Important advice for future students (and of course their parents!)

Colleges and Universities A-Z University of Alabama
1

My son is a freshman at Alabama this year. On the “Parents of Class of 21” page on Facebook I’m reading a lot of sad stories about students who are in serious trouble academically because they signed up for challenging courses their first semester. The main culprits are biology and chemistry, although calculus rears its ugly head. These struggling students had very good grades in high school. There are OOS kids who are going to lose their scholarships and all sorts of mess. I would urge any entering freshman to try to take as easy a course load as possible the first semester.

Biology and chemistry are both "weed-out-courses at Alabama, and most of the professors are rated very poorly. Any student having the chance to get credit through AP should do so (remember, you do not have to take an AP class to take an AP test; you can self-study). Students who have had several years of foreign language in high school should nevertheless sign up for Level One and refuse to take the placement test; go for the easy A. Just do everything you can to make the first semester not so hard.

Students planning to go Greek, men especially, should know that it is intensive and time consuming, far more than at most universities. Just be aware of this and plan your schedules accordingly. High school sophomores and juniors have the opportunity to do some very good advance planning.

2

To clarify, freshmen do not lose their UA scholarships after a rough first semester. Their scholarship status is reviewed at the end of the year, and if they don’t have a 3.0 at that point, then they’re on probation and have to get a 3.0 for soph Fall semester.

That said, yes, it’s a good idea to NOT take too many hard classes during fall frosh year. Too many adjustments and college is tougher.

The student that @EarlVanDorn may be talking about is a student whose stats were not high enough for UA scholarship, but she is getting instate rates because the Academic Common Market. She is in danger of losing that benefit/scholarship because to qualify the student must get a 3.0 EVERY semester, and she’s doing poorly in Principals of Bio…which is the bio for STEM majors and premeds.

Her parent admitted that THEY encouraged her to take all hard classes this semester. Why? I don’t know. Parents can be lousy advisors to their kids when they have tunnel vision, aren’t pragmatic, and don’t look at the big picture.

TBH, since her stats didn’t qualify her for a UA merit, it doesn’t surprise me that she’s being weeded out of the STEM bio. That’s what weeding classes do…get students to move onto paths that are better for their talents as soon as possible. Why let a student waste valuable time in courses that can be over their heads? It also appears that she selected some obscure major in order to qualify for ACM, but her actual career goals don’t need that major at all. Over the years, and not just at Bama, I’ve seen students with good but not strong stats do poorly in STEM classes. They may enter claiming that they’re going to be engineers or doctors or whatever, but after the first semester or round of tests, many move onto career paths better suited for them…and they excel.

There are some UA scholarship students who aren’t doing that great this semester, and likely it’s because they either took on too much or they have allowed themselves to be distracted. There are some students who are faultering because they really didn’t understand that they will have to actually study in college…and that they wouldn’t be given study guides that would include exactly what would be on exams. There are some students who are failing labs due to absences or they’re turning in lab reports late or they aren’t following the rubrics of the lab reports. This may be because their high school science teachers weren’t that strict about what they turned in. They may have gotten completion grades …a check mark for turning in crap on a shingle. Many high schools do not provide an adequate science foundation for college. Period.

There are many students who are doing fabulously and many will be on the Dean’s List or Presidential List after this semester. Watch and see. We see this every year. And when those parents begin posting that their Susie or Johnny is on the deans list or presidents list, you’re going to also see some parents upset because they’re either going to realize that their child didn’t try as hard as they thought, or their child was in over their head.

3

@mom2collegekids thanks for the clarification… when you wrote, the student has to get 3.0 for soph Fall semester, did you mean the student only has to get 3.0 for the soph Fall semester, or that the student has to achieve 3.0 overall ?
If the student is not able to achieve 3.0 for sohp Fall semester, will the student lose the scholarship for Spring or Fall ? i.e. does the student have to pay back the scholarship for the Fall semester?

4

If the student is on scholarship probation,they MUST earn 3.0 for the following semester. If they get a 3.0 for the semester, but their cumulative is still below 3.0, they stay on scholarship probation (then they MUST get a 3.0 for the following semester). When their cumulative rises above a 3.0, then they are removed from probation . (You lose the scholarship for the future, you never have to pay back any money that was already awarded).

My son is now in his final semester. The advice I would encourage is know yourself/know your student…my son took a 300 level Spanish class his first semester and didn’t struggle, but he’d previously spent 6 weeks doing a study abroad in Mexico. However he did drop his Calculus class his first semester because he felt overwhelmed by the amount of homework and felt like he was falling behind. He wound up with a 4.0 that semester.

After watching my son for the past 9 semesters and knowing which classes he did well in and which he struggled in and reflecting back on my own time as a student, FWIW, here’s my advice:

GO TO EVERY CLASS SESSION
when attendance isn’t mandatory and often isn’t even tracked, students can prioritize other things above sitting through another boring lecture and parents won’t even know that their students are skipping class…yet again, but this is the easiest way to get behind QUICKLY

DO ALL HOMEWORK
my son once tried to justify that he wasn’t going to do any homework for one of his courses because all the homework together only totaled 5% of his final grade, but what students need to understand is they aren’t doing the homework for the grade, but they are doing the homework for themselves, to prepare for the exams that can be worth 25-50% of their grade - even if the assignments don’t count for any points DO THEM

TAKE ADVANTAGE OF HELP
The STEM courses have free tutoring at the engenuity lab, some classes have tutors/TAs available for extra help, and EVERY instructor has office hours. If students even begin to feel uncertain about concepts, go seek out help early - if you wait until mid-semester and find that you are really struggling, it’s often too late to play catch up

That may all seem like common sense, but most students who do very poorly in classes failed to do at least one of the above

5

I wrote my original post on my cell phone and was perhaps excluded a few details. @mom2collegekids is correct that the student in question is a common market student; they lose their out-of-state waiver immediately on not maintaining a 3.0 with no probationary period. However, the comments from other parents confirm that chemistry and biology tend to be taught in a “weed-out” fashion at Alabama. I just suggest students get these credits through AP if possible, or else don’t attempt these courses first semester.

The pledging process at Alabama is far more time consuming that at many schools. My son prefers using a desktop to a laptop so I didn’t buy him a laptop before sending him to school. Well, it turns out pledges are expected to spend most of their day at the fraternity house, and my son wasn’t able to do much studying during this time. I bought him one after a few weeks, but had I known I would have bought one before he went to school. My son had 36 hours of DE credit from Ole Miss on entering with almost all As, so he is familiar with college coursework with a full or nearly full load. He’s likely to have one or two Bs this semester simply because of the demands of the pledging process. He dropped Intermediate Accounting early on because he thought he would end up with a B; he took the course once in high school (it doesn’t transfer) so it shouldn’t have been that hard.

All I’m saying is that kids who were top students in high school shouldn’t be confident in taking a hard schedule their first semester. My son is taking German I despite having three years of high school German; he said he wanted some grade-point protection, especially since he is entering school with his first two years completed through AP and DE (so no easy survey courses to pad the g.p.a.). He’s taking another “sop” course as well. There is time enough to sign up for the harder courses after the first semester, when students are able to gauge how well they perform in a college setting.

6

I don’t have a dog in this fight, but it seems to me that it really just depends on the student. I wouldn’t consider that universal truth.

7

You are right @itsgettingreal17 but since you don’t know in advance how a student will perform it’s best to err on the side of caution.

8

Many very talented students have not had to apply themselves to academics until reaching college. Taking a tough course load first semester - esp at a big football school like UA, along with all the other socializing and other adaptations, is only helpful if there is room in the schedule to drop one of the tough courses w/o putting one self behind graduation in 8 semesters (for the scholarship students). Heck if it means losing a full tuition (or high dollar) scholarship, better to take extra time at the end and not lose the scholarship early in college.

Some students also do not realize that they need to read and prepare for the lecture/class so they can ask questions. If they read it after the class, they are BEHIND.

Agree with Post 3.

When I taught some college courses, I told students that if they attended class and were borderline on a final grade, that would help them (I had students sit in the same seat so it was easy for me to see who missed). For some classes at UA, having the clicker responses (electronics) tells the professor who is in class and who is missing.

Much smarter to build up a GPA and student confidence over the first few years of college.

My daughter is in her final year of engineering at UA. Has always kept above a 3.0 cumulative GPA. Her GPA in her first two years was actually quite good, so when she did have a few terms below 3.0 for the term in her tougher junior/senior level courses - required for her eng degree but not in her area of expertise, she still always had an overall above 3.0 cum. She took what was harder for her (and also fuller terms) spring term her freshman and sophomore years - after that she had to suck it up and have very full semesters each semester. The first two years, had the extra course 2nd semester mainly because she has been in the Million Dollar Band all 4 years, and fall semester needed to have the time and energy for marching band. If she had been able to work concert band into her schedule both semesters all four years (course conflicts she couldn’t work around), she could have added a 1 credit course each semester with a A+ (she was All State on Clarinet in 6th grade, and developed her skills to where she could have majored in it, but no desire to be a poor musician).

She had credit for Calc I but took Honors Calc I her first semester so her 2nd semester would have the Calc II along with the Physic with Calc I course (her eng require Physics with Calc I and II) - the math and physics courses go together (at least that first one did). Also so she had the strong Calc foundation ‘from scratch’ at UA, as she took Calc I her HS junior year and her HS didn’t offer another calc level so she took statistics for HS senior year (which didn’t count for credit, but was of some help when she took college level statistics). She was able to take enough AP in HS to have no English or history courses to take at UA.

I do know students that have worked themselves out of an academic hole, but that adds so much stress to their lives.

9

<<<
However, the comments from other parents confirm that chemistry and biology tend to be taught in a “weed-out” fashion at Alabama. I just suggest students get these credits through AP if possible, or else don’t attempt these courses first semester.


[QUOTE=""]

[/QUOTE]

To further clarify…Chem for STEM majors and Bio for STEM majors are weed-outs everywhere. Everywhere. We see the same posts in virtually every college-specific forum and in the premed forum. XXXX number of frosh start out in those classes as STEM or Premed students, and then after the first exams, some drop and change their majors, some wait until after the first semester to change their paths, some face the reality of the situation by the end of frosh year or somewhere during sophomore year.

It’s in the school’s best interest AND the students’ best interests to get the weaker students to move on and not waste their valuable semesters and their families’ money on paths that they can’t complete. It’s KINDER to get these kids moving on during or right after the frosh fall semester so that they’ll still have time to complete another path.

10

Btw…I’ve known some students who wait until senior graduation year to take some hard upper-division classes. That way, if they end up with a sub-3.0 GPA that year, it doesn’t matter at all.

11

My son is also a freshman at UA. He is on the presidential scholarship. My advice for students who just need to take science for the general ed requirements is to CLEP out. DS is not a science kid. He had 1 year of biology in 9th grade. He used modern states a online free program to study for the biology CLEP. He got the score he needed To get credit for biology. It’s a lot better to spend some time studying and $80 than take the classes you are not interested in and may lower your gpa. There are a number of classes you can CLEP out of at UA and modern states has a free online class for most of them.

12

MichiganGeorgia- Great advice. I will be using the CLEP option with my youngest son going to Bama next fall.

Original poster- Also, excellent advice.

13

@MichiganGeorgia
I thought science courses needed a lab component. How did you manage this with CLEP?

14

@albiongirl it counts as the lecture and lab. https://catalog.ua.edu/undergraduate/about/academic-regulations/policies/credit-by-examination/

15

@MichiganGeorgia
Nice! I’ll keep that in mind.

16

Just wanted to chime in again about this subject that happens everywhere.

Bama uses the texts that other colleges use as well. Campbell’s is the common one for Bio and if you read enough forums you’ll see some kids do well and some do poorly. Of course the ones that aren’t up to the task are probably going to have trouble no matter what, but one difference that seem to stand out between the ones that do well in the science for majors and the ones who do poorly is this:

The ones who do well read their texts before each class lecture. Some may read the textbooks during the summer before taking the courses. When reading various forums, I see successful students posting that they pre-read the chapter before the lecture and they pay special attention to the terms in bold (not only the bold stuff, but extra attention to the bold stuff). That way, the lecture reinforces what they already read, and likely expands on the content.

Do any of you remember the movie, “Mona Lisa Smile”? Julia Roberts is the new prof at Wellesley and on her first day she’s shocked that no matter what she presented the entire class already knew all the answers. It comes out that the entire class had dutifully studied their entire textbook over the summer.

The above make you pause. We’ve moved so far away from that sort of thing. Kids now buy their textbooks either right before classes start or even a few days after. Kids often don’t read their chapters before lecture. They come to class expecting info to be spoon fed to them. They often don’t even read their texts until they’re trying to stud or cram for a test. Mistake. And, then we hear that they “tried so hard.”

17

To add to this discussion. DS ran into problems when he had a C at midterm. He figured he could probably bring that up before the end of the term, and I though he could as well, he didn’t! It was a CS course that a lot of kids dropped. In hindsight, I wish I had advised him to drop it as well.

So midterm grade in a difficult class might also be something to be aware of every semester.

Bama is incredibly generous w/ helping these kids to keep their scholarships despite a poor semester; many schools don’t!

18

While all the advice here is very good, and helpful, I just want to be careful not to scare scholarship students (or their parents) coming in with few (or no) AP or CLEP credits. You CAN get in and out in four years (unless you choose to go the co-op route - and that’s a separate discussion) and hang onto your scholarship. You can even excel!

If it’s a foundation class (aka a “weeder”) you’re trying to make a decision about (e.g., chemistry for premed or chemical engineering; calculus and physics for mechanical engineering), I would recommend erring on the cautious side, unless you aced the AP test and also MASTERED the material in HS. Beyond that, yes, don’t overload on STEM requirements, but I personally would not recommend taking classes just for an easy A (unless you’re in jeopardy of losing a scholarship).

Especially if you’re in engineering (and probably a few other majors), the four-year curriculum as proscribed is very rigid, and you only have so many opportunities to take interesting, unrelated classes, so rather than look for what we called a “gut” in college, look for something that complements your major and other interests. Four years goes by very fast and there are so many subjects to study!

19

It was only after it was too late that we found out many parents/kids knew to drop a class where the kid might do very poorly in, especially if the student is on scholarship.

DS is doing well, but it is now a very stressful college experience for him and us. Not a position I would wish on anyone.

So, offering this advice is not meant to scare anyone, but they should also go in with full understanding of the challenges ahead and be prepared for them.

20

Regardless of how gifted (or not) a student is, the change from high school school student living at home to college student living at college is HUGE. There are all kinds of distractions whether or not you join a Greek group. Kids wind up by themselves in the dorm room to livin’ large at the frat house and all in between. In class, students who are used to getting As with little studying may struggle to get a B-. Best to take it a little easy, especially the first semester. That said, an advisor wanted my daughter to take 12 hours instead of 15 since she planned to pledge a sorority. Unless a student has weak study skills, that’s just stupid. You’re paying full tuition for fewer hours. As long as the student can manage the work, there’s no need to take less than 15. In the long run, it may prevent having to add an additional semester or more to earn the degree.