So I have a MS from a top program and I work as an engneer in the greater LA area. I would really like to get a PhD in aerospace engineering from USC or UCLA.
Since I’m working, I would need to do a part-time PhD. Does anyone know if USC or UCLA offer the option for someone to get a Part Time PhD (ie, get a PhD while working full time)?
I talked to administrative people and they gave me a non-answer. Do you know anyone who does a part-time PhD at USC or UCLA, or anywhere in CA?
It is not likely that you will find a lot of flexibility at the schools you are considering. Faculty usually need to have students really working full time on their research if it is funded and they need to deliver results. The is particularly true in engineering and the hard sciences. If you do find someone who is willing to supervise you in a part-time setting, it will probably not be the top faculty member in the department.
In order to do this, you need to convince a faculty member to take you on and support your application to the program.
Good point.
I was originally a PhD student (left w/ an MS). The reason I left and didn’t try to go part-time is because (1) I obviously would’ve lost funding and (2) I know my advisor would’ve lost any interest in me.
Now, Since I’m working a full time job, they cannot fund me as an RA/TA. So I’d pay out of my own pocket, or the company would pay. Wouldn’t it be appealing for them to have a self-funded student? Why are part-time PhDs less common at high level universities?
It would not likely be more appealing for them. Consider that even if they don’t have to pay you, they are still relying on you to help advance their research, and doing a part-time PhD means that their (your) research is going to be moving at a glacial pace. Meanwhile, their competitors in the field are moving forward with full-time students at a normal pace and very well might outpace them and beat them to the punch on your topic.That translates to a lot of wasted time. Further, many grants have time limits on them when sponsored by industry or organizations like the Air Force who want to use the results.
Essentially, part-time PhDs are not common because doing a PhD is not a part-time job.
That is why I said that your best chance is to find a sympathetic faculty member who is willing to put the time into a side project. You probably also want to do something that your company is interested in so you can do part of the project there. A challenging proposition.
IF your job is willing to fund you, would they be willing to give you leave for ~3 years so you could finish your coursework and exams? Some students work full-time in their dissertation phase, particularly if their dissertation work can be completed in the course of their regular work at their job. I don’t think this is ideal, but it’s certainly better than trying to find a faculty member who would be willing to work with a part-time PhD student.
When I was working as an engineering, I tried looking into this. There is no such thing as a part-time engineering PhD. Yes, sometimes a National Lab or the military may pay for you to get a PhD.
In some schools you can be ABD, and work part-time. Some universities will continue to let you have school resources without paying tuition, so you can finish up the research side of your PhD. Michigan where I got my PhD used to have this open to students. This has changed, so that a student must be continuously enrolled and paying tuition to get a PhD. Even if you could go part-time, it may not be a good idea unless your job really helps you with the PhD.
To get a PhD, you must bite the bullet and go back full time…at least for the first part of the PhD program. I know of no way around this.
jack63
I seem to be reaching similar conclusions (with a few notable exceptions). Do you think it is possible to at least do the 1st year - 1.5 years full time (say I pass the quals and propose thesis) and THEN go part time?
I’m curious about the notable exceptions…
It is a tricky thing to do…go full time the 1st/2nd year, pass quals, and then go back part time. You need to find an advisor who is ok with it. I wouldn’t go in and tell profs this is what you have in mind from the start…its kinda of hidden trick that universities don’t want to advertise is available. There are potentially major advantages or major disadvantages to doing this. The disadvantages are that university wants tuition money and won’t let you do this, and they can change the rules midway through your PhD. Another disadvantage is that it could take you 10 years to get a PhD…that is not a good idea.
The major advantages of being able to work, fund yourself as an engineer, and pursue the PhD part-time, is that you are not burdened with TAs, and GRAs that have more do with getting grants than doing real research. Before Michigan changed it rules to prevent students from doing this, I’ve seen students have deep trouble while being funded by my advisor as full time students, but they really succeeded going part-time by finding a job in town, and not relying on the advisor’s support. The TAs and GRAs were an unhelpful distraction.
Also, 10-15 years ago, universities would take profs who were PhD students, and let them finish up there PhDs as they were Profs at new schools. 35 years ago my father was able to do this. I’d even heard about this happening at good engineering schools 15 years ago…I haven’t heard of it happening recently though.
You do realize that it typically gets more busy after passing quals and proposing a thesis, right? That is when you are supposed to actually be doing the research, and when your advisor expects you to be doing research and will likely be counting on it occurring at a reasonable rate so that he or she can use the incremental results to write more proposals and get more funding.
This is true. I’m just saying there is an alternative way of doing things where I’ve seen some PhD students have significant success.
For any graduate program to accept a student, you need to write up essays to show you’ll be a “good” PhD student and do what @boneh3ad suggestions. The alternative method is you basically kinda stiff your advisor on the data that could be used to get you advisor more grants and focus on doing research that leads to a thesis and journal publications…sometimes your advisor’s goals and your goals can be very different…if you have a mediocre or worse advisor.
Universities are changing policies to prevent students from doing this…for obvious financial reasons.
Speaking as a faculty member who advises Ph.D. students. The student who wants to work part time on a project won’t get a part of the time critical projects that I have going. If he/she finds a side project that can be worked on at a separate pace then OK but i won’t spend too much attention on such as student.
I’m not quite sure what you mean here - presumably the same kind of data/analyses that would get you a dissertation and journal articles are the kinds of data that would get your adviser grants. They’re not necessarily mutually exclusive categories of work, you know what I mean? Besides, stiffing an advisor could lead to getting kicked out of the lab or “coached” out of the PhD program. You really don’t want to tee off your advisor, at least not until you’re finished.
I think that one shouldn’t go into a PhD program planning to drop to part-time after quals, because that’s a really good way to be stuck in a PhD program for 8-10+ years. But I HAVE seen students successfully work a full-time job during the dissertation phase if the full time job contributed to the dissertation. So that meant that 1) the dissertation data was being drawn from work that was being done at the full time job, and 2) the person’s supervisor at the full-time job was fully on-board with the person getting a dissertation done on company time. Others can chime in, but writing a dissertation for me at least was in and of itself a full-time (and exhausting) job - when I was in the deep writing phase I was routinely writing all day from 10 am-6 pm and sometimes doing a little more writing in the evening after dinner. I did work a part-time job that was about 10 hours a week when I was writing, and I can’t imagine doing more unless it was directly related to my dissertation work. This is especially because if you are serious about an academic career, you might still have one or two side projects going on while writing your dissertation (I did; they eventually turned into papers).
@juillet …ideally it should totally be like this, but in reality I’ve seen students have to put in 20 hours on TAs, 20 - 30 hours on GRAs barely related or not related to their research or part-time jobs. If I remember right, you got an NSF fellowship…I think…which is great. Most students make due with less. Ideally grant work is directly related to student’s research…no they’re not suppose to be mutually exclusive…and they’re not. A grant that is 50% related to a student’s research is the usual from what I’ve seen. My experience was to see students basically “go rogue” often because prof’s grant pressure could be a major distraction.
Yes, I did have an NSF (and during my dissertation writing year, a different external fellowship), which helped tremendously. I had no teaching or research obligations so I could focus solely on the diss. And fair point - working on my dissertation this way meant that I finished it in 9 months (exclusive of data collection), which is fairly quick. But a person could work fewer hours on it and just take longer - not necessarily a whole lot longer, but I think 2-3 years is more normal. I just really, really wanted to get done.
xraymancs
That makes sense. This is indeed exactly what I’m asking for. I don’t need to be in a time-critical, funded research project. In fact, I wouldn’t require funding at all - as a working engineer I could self-fund to an extent.
So all I’m asking for is a program that would allow me to move at a part-time pace, focus on my job a fair fraction of the time, and a prof to chair my thesis (I have many ideas that could lead to a pretty independent dissertation) and meet with me twice a month.
Is this feasible? Surely someone has come across a part-time PhD student? They do exist.
Yes, they do exist. However, not as a part-time student. This works if you have a lot of energy, and you prioritize your engineering over all other aspects of life. Basically, if you can get a fellowship to pay for your PhD and get an office at school, then reduce your hours at work to 30 - 40 (assuming as a working engineer you are probably putting in more). Then make a schedule with basically two shifts between Monday morning and Saturday afternoon, filling every hour, so you can spend 45 - 50 hours a week at school and 30 at work + time for meals, transportation, errands, chatting, etc. If you discipline yourself to use 14 hours per day productively + 5 - 10 hours per weekend, you can make it work. You will need focused discipline and to have a body that does not require huge chunks of sleep or exercise. You have to get into a rhythm since this needs to be sustained for 5 - 7 years (with academic-year cycle breaks, thankfully). Having an office space at work and one at school help to divide your time/mindset, as well. Having your work project as your thesis topic will greatly enhance the chance of success, since you can double-dip into your hour allotments.
I do know someone who did this (at UCSD EE).
The important thing is whether the university requires continual enrollment. This means you have to pay tuition every semester you are enrolled. At Michigan, it used to be you passed quals paying tuition, and then you did not have to pay tuition until you defended…students often held jobs while finishing their thesis…it literally happened all the time. Michigan has since changed this. I think this is unfortunate…this is reflected in the entry about why not to go to grad school.
http://100rsns.blogspot.com/2011/05/59-you-pay-for-nothing.html
Yes, they do exist. You need to explore the universities in your geographic area and start talking with professors about your situation. Once you pass your qualifying exams and courses, you should be able to enroll with a single credit at a time while you work on your research as long as you meet the credit requirements for graduation.
Really, it all depends on finding the right advisor.