Do these things carry any weight at all? I thought it was just if you have the gpa and scores you’re in and if you don’t you aren’t.
Depends on the school. “Top” schools care about more than grades/scores. They reject perfect 4.0’s and 1600’s and valedictorians. Academics still matter of course; but you can’t get into a school like Harvard or Stanford based on only academics. Other colleges like maybe your in-state school don’t care very much beyond academics, but you’re essays/recs can’t be outright terrible.
^^
More recently, schools have been leaning towards EC’s, essays, and recs because they’d much prefer an active, smart student over a reclusive genius. That said, most have a certain GPA and score you need to even be considered a competitive applicant. After this point, it basically comes down to only essays, recs, and ECs
If they didn’t matter at all, schools wouldn’t require them. They wouldn’t choose to be bogged down in extra paperwork they aren’t going to consider.
You can totally kill an application with a bad essay.
You can totally kill an application with a bad essay. A perfect essay would not rescue an application with poor stat though.
I saw a comment on a different thread that said something along the lines of grades and scores get you through the door, everything else gets you a seat at the table.
Of course, some state schools calculate by algorithm but those are exceptions.
Google to find a given school’s Common Data Set and check section C7; it shows how important such things are to the school.
That is probably more the rule than the exception, at least in some states, since most state schools are not that selective and see sufficient distinction between applicants by GPA/rank/tests.
For example, the 22 CSUs in California using GPA/tests only outnumber the 9 UCs using holistic readings including essays (but not recommendations generally). All publics in Texas admit much of their classes by rank or rank/tests.
In my opinion they cannot make up for less than optimal grades and stats. What they do is give you an opportunity to tell about yourself and differentiate yourself from others in similar academic circumstances. They make the most difference on the margins. If you are on the margin academically for a school the ECs, Rec and Essays may make a difference. Since nearly everyone who applies to very selective schools is on the margin so to speak (most applicants are academically qualified) these will be the differentiator.
It really depends on the school and the applicant. Most schools as ucbalumnus says only use the gpa/tests to select the class. The selective schools will use it differently based on what kind of applicant you are, hooked, unhooked, legacy, athlete etc. In the case of athletes say, the coach picks the kids who will get in, not really the adcoms as long as they meet the school’s standards (which could be higher than ncaa). So there the essay may just get read for red flags, if at all and ecs outside of your sport will not matter. If your parents are going to give a million to fund a wing of the library or your parents are politically connected, the recommendations won’t get read.
Where the essays, ecs and recs are scrutinized are in the unhooked applicants that are fighting for the spots not taken up by athletes, legacies, donors, urms, first-gen.
Look at a college of interest and google " common data set".
Look in Section C:
Relative importance of each of the following academic and nonacademic factors in first-time, firstyear,
degree-seeking (freshman) admission decisions
It rates each of the items below Very Important, Important, Considered Not ,Considered
Academic:
Rigor of secondary school record
Class rank
Academic GPA
Standardized test scores
Application Essay
Recommendation(s)
Nonacademic:
Interview
Extracurricular activities
Talent/ability
Character/personal qualities
First generation
Alumni/ae relation
Geographical residence
State residency
Religious affiliation/commitment
Racial/ethnic status
Volunteer work
Work experience
Level of applicant’s interest
The first four are usually “Very Important”. For private schools, the nonacademic ones may be more important. For massive public schools, it is usually about grades/GPA.
the common data sets show uw gpa, do colleges recalculate or not im so confused?
Went to several selective schools’ campus tour, and the admission office all said that the admission officers were looking for good stories from the applicants to get them in, an not to cut them. So where do you think they get the good stories? Certainly, not the GPA and test scores, but the personal essay, ECs, and recommendations. Just using GPA and test scores, there would have no need of admission officers at all; computer programs can do that.
There are some of Asian American applicants and their families don’t realize that, so they have the issue with the holistic system that selective schools use to select students.
Totally agree with @OhWhatsHerName. The things you listed are what sets you appart from all the other applicants with the same or better stats.
@amNotarobot Is that just your opinion, or do you know of any studies that show Asian Americans, in greater proportion than other groups, don’t realize how the holistic admissions works?
@LadyMeowMeow I don’t need to know any studies. Surrounding by Asian Americans (of course being one myself) and seeing many of our youths starting preparation of SAT tests in 7th and 8th grades whole summer and throughout their school years. Also recently read many free-Chinese papers reporting the Asian American groups’ lawsuit against Harvard’s holistic system. I haven’t see any other groups (yes by individuals, but not an ethnic group) suing the Harvard. Yes, its my opinion, but it is also my own experience. Having growing up in an Asian country with higher education system all based on test scores, I would rather the U.S. higher education will never ever become like that. I believe you are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine, and thanks God, this is a free country.
@amNotarobot I wasn’t trying to argue for test-only admissions. The US has great diversity in its admissions practices across all kinds of institution, so I don’t think we need to worry about uniformity taking over. And I certainly respect your opinion, especially since you’re not a robot.
NACAC does a study about admissions factors every few years. Here is the most recent data, explaining which factors are most important. https://www.nacacnet.org/news–publications/publications/state-of-college-admission/
Click on “Factors in Admission Decisions” and look on page 17 in the PDF.