you are creating a ruckus over something that is not important. One of my kids was in NHS and the other was not. The one who was not actually attended a higher ranking college than the one who was. Take a deep breath and let this go. And I agree with others…as a parent, I was NEVER involved with anything having to do with this stuff while my kids were in high school. The first I heard of NHS was when we got an invite to the initiation ceremony. Prior to that, my high school kid handled it all.</p>
<p>The school my son went to approached him in the library to join - he looked over at the kids and said no thanks. No official application, it was just a club. I don’t think it harmed him in the slightest not joining.</p>
<p>New school with my d - you have to be invited to apply, have a high gpa - I think 3.75, teacher recs, volunteerism, leadership and you have to write an essay after school. She was denied in the fall and just tried again. The funny thing, is that while she’ll be in the club because she’s that type, she really just wants the cords for graduation. I seriously doubt it will help her in any way.</p>
<p>The difference between the two schools is astounding. However, same club, different requirements to get in. To me that means the club is meaningless on a national level.</p>
<p>T26- C’mon where talking EC’s here. It can only help. The argument that one doesn’t need it because everyone is the same ----- is actually a better arguement for more needing it than not. Again it’s a brand. It represents accomplishment. All things being equal, it just might make a difference. (as much as a good EC can)
Thx-I’ll leave you with the last word.</p>
<p>NHS was important to my kid only as a matter of pride: most of his friends were admitted junior year, and if he hadn’t been he would have been somewhat humiliated. (I know this because when the invitations came out, he initially didn’t get one. It turned out that his and one other student’s–they were at the end of the alphabet–were mangled by the postage/addressing machine and were returned. The teacher in charge of NHS noticed this and resent them. It happened to be the Friday before a weeklong vacation, so when the invitation arrived on Saturday he was spared a week of emotional turmoil. 
)</p>
<p>The system for selecting kids is flawed and often highly political. I personally know of several eminently deserving kids who did not get in junior year, while others with lesser records and accomplishments did. (They eventually got in senior year, thankfully.) I’m sure that there are many more cases that I don’t know about, because I don’t know the families or kids.</p>
<p>Although it certainly can sting for the individual kid, I don’t think that NOT being in NHS makes a real difference for college applications. I’m sure that colleges are well aware of the vagaries of NHS selection.</p>
<p>I would look at this as a learning experience: being presented by her HS as a top student in her class, and not only in terms of GPA, CAN matter in college applications, especially if applying to schools that are not wholly “by the numbers.” So figure out how to repair/improve her relationship with the guidance dept and administration. You going in and making a fuss and accusing teachers of lying is not going to be helpful.</p>
<p>I have to say that NHS risks being the epitome of “pufferish”, as in resume padding. Lets just add one more activity to look impressive. The students GPA and teacher LORs are right there so NHS as a beleaguered AOs tiebreaker is ludicrous. </p>
<p>I don’t know when people are going to ‘get it’. There is no ‘right’ EC, not model UN, robotics, debate, double varsity sports, the rare oboe player, science olympiad, etc. Let your kids pick activities that keep them connected and involved in their schools and communities. The specific EC doesn’t matter, WHAT your student does there makes all the difference. Is there dedication, responsibility/leadership? Have they made a difference, shown innovation? Been recognized on a regional, state, or national level. To do this one can rarely be involved in more then 3-4 activities (depending on seasonal commitment) to give them adequate attention. If an AO sees a r</p>
<p>My kids did not like the teacher who ran NHS at our high school or the extra activities that would be involved. They wrote their volunteer hours on the Common Application. Their Mom did not make waves at the high school if she could possibly help it. We did advocated for our oldest to take AP Comp Sci as a freshman (got an A and a 5). We did talk about whether he should take CTY Chem over the summer so that scheduling courses would be easier the following year. </p>
<p>Both of my kids got into an assortment of highly selective colleges (including Harvard for the older one). If there’s evidence that your child is giving back to the community there is no necessity for the NHS.</p>
<p>Blueiguana is right, neither of my kids did more than three school activities - Science Olympiad and Academic Team for the older one. Science Olympiad, Literary Magazine and orchestra for the younger one. Older son did tons of computer programming stuff outside school. (Paid work, volunteer academic work, and some more fun recognitions for online computer gaming work.) Younger son had a very tiny business making and selling origami earrings. Both did most of their volunteer hours during the summer.</p>
<p>I think the real issue here is that either you or your child has offended people passing out awards at your school - I think everyone needs to step back and see if you can repair those relationships.</p>
<p>I would not worry about it. I have seen enough comments on CC about rather weird NHS selection procedures that even after one discounts possible misrepresentations and exaggerations, it seems highly probable that in some schools, students are selected for NHS in a biased fashion.</p>
<p>One of QMP’s friends was by-passed for NHS because she made a statement in the (required) essay that President Clinton had been impeached. The teachers on the committee reportedly believed this to be inaccurate. I was delighted to see that the same student, several years down the road, was elected to Phi Beta Kappa at her university.</p>
<p>In practical terms, oldfort is giving you good advice. However, that assumes that the teachers at the school are all operating in good faith. You have raised a reasonable doubt in my mind about some of the teachers at your children’s school.</p>
<p>The idea of “flipping the classroom” is in vogue right now. It is supposed to increase student learning and engagement. It might work–too early to tell. However, I am pretty sure that it cannot work if the teachers cannot handle the math questions. There are high schools in the country where this could happen, for sure.</p>
<p>Really, NHS was mainly an avenue for my kids to get some easily available community service hours (already organized, just show up) and wear the shiny collar and cord at graduation. I know that the organization, itself, made no difference in college applications or scholarship applications…now the service hours…they helped…but you can use all kinds of other avenues to get those if you want.</p>
<p>Just the truth.</p>
<p>The OP explained why she was involved and present in the school, and has a kid with an IEP. So I don’t think it is clear that she merits too much criticism about being too involved etc.</p>
<p>The question about NHS is fairly simple: it doesn’t seem to matter that much to colleges. Many bright involved kids are turned off by NHS for a variety of reasons and don’t join.</p>
<p>The flipped classroom is a great idea but it seems as if the teachers at this school are letting Kahn or whomever is teaching online, do the work for them. The flipped classroom would- ahem- seem to require that teachers also listen to or view the lecture.</p>
<p>I think that the OP’s kids are at a school with some problems w/quality of teaching. When that is the case, principals often stand by teachers in front of a parent (I have heard this is actually required by the union contract). If the parent sees a consistent pattern, then meeting with the principal, and, if not satisfied, the superintendent, and, if not satisfied, the School Board/Committee, is reasonable.</p>
<p>Alternatively, for a class that is that satisfactory, there are alternatives: online classes (Virtual High School, community college, other colleges) or dual enrollment programs at community colleges. That’s what we did when our kids had a history teacher who talked about his childhood the entire time and never gave a test.</p>
<p>There is a point where you cannot bang your head against the wall of a poor quality school and getting out is another option. Homeschooling, using Keystone for instance, or community college for high school. This school sounds stressful and even more so for a parent with a kid with an IEP- and for the kids.</p>
<p>Sounds like NHS is the least of the OP’s worries and I send my sympathies.</p>
<p>lmkh70, if there are still unanswered questions about math problems, please PM me with them. For the most part, you can write the problems with the standard computer keys. Raising a number to a power is often signified by ^, e.g., 3^4 = 81. It would be important to distinguish between 1/sin(x) and sin^(-1)(x) in the notation, because the latter is normally taken to signify the arcsin(x). It is helpful if you can use multiple types of parentheses notations (, [, and { to set off nested expressions. If I can’t understand the formatting, I will let you know.</p>
<p>I recently left a time-consuming thread where I have had all the traction I’m likely to have. So I have a little time, and would be happy to help out, if I can.</p>
<p>Also, there are a lot of good online sites for math homework help, which can provide faster turnaround than I often can. I’d go with one that’s free. Have your children try a few, and see which one gives the best explanations for them.</p>
<p>Yes, it can make a difference if your kid is in the NHS or not. A big difference. If your kid is one of the small select group applying to the top colleges and all of the other kid are in NHS and she is not, yes, it can be apparent. More importantly, it can make a difference on how the GC will rate her when making the school rec for her which you have to have for the top schools, and many schools, for that matter. </p>
<p>It may not make any difference, but, yes, it can. And it does depend on how much weight the high school puts on its NHS in terms of it being part of their best students’ profile.</p>
<p>OP, I’m really sorry to hear that NHS is run like a sorority at your daughter’s school. It sounds as if you have more than a few battles to fight, so I agree with many others in suggesting you drop this and concentrate on the math class issue. Documenting specific problems in an email and ccing the principal and the superintendent can often yield satisfactory results.</p>
<p>On the topic of EC’s, I recently read a tweet from an AO who said she was “unimpressed with 2 EC’s, because I was so involved in my school.” I question the maturity and decision making process of some of these younger AO’s who are gatekeeping.</p>
<p>^Neither of my kids’ GCs ever said a word about my kids not being in NHS. Didn’t see the actual letters (older son saw his), but by all accounts they were enthusiastic and 100% positive. I know both GCs liked my kids as well as respecting their academic work and EC accomplishments. I suppose there are GCs out there who write negative things about kids, but my impression is that our GCs are trying to get kids into the best possible colleges they can. It makes the high school look good so they aren’t going to say “Johnny is great except he’s not in NHS.”</p>
<p>Frazzled1 is right-it good practice for college applications. My son has high functioning autism with a 98 average. He was declined acceptance from the NHS. They stated he had to have held office or be in a leadership role such as captain etc. plus he needed more extra curriculars.</p>
<p>It pushed him to join Leo’s Club, volunteer at the local animal shelter and be a speaker at an autism conference.</p>
<p>I pulled the Superintendent aside and told him that defining “leadership” in such narrow terms for a kid on the spectrum is like asking a kid in a wheelchair to walk across the room. I pushed my son to do what he had to do( which really helped for EC’s on his college apps) but also leaned on the district as they were practicing discrimination. Another student a grade or two ahead of my son on the spectrum was denied twice to the NHS and was told it was because he did not hold a leadership position.</p>
<p>My son was admitted the second time he applied as well as a number of other special education students.</p>
<p>They also probably knew that I would FOIA the district for the past three years for the number of students in the NHS with IEP’s. Looking at the list from the previous year of students in the NHS ,not one was a student with a disability( we have a very small district and I am involved with the SEPTA and pretty much know most of the parents whose children have disabilities).</p>
<p>So it was a good experience for my son and for the district in changing their perceptions about students with disabilities.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Not true…there are many, many colleges that fall in between the ivies and a simple GPA/SAT formula. NHS is certainly a plus for these colleges. I realize this is CC and many here thumb their noses at NHS, but it does help for many students…</p>
<p>My kids didn’t do it. S said, “If everyone is in it, it’s no honor.” (At their school it’s probably the top 1/4-1/3 of class.) If you have great scores, GPA, have other state or national awards, EC’s, etc. no one is going to say, “Hey, how come you didn’t join NHS?”
Compared to other activities on most top student’s resumes, NHS is a minor, throwaway detail. If you are already in the top 5% do you really need to announce that you are “Also in the Top 25%?”</p>
<p>In my day it seemed that popularity with the teachers was a big factor, and it was limited to 15% of the class. We had two NMF’s (of 12) in our class, well-in the top 10%, involved in activities, sports, etc. who got cut, when many with lower academic credentials made it. (After it was noticed that both of these students belonged to the same tiny minority ethnic group, the school admitted them to NHS-- AFTER graduation!)</p>