<p>I have a really basic question about testing.</p>
<p>I live out in SAT country, but people are starting to learn more about the ACT. I've often read on CC that some kids do significantly better on one test than the other, and if you're one of those kids then you should go with your better test.</p>
<p>The question is how much testing it's reasonable to invest in - both test prep and real tests - to figure out if there's going to be a meaningful difference for a particular kid. We already have so much state-level testing that it's not trivial to suggest more college tests.</p>
<p>I'm asking both as a parent of a 10th grader and as a volunteer at a local high school that is trying to help students at all levels of academic ability to make the best choices. Our school provides some test prep (currently through a third party), and we're trying to figure out the best way to spend our limited dollars. So far, we give the PSAT to all sophomores and juniors, and the test prep course has been for the SAT only. We make sure that low-income kids get fee waivers for both the SAT and the ACT if they decide to try that out.</p>
<p>Would it be reasonable to suggest that all 11th graders do an ACT diagnostic test along with the PSAT? If so, is 11th grade the right time to do it? Is the ACT test book a good way to do a self-diagnosis? Is preparing for the ACT similar to the SAT, or since it's more knowledge-based is it a whole different ballgame?</p>
<p>Thanks for your help. I know people here have a lot of experience with both kinds of tests.</p>
<p>At our high school, 10th graders take the PLAN test, which is like the counterpart of the PSAT. The ACT site says it's a powerful predictor of success on the ACT.</p>
<p>Calreader if I had to do it all over again I would have had my Ds sit for an early session of both. Then I would compare and have them prep and retest in the one in which they did the best. One of my DDs sat for two SAT 1s and we will likely not send any of those scores.</p>
<p>S (a junior) and I have been discussing this. He's thinking of taking the SAT in March and the ACT in April. Depending on which one he does better in, he'll probably retake that test in June, and perhaps again fall of senior year if he feels it's necessary.</p>
<p>Yes, the vast majority of kids do equally well (or poorly) on both tests. And, yes, some kids ace one of the other. The SAT has more 'reasoning' questions whereas the focus on the ACT is speed, i.e., questions are more straightforward, but speed is of the essence. The so-called science section is the one that trips up most kids; it's mostly about speed-reading charts and graphs. </p>
<p>If money is no object, counselors I know recommend students take both tests and see which one works better. Now that CB offers score choice for the class of '14, there is nothing to lose by taking the SAT and doing poorly.</p>
<p>Since you have low income kids (and money is a concern), perhaps your school library could purchase a pile of prep books so kids could check them out. A prep course per se is not needed -- any student who is self-motivated can work thru the standard prep books and improve his/her score.</p>
<p>My daughter preferred the ACT. The reasons she gave is that the ACT doesn't take as many hours to take, and with the ACT, you do math, then you're done with math - you are not flipping back and forth between subjects. </p>
<p>At our HS, 10th graders take the PLAN. if you have a good score on the PLAN, the guidance counsellor will encourage you to take the ACT.</p>
<p>Since ACT allows the student to choose which scoring session results are sent I wouldn't have students waste money on the pre ACT test. No one around here ever takes the PLAN test (in fact, I had never heard of it until CC), everyone just does the ACT as a junior, possibly again as a senior. Being in ACT country the schools offer a test prep session. But students can use free the online and written materials from ACT to become familiar with it. The Midwest Talent Search has 5th graders take the 8th grade EXPLORE test, then the 7th and 8th graders move on to the ACT and/or SAT.</p>
<p>Regarding calendars, if all feasible I would highly recommend to any schools to give the PLAN in 9th grade and keep the PSAT for the 10th grade. On an individual basis, I am not a big fan of the PLAN nor of the other IOWA based tests. The career "diagnostics" of such tests are just plain ludicrous and the testing itself is only so-so. I consider that the biggest value --if not only-- of the ACT is that it provides additional strategies in the admission cycle, and that it helps students identify the type of tests on which they could do better. </p>
<p>As far as differences between testing "achievement" versus [fill the blank with pompous educational term] it simply amounts to a bunch of baloney! The academic preparation for the ACT and the SAT is virtually the same. The differences between the ACT and the SAT are mostly cosmetic, safe and except for one of the elements Bluebayou did point out correctly, namely speed. Another one being the absence of penalties. </p>
<p>All in all, for people who are familiar with the SAT, the ACT is a more "annoying" test because of its different and less straightforward presentation. As far as preparation, there is a LOT less valuable preparation available for the ACT as the ACT "organization" does not seem to value self-preparation all that much. Compared to the availability of released PSAT and SAT tests, the old red SAT book, and the Blue Book, the ACT offers very little. </p>
<p>In conclusion, it IS wise to take both, but I would not recommend to anyone to place his or her MAIN focus on the ACT.</p>
<p>Thanks so much to all of you. I'll share these comments and suggestions with the people at our school. I can see that it's not cut and dried, but you've teased out some of the trade-offs so I can understand them better.</p>
<p>Bluebayou - or anyone - do you know if there's any data out there on most kids doing roughly the same (for better or worse)? Or is that more the word on the street? If there were some studies I could point to it would be very helpful. If the difference is likely to be present for a small number of kids, it's not worth putting a lot of energy or money into optimizing for the whole student population. However, it sounds like if the student is motivated and we can provide financial support, it might really help kids to try both tests at first.</p>
<p>Another thing to pass on to your school, because you don't hear about fee waivers for the ACT like you do for the SAT and when the ACT sends out fee waivers, they only send about 10 to a school, many people think you cannot get fee waivers for the ACT. </p>
<p>Just have the GC at your school contact the counselor's line at the ACT. Speak to the customer service rep and they are very amenable to sending as many fee waivers as your school needs for low income students (they are sent in groups of 100). They will get to use 2 fee waivers over a 2 year period just like they do for the SAT.</p>
<p>Calreader, that is what our hs did last year. They administered the PLAN and the PSAT to 10th graders. They will readminister the PSAT to those 10th graders this year (now they are 11th graders). One must keep in mind that the PLAN is designed for 10th graders. The PSAT is an 11th grade test.</p>
<p>Actually, I did the contacting myself last year to get us the ACT waivers :-). It sounds like we're on the mailing list now, so we got a box of waivers this year without requesting them.</p>
<p>I'm not a real guidance counselor but I play one on the phone.</p>
<p>I think our resident expert Xiggi has it right. </p>
<p>There are kids who do lots better on the ACT. The ACT tests a little differently and the ACT takes considerably less time. D#1 did very well on the SAT and considered taking the ACT. D#2 had a medical condition that made her very tired after five hours of reading. She did better on the ACT. </p>
<p>If one can infer a conclusion from just two data points, it might be to take the ACT first, and then the SAT. Students intimidated by the "newer, better, L-O-N-G-E-R" SAT may decide to end testing right there.</p>
<p>According to College Board, it's "only" twenty-five percent longer than the old SAT -- three hours and forty-five minutes of actual test time. The following article provides a critique of the "new test" experience:</p>
<p>Parent's suggestion to D#2 was "Take the ACT and the SAT, then retake the test you do better on." When she came out of the SAT test center (in at 7:15 AM, out at 1:50 PM) she said "I'm not doing that again." Her score wasn't that bad really, though the both ACT takes were better.</p>