<p>Don't rule out Amherst - D is VERY conservative and has joined a very active YR Club there. No problems socially or fitting in. In fact, her friends are Jewish, Christian and Moslem liberals as well as conservatives. Politics has not been an issue in making friends there. And while there are some preppy kids there, over 50% come from public HS's. There are many options available. D is in substance free all female dorm floor, and loves it! There are numerous activities allt he time for the non-imbiders. Next year, she will move into the Spanish House.</p>
<p>Bump. OK--got the SATs and the first semester grades for jr. year:
SATs: CR=760, Wr=710, M=680. Grades=4.0 GPA overall. Core classes are AP calc AB, AP Physics, AP US history, AP Spanish. She's also logged hours and hours this year as a math tutor to a struggling sophomore along w/ a full slate of ECs.</p>
<p>Her list so far: MIT, Carnegie-Mellon, U of Chicago, Carleton, Macalester, Notre Dame, Middlebury, Wesleyan, Swarthmore. I don't know why the last two--they don't seem to match her interests too well, but that's OK. Safeties are Dickinson and U. of Washington.</p>
<p>She really should be at a school that has business and engineering but at least has a 3/2 with an engineering or other professional school. Dickinson's 3-3 law program looks interesting. </p>
<p>Would appreciate your assessment of chances/fit at the schools other than MIT--we know that's the lottery school.</p>
<p>mombot, a couple of thoughts. How do Notre Dame and Wesleyan get on the same list? LOL. I'm not picking on either school. They are both excellent.</p>
<p>and </p>
<p>Your daughter and my daughter have similar scores on the PSAT and the SAT. She ended up finding that the ACT was a better test for her as by the concordance she went up 110 points CR and Math with very little prep (1470-1580). </p>
<p>Your D will be an very good candidate at any school, IMO.</p>
<p>What about some of the good southern schools - UVa, W&L, Duke (maybe too northern socially). I would think these would be more socially conservative - I know W&L is.</p>
<p>Mombot, a second vote for a stab at the ACT.</p>
<p>I had to smile at Notre Dame and Wesleyan/Swarthmore on the same list, but my daughter's had similar incongruities, so you aren't alone.</p>
<p>I'm assuming you are in Washington State, I'm too lazy to return to the beginning, I would suggest adding a LAC within a reasonable driving distance to your home, since she seems to have an interest in LACs - can't recommend one, I'm not familiar enough with the NW.
The biggest potential mistake we made with DD's list was that she did not have a LAC safety far from home - your posted list did not show any LAC safety closer to home.</p>
<p>Dickinson's not a safety? The other LAC safeties are Whitman and Willamette--not far from home, but a day's drive away.</p>
<p>I don't understand Wesleyan and Swarthmore either--I'm confident they will probably drop off the list after she does more research. The idea is for her to cast a wide net and be looking at different kinds of schools and then whittle the list down between now and next fall.</p>
<p>We aren't looking in the south, southwest or California because she's a cold weather lover. North Carolina and Virginia might be OK, but nothing warmer than that.</p>
<p>Mombot said:</p>
<br>
<p>By social conservative I meant a classic libertarian. She doesn't drink but it doesn't bother her that others do--she goes to the parties and drives people home. She's bothered by unkindness and hypocrisy. She is opposed to affirmative action but is pro gay marriage and pro choice. To her there's an absolute standard of right and wrong, but it's not the government's job to police morals.<</p>
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<p>I don't see the problem; there are lots of people who don't drink or smoke at Wesleyan; people who don't "hook up", etc.. What she will find are lots of strong women just like herself -- and a 3/2 program, which may explain the attraction.</p>
<p>Mombot - I don't know if Dickinson is a safety or not! I re-read my post, I originally had made some other inane comments, but i had deleted them, leaving the last few sentences unintelligible.</p>
<p>You ARE doing what I was suggesting - having safeties both close and far from home that are close in size to what she seems to prefer. I don't know enough about the stats of those specific schools to determine whether or not these are stat appropriate for her. I was trying to say that we had the close safeties covered, but left off the faraway LAC safety, which might have been a mistake - worked out in the long run, but could have been not good.</p>
<p>If your D is at all interested in LACs I would strongly suggest a close look at Davidson (North Carolina LAC consistently in USNWR top ten); while not conservative by real-world standards it is more conservative than other LACs in that it has a lot of Republicans as well as Democrats. Thre is a strong religion department that covers many religions (and taking at least one course is part of the graduation requirements). It is an excellent school acacdemically and socially and close enough to the airport in Charlotte that travel isn't a huge problem (that is, if you are going to fly to and from school, this is an easy school to fly to). It does not have the truly cold weather your D maybe looking for, but it certainly has days where you need a warm jacket and gloves. It is highly selective but not quite as difficult to get into as Williams and Amherst; it isn't cutthroat, either (nor are they). Might be a reach, but more of a high match, depending on how things go this year, I would say.</p>
<p>The flood of post-PSAT mail started this week and she's pawing through it. It is interesting as a marketing manager to see what catches her eye and what gets tossed. She responds well to quirky.</p>
<p>I wanted to mention that using Whitman for a safety could be a mistake- their admit rate in 2004 was 50% sure to have gone down by then
For my comfort, a school can only be called a safety if their admit rate is over 75%-85% and your scores are well over the top students</p>
<p>Look at St. Louis University. It is a Jesuit school, but has a med school and an engineering school, so their sciences aren't dreadful. They offer 30 Presidential scholarships a year, which are full tuition scholarships. Even if she is just nominated for a presidential, she'll get a half tuition scholarship. They have a campus in Madrid, so your daughter could continue with her spanish. My daughter is a presidential scholar there. She turned down more highly ranked schools because of the money. The campus is friendly and it has improved over the past few years. My daughter volunteers at Cardinal Glennen Children's hospital every week. She is a junior and loves the place (except for the weather -- we live in Florida!!).</p>
<p>Bump...OK..SAT II's are in...700 in physics, 760 in math and US History. She has not and will not retake the basic SATs. She's also tacking more toward lib arts--she will be judge/head juror next year on the teen court, managing editor of the paper and she got appointed to be the student rep to the school board. </p>
<p>She absolutely does not fit the profile of the MIT types I see on this board because she has zero interest in research or science olympiad stuff. She is focused on what I'd call more civic activities: newspaper, tutoring, teen court, school board. Her school does not have a debate team which is unfortunate because her debate teacher emailed me out of the blue raving about how she's never seen anybody so amazing at debate and wanting a cut of her earnings when she gets out of law school (g). </p>
<p>List is now: Carleton, Macalester, U of Washington, Lewis and Clark (safety and a killer debate school), Dickinson, Middlebury, MIT (because it's hard and she loves that). I"m not sure about ND--haven't heard about that one in awhile.</p>
<p>My question is will the 760 on math IIc have more weight at MIT than the 680 on the math SAT? SHe is tracking for a strong score on calc AB but we won't know those scores until August. I hate to give the *** collegboard any more money to retake the stupid SAT if I can avoid it, especially if her Calculus score comes back as strong as her prep tests indicate it might.</p>
<p>Edit: I'm asking about MIT because of all of the schools she's visited, she connected in some way she can't quite articulate, even though it is quite different than the other schools she likes. She's leaning toward a math or business major (math at a liberal arts school), but will absolutely say she doesn't know what she wants to study because she thinks so many different things are interesting.</p>
<p>Have you posted this question on the MIT forum? There's an MIT admissions rep who posts regularly there. Or check this MIT adrep's blog:
<a href="http://matt.mitblogs.com/%5B/url%5D">http://matt.mitblogs.com/</a></p>
<p>Not every MIT kid is a scientific researcher. We have top-notch programs in Management (Business), Political Science (there's also a minor specifically in Public Policy available), and Urban Studies & Planning, which all seem like they might appeal to her leadership and civic interests, as well as many activities that she might be interested in - College Democrats/Republicans, Pro-Choice, student newspapers and magazines, many levels and types of student government (I can tell you about those in more detail if you want) and various service groups.</p>
<p>Her SAT IIs are quite strong. If the rest of her application is strong I doubt a 680 on the SAT I math will hurt her.</p>
<p>As for the social scene, there are a lot of well-developed subcultures at MIT and you can get pretty much anything you're looking for.</p>
<p>I second fireflyscout's recommendation to check out the blogs or come on over to the MIT forum. :)</p>
<p>I've been lurking over there in the MIT folder..I'll check out the blog.</p>
<p>MIT has excellent programs in the social sciences listed in post #95...but MIT is SO different in terms of atmostphere and student body from the other schools on the list! If she's looking for "hard"...this is a case where there are Ivys that would be more like the schools on her list -- specifically Dart, Brown, Cornell. Is she considering any of these schools?</p>
<p>Have her check out the MIT in Washington program... some amazing internships and a really great opportunity for a kid interested in policy. </p>
<p>However, the question isn't can she get in... the question is, does she want to tackle the core curriculum, which is required of everyone, even Political Science or Urban planning majors. Unless she's really turned on by math, it's going to be a lot of heavy lifting as she slogs her way through the required courses.</p>
<p>Mombot-
I haven't read this whole thread, so I hope I've got the jist. Another great school that isn't on your list is William & Mary; relatively conservative but not to the extreme by any means. Has a great business school and really focuses on undergrads. Not sure about the math dept. Eve oos tuition is an incredible bargain, basically a top-notch private liberal arts experience (many actually think it is private) with the public school pricing. Her scores would probably also get her a Monroe scholarship as well as perhaps a full ride based on your geographic location. Some of the other schools you listed are quite liberal, so you should probably let her spend some time at her top choices, if at all possible. Just my 2 cents, for whatever it's worth.</p>
<p>Mombot,</p>
<p>I missed this thread during the winter, but since I'm just beginning the process with my rising junior son, I found it interesting. I saw in one of your comments that if your daughter were a boy she might be interested in a service academy. Well, as a mother of twin girls, one at West Point and one at a civilian Big Ten university, I can tell you that the service academy experience has been nothing but amazing. It's tough academically, physically, and yes, sometimes emotionally. However, the education is fantastic, the drinking is just not an option for freshmen, and the career opportunities are both guaranteed and excellent. The service academies have a commitment to honor and ethics that you won't find too many other places. The environment is extremely supportive for female cadets. The politics of the students and faculty varies from both ends of the extremes - yes, this is a surprise to many. Religion is not forced in any way at all, but is supported for those who wish to participate. It might be worth looking at the websites in order to see if there is any interest.</p>
<p>Good luck to both of you.</p>