<p>I feel I need to ask current Mudd students this question: would you pay 20k more for Mudd’s prestige? I’ve been accepted into another college. Assuming that the quality of education and all other opportunities are the same, and money is not a major factor but still big enough (as in, any money I can save for grad will be good enough), would you choose Mudd? How would you compare Scripps College’s grad school placements to Mudd in the sciences?</p>
<p>Following up on the previous post, how should one compare HMC v/s Scripps for majoring in biology and possibly headed for graduate work in biomedical sciences? What is the track record / reputation of the Joint Science Department that Scripps feeds v/s the Biology department at HMC as far as a grad school placement is concerned? Thanks in advance for your insights.</p>
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<p>No, I wouldn’t pay 20k more for any school for prestige when the opportunities are the exact same. The whole point of going to Mudd isn’t for prestige, it’s for the quality of the education.</p>
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Scripps is not even close.</p>
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<p>Harvey Mudd is on an entirely different level than the Joint Sciences program. The Joint Science program is good, but you have to keep in mind that HMC has top 10 programs in the country for many majors. There is absolutely no way someone should go to Joint Sciences over HMC unless they were planning on going to Med school.</p>
<p>Keep in mind that just because there is a consortium, it doesn’t mean that the schools are that close academically besides all being above average LACs. There is a clear difference between Mudd/Pomona and CMC in terms of student quality and academic rigor. There is a difference between CMC and Scripps. And there is a gap between Scripps and Pitzer. Also, all the colleges focus on different things.</p>
<p>I can see why Harvey Mudd would be regarded at a different level than the Joint Sciences department in Engineering, Physics and Math. My question was really regarding the Biology program. Given that Biology is the smallest department at HMC, and is the largest at JSD, is there really that much of a disparity in terms of quality of education, grad school placement, etc? Just wondering.</p>
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<p>You’re right in that Biology is probably the weakest major at HMC, whereas it is the strongest major at Joint Science. But all that I said still holds for Biology as well – there is a decent disparity.</p>
<p>sxm2872>>How would you compare Scripps College’s grad school placements to Mudd in the sciences?
atomicfusion>>Scripps is not even close.</p>
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<p>Source of data for the basis of this opinion? Scripps has an excellent track record of medical and dental school placements. Scripps’ post-bac pre-med program has a 97% acceptance rate to med grad schools (see [Scripps</a> College : Post-Baccalaureate Premedical Program](<a href=“http://www.scrippscollege.edu/academics/postbac/index.php]Scripps”>http://www.scrippscollege.edu/academics/postbac/index.php)). All of the Claremont colleges are held in very high regard by med and dental adcoms.</p>
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<p>Well considering HMC has the second highest PhD rate in the nation, I think it’s pretty safe to say that Scripps isn’t close.</p>
<p>^ You’re right, HMC produces a large number of students who go to grad school. 43% of HMC students go on to grad school, while 21% of Scripps students do.</p>
<p>But that statistic cannot be interpreted to mean that Scripps students are one-half less likely to be accepted to grad school. HMC only admits students with math and science skills of the highest caliber, and students of this profile tend to be inclined to seek MS and Phd anyway. Scripps students are not so interested in grad school – 55% of Scripps grads are employed after their B.A. and never apply to grad school. If you consider that the 21% of Scripps students who go to grad school are coming out of only a 45% pool, then the grad school acceptance rate is roughly comparable to HMC’s.</p>
<p>I think what sxm2872 is asking is, is there a disparity or a disadvantage to being at Scripps instead of HMC if the student is serious about post-grad study? I think the data shows the answer is no, not necessarily. All of the Claremont schools are held in high regard and there are so many cross-campus opportunities that I think an enterprising and ambitious undergrad has nearly unlimited opportunities no matter which of the 5C’s they go to.</p>
<p>How do you know that of that 55%, none applied to grad school and simply got rejected?</p>
<p>Likewise, how do you know that the other 45% all did? 100% of those who applied could have been accepted for all those numbers provide.</p>
<p>And where are you getting the actual percentage of Mudd’s acceptance rate?</p>
<p>“HMC produces a large number of students who go to grad school. 43% of HMC students go on to grad school” At first glance that’s an impressive stat, but on reflection it raises some issues. Does Mudd attract more “academics” and fewer practicing engineers? Are the numbers large because the engineering education at Mudd is general and they are seeking to develop a specialty? Are they trying to add a “brand” name to their resumes with a second degree?</p>
<p>At a minimum I would think that you would need to know the actual number who apply to top 10 grad programs in the more common disciplines and their success rate, and compare that to other schools.</p>
<p>Actually, I think a large part of it would be the fact that you come out of Mudd with a general engineering degree - as these students probably have a fair amount of ambition and will want to be trying to make it high up in their field, they’ll go to grad school to specialize. To quote someone from the pamphlet for last year’s grads: “Graduate school was right for me because I want to complement my general engineering B.S. with more knowledge in aerospace engineering.”</p>
<p>As for the brand name - no, I think Mudd carries its own name in the field. It’s not a household name, but it’s a science and engineering name. Fewer practicing engineers? Looking at the pamphlet… Out of the 177 graduates, 93 went straight to employment, 57 to grad school, and 27 were undecided or traveling. So the largest group went straight into practicing engineering.</p>
<p>You’re right though, knowing the percentage of who applies and gets in would be best. But it doesn’t seem that many schools publish that. At any rate, the grad schools they did attend are impressive enough; CalTech, CMU, Columbia, Cornell, MIT, Stanford, and Cal are names I recognize off the list (Canadian here, so I don’t really recognize many names).</p>
<p>Another related question–what percent of Mudd grads applied to grad/med school etc but were not accepted? Wondering how the bottom half of the class fares given the grade deflation.</p>
<p>From my year, 16 chemists graduated, 13 went on to grad school.</p>
<p>“Another related question–what percent of Mudd grads applied to grad/med school etc but were not accepted? Wondering how the bottom half of the class fares given the grade deflation.”</p>
<p>Hard to say without some assumptions:
- Do people apply from Mudd and not get in anywhere?
- Do people get in and not go?</p>
<p>The only data I have is that 34% in recent years have gone on to get PhDs.</p>
<p>RocketDA, since you are a graduating senior, can you at least share what you know of your classmates’ post-grad plans? Have all who wanted jobs gotten them? Have all who applied to grad (or med or law) schools been successful? If not, what factors do you think may have waylaid their plans (low GPA, choice of major, depressed industry, or other?)</p>
<p>I’d say about 50% of the graduating class is going to grad school. Perhaps 40% are getting jobs in their field of concentration. Of the 10% remainder, half are going into teaching and half into other unrelated fields (business, finance). None that I know of have no plans.</p>
<p>Of those going to grad school roughly 2/3 are PhD bound and 1/3 are masters bound.</p>
<p>Grad schools of some people I know in my class:
Stanford, Berkeley, MIT, Imperial College, UCI, UW.</p>
<p>A lot of people in my class had to scramble our plans when the economy fell apart. Many of us had jobs lined up but they dissolved overnight. However, most of us have been able to rethink our plans and have had success finding SOMETHING to do to make money. Many of us have managed to get great jobs and will continue on our plan unscathed. Others may be considering sub-optimal jobs.</p>
<p>Factors preventing some grad/career plans:
low GPA
poor ECONOMY
increased APPLICATION NUMBERS</p>
<p>^^ Yeah the application numbers thing, along with poor economy was just totally killer in grad school admissions this year.</p>
<p>This is great news–Mudd kids land on their feet regardless. I hear grads from Ivies aren’t getting job offers, Drexel graduating engineers are without offers…</p>
<p>Do (low) GPAs from Mudd affect students’ liklihood of choosing a job (and type of job) over grad school? Or are other reasons like debt load more influential? How low can Mudd GPAs go before they affect grad school acceptances in a more typical year, and what level did they have to be this year to garner acceptances? Finally, do low Mudd GPAs affect employment offers?</p>
<p>Don’t grad schools know these top undergrad schools without grade inflation? E.g., Reed’s campus average GPA is 3.1, and of those with a GPA going down that far (and have an MCAT of at least 28), 84% who apply to med school are admitted. Isn’t this an indication that low GPA alone doesn’t hurt, at least for med school? I know there are some apples and oranges here; does the generalization hold?</p>
<p>I can’t speak to grad school admissions, but according to an acquaintance who served for many years on a state medical school admission committee, the initial screening of candidates was strictly by a formula that incorporated MCATs and GPAs. Candidates from more highly selective colleges got a slight boost (I recall they used Barron’s as a guide), but not enough to compensate for a GPA in the low 3’s. Maybe not all med schools do it this way, but it is pretty common. This is why very few premed students choose to attend Mudd.</p>