Importance of Master Teacher?

College Majors Music Major
1

<p>I was notified this morning via email, from a local college cello professor that he will not be able to teach my son as was previously planned since late May. He explained & apologized that he over-extended himself & will not be able to take on any new students. This of course, was an enormous disappointment to my son today. Not to mention, waiting in anticipation the entire summer to begin lessons with him. </p>

<p>My son’s current teacher is a former grad student of this professor’s. He is more than happy to continue the lessons. Oddly enough, he has been teaching my S. all summer in preparation for the master teacher. </p>

<p>So, my question is how important is actually having a "master" teacher in advancing a student to a level needed to audition and plan for a future in performance? I will admit that this current (and much younger) teacher has been very good and has worked my S. hard. He has advanced faster than with any other teacher to date. But my S. does not have a lot of time left if he wants to make it. He’s a junior in high school. This is his last 12 months to get it all in place for auditions.</p>

<p>Thank you in advance.</p>

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<p>This is a very personal decision that could depend on any number of factors. Not knowing the particulars, it is hard to give advice one way or the other. Since the college professor is unavailable, your options are to stay with the current teacher or find someone else entirely. </p>

<p>Most auditions are not held until January or later, so you have more like 16 months to prepare. That would be enough for some serious work if you still wish to change teachers. I imagine there would be some good ones available in the Chicago area, including CSO and Lyric Opera members and teachers at places like Northwestern and Roosevelt. You need to get moving soon if you want to change teachers, since your son will want as much time as possible with the new one before auditions start.</p>

<p>On the other hand, you know that the current teacher works well with your son and, as a student of the other intended teacher, he will probably be giving your son much of the same approach that he would have gotten had everything gone as planned.</p>

<p>My daughter had to "settle" for studying with the student of the teacher she really wanted and things went quite well for her. She was the first conservatory-level student that this fellow ever had and she learned an incredible amount from him. He gave her more time and attention than she could have possibly gotten from the master teacher. It is impossible to say even in retrospect which situation would have been better.</p>

<p>If the original professor is on your son's list of possibilities for college, he could do a lot worse than studying with one of that teacher's former students. If the studios to which he will be applying differ substantially in approach from the current teacher, then it could be a good idea to switch.</p>

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<p>I can add nothing to BassDad's reply other than to suggest asking the teacher that cancelled to possibly provide one or two potential high level replacements.</p>

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<p>Good luck to your son. It is very possible that the present situation will be quite excellent, and that his teacher could arrange some "coachings" for him when he approaches audition time. The other option is a summer institute between his junior and senior years with a major cello teacher, a chance to concentrate and prepare his audition materials. Watch for the application deadlines, because a recording is required for each of these, in different formats, unfortunately. </p>

<p>Lorelei</p>

5

<p>Rudysmom,</p>

<p>I don't think your question has a clear generally applicable answer. The right course of action depends on the specific quality of the teacher-student relationship much more than on the external stature of the teacher. My daughter is the same age as your son; also a serious cellist with excellent accomplishments and great potential. She has never had a master teacher.<br>
She has made great strides with young (and not so young) 'unknown' teachers. From age 9 on, she has clearly been the 'star' student in her teachers' studios (the teacher she had at age 8 did have at least 2 more fantabluous students, one age 13 and one age 6).</p>

<p>At times, this has caused her distress. At summer programs she has met teen-aged cellists who are students of 'big names' from MSM and Juilliard. So then she would start to question whether she was really as good as her teacher thought she was. She got to a point where she wanted to have someone tougher, more rigorous, more technically demanding.... as things worked out, the 'someone' we found was a younger, less-experienced teacher (a recent IU graduate, student of Emilio Colon) with whom she made great progress.</p>

<p>I worried about this alot for about a year (9th/10th grade). In the end, I don't think a master teacher is so necessary. Sometimes, especially at this age, it can be better to be a big fish in a small pond. My daughter had infinitely more attention paid to her by her 'unknown' teachers than she would have had as a student of, say, Joel Krosnick. Her teachers' schedules were much less crowded; she regularly had lessons go way over the time alloted. Her hunger for outside validation was addressed in other ways: she competed and succeeded in youth orchestra auditions, concerto competitions, summer program auditions, etc. </p>

<p>I think finding a good fit with a gifted teacher is very valuable. It sounds like your son has found that. Also, assuming that your son's teacher has stayed in touch with the 'master teacher' (HJJ?) which is very likely to be the case, your son will still have some advantages -- perhaps an invitation to play in a master class, or a small number of lessons with the master teacher in preparation for a major audition. So unless he doesn't feel sufficiently challenged by the teacher, or doesn't feel that he is progressing, I don't think you need to consider leaving.</p>

<p>Me</p>

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<p>Another view: For my kid, studying with a "master teacher" for the last two years of high school made a decisive difference -- in terms of knowing what it takes to get into a conservatory, the general level of the studio, knowledge of what kinds of summer programs and competitions would work. Have you looked for "prep" programs in the Chicago area that have such teachers?</p>

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<p>Rudysmom,</p>

<p>I sent you a pm.</p>

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<p>Thanks to everyone for your invaluable advice. I’m feeling better now that I’ve heard from so many of you, on the board and via PM’s. </p>

<p>I feel safe after reading the responses here with staying with the current teacher. I will however, continue to check the possibility of future teachers in case of an unexpected change. My son likes this teacher more than any teacher he’s ever had. Really respects him even though he’s probably only 10 yrs. older. But the reward in this is he’s still so fresh with the details of auditions and college preparations. In fact, other than the initial disappointment of losing out on private lessons with a much sought after teacher, I know my son is happy & secure now. He panicked when he thought he might be without a teacher for weeks or months. </p>

<p>The idea of extra "coachings" for him when he approaches auditions is defiantly a strong possibility. This current teacher has offered several extra hours of lessons, just to get my son up to speed during the summer. Therefore producing a much stronger cellist in just a few months. </p>

<p>I believe this quote from memake hits the nail on the head: “the right course of action depends on the specific quality of the teacher-student relationship much more than on the external stature of the teacher.” That confirms this relationship he now has with his teacher. I also know he has been stressed with older friends being matched up with a master teacher & his feelings of inadequacy. I’m now reassured that it’s just not necessary to have a master teacher. </p>

<p>It all comes down now to how much he wants to work and put into this. How badly he wants to make it, not completely reliant on the teacher. </p>

<p>Hopefully there will be others on the board who will read this and find it equally as helpful. I honestly don’t know what I would do without your knowledge and help. </p>

<p>(Now, if I could only get a moderator to wipe out the amount of threads I’ve started. Fourteen threads and I’ve only been a member since April. Wow, that has to be some kind of a record! ;) )</p>

<p>.</p>

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<p>rudysmom - It is usually the newbies who start all the threads because you are seeking information. Us old folks already know everything... ;)</p>

<p>I also want to state I agree with much of what has already been posted. My son had a graduate student for most of his pre-college teaching. In retrospect, I should have changed teachers after his freshman year in high school, but I didn't. And the bottom line is he still got accepted to 2 top conservatory programs (and wait listed at the other 2). Many high schools students just don't have access to master teachers and the undergraduate institutions realize this. It sounds like his current teacher is doing an excellent job.</p>

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<p>Just a side thought that may have an effect on how your son, or any student for that matter progesses. Alot of the learning above and beyond the individualized instruction of the private studio is the extent and quality of the peripheral experiences.</p>

<p>High school orchestras and ensembles vary in quality depending on the funding, and quality and dedication of the music departments can play a major role in a young artist's development. Youth symphonies are another major source of learning opportunities. Many of the ys in major metro areas are playing at an extremely high level, and regularly send a fair number of graduating seniors to further music study at the collegiate level. Immersion in smaller ensembles (chamber groups, jazz ensembles, etc.) further serve to fine tune specific skills, ones that cannot be learned in a one-on-one studio environment.</p>

<p>I've said it before, but I'm a firm believer that the quality of the overall experience, and the healthy competition of playing with peers at or above one's own level is a key factor in developing a well rounded young musician.</p>

<p>My $.02 for what it may be worth.</p>

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<p>I studied flute quite seriously in high school. I had the good fortune to be accepted into the studio of a very famous flutist who was the principal 1st flute in the NY Phil (he is no longer alive so I feel comfortable sharing this information). He was a fabulously gifted musician and I got a lot from him musically, but he was not a particularly good teacher of the craft. In the summer I went to Kinhaven and was assigned to an 18-year-old very inexperienced teacher who had a gift. I learned more in those 6 weeks than I had in the whole previous year about sound production and breathing. I wouldn't worry - if it is going as well as you say, your son is lucky to have him.</p>

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<p>Just adding a related link in SpiritManger’s post here <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/731202-finding-right-fit.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/731202-finding-right-fit.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>rudysmom, For his senior year just completed my son studied with someone who had recently graduated with his Master’s degree and your comment, “But the reward in this is he’s still so fresh with the details of auditions and college preparations.” is very accurate and this young graduate really helped my son understand what he needed to do to succeed at college auditions. To echo other people he also spent a lot of unpaid extra time with him to work on the fine details when we were in the audition period. He had studied with many of the top teachers while at college so was able to give my son insight about the various professors. So as long as your child is progressing at a reasonable pace I would not worry about studying under a recent graduate.</p>

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<p>While in high school, my daughter’s teacher was first a senior at Curtis (her junior year) and later a recent grad (her senior year). He is only five years older than her and he now plays in the Atlanta Symphony. There are definite advantages to having a teacher who is still very familiar with the whole college audition scene, particularly when that teacher has studied with and is still being mentored by some of the best in the business. Her playing improved enormously in those years.</p>

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<p>Like everything it depends on the situation at hand, there are no firm rules from where I stand. Master teacher itself in some ways is ambiguous, because what does that mean? Someone who has proven themselves great at teaching (and if so, by what measure do you use? Admittance to conservatories? Where the students ended up eventually?)…Someone who has achieved great professional success (lots of high level musicians teach, some are great teachers, many are okay, some outright stink as teachers). Someone who has taught a lot of years? Not necessarily a sign of a master teacher, just someone who has taught a long time. And even a master teacher might not have the information needed for a specific goal, such as how to get through an audition at the college or conservatory level, so there a younger person who knows what the deal is for auditions, for example, might be better then some meister teacher. </p>

<p>That younger teacher, on the other hand, might be great at the things that help a kid pass an audition but misses other things that make the difference between being a good and great player. In the violin world, there are teachers, for example, who are notorious for focusing on goals, like getting kids into a high level prep program or winning competitions, and do so pretty well, but then the kids are lacking some really important things that have nothing to do with the auditions or the competitions that later on can hurt them, even if they end up in high level programs. </p>

<p>One point I will make is that sometimes it takes more then one teacher to achieve the goals you need, there are plenty of teachers (as mentioned even in the link that re-vitalized this thread) who have another teacher work on technique and technical points while they focus on the musicality and interpretation of pieces and such. A master techician, for example (the “romantic” as used in the link) may be great at that in teaching, but not good at the artistry, whereas another teacher is great at artistry but not as strong on the technical, so both might be useful:).</p>

<p>One thing I got out of this article is that given the polarity it talks about, that a good teacher for a particular student might be someone who balances the student out, that the more ‘naive’ musician needs a ‘sentimental’ majority teacher (forgive the wording, I mean someone who is shifted in balance more to the technical) while a student who is technically strong (sentimantal) may want a teacher who is more ‘naive’ (artistic, musical, whatever). Which means no ‘master teacher’ could work for all students, which I suspect many people on here figured out along the way:)</p>