Is Pomona amazing?

<p>Hey all!</p>

<p>I'm applying to schools in the fall and I was looking at Pomona. I'm a little curious about something which has been irking me..</p>

<p>I see so many amazing things about Pomona. They bring puppies in before the finals. The campus is insanely beautiful (I mean really really beautiful). And Death by Chocolate sounds wonderful! Then I see the statistics. Pomona is full of bright kids and their education is worth more than the actual tuition. Also highest endowment per student among other things.</p>

<p>And yet, why do I get this weird feeling that there could be more? Don't get me wrong, Pomona is a cut above the rest, and yet, I feel something is missing.</p>

<p>I always hear about this consortium... but I'm applying to Pomona, not the consortium. Is Pomona missing something that the other schools have?</p>

<p>Everything I see so far about Pomona seems amazing. But what of its students? If college is supposed to be a vessel, where is Pomona taking them? When you spoil the kids that much, do they do something with these gifts?</p>

<p>Every gift from Pomona to student so far is measurable, whether it be in dollars, or pounds of chocolate, or number of puppies, but what of the gifts the students have given to the world? When I go to college, I hope that my education will give me something far beyond chocolate. I hope to receive an education in the truest sense of the word. Everything else is just superficial. So deep down under the surface, is Pomona amazing? Or is Pomona just chocolate and puppies?</p>

<p>I hesitate to reply to these questions since I am a Pomona parent and not a student. I am also jaded by what my D tells me. My observations are that yes, Pomona is amazing. All of my D’s friends that I have met, and they are an assortment of international and US students from all over the country, are so very bright and interesting that studying and living with these students has greatly enhanced everything about my D and how she views the world. I think that the fact that Pomona is so small also opens up opportunities to first year students that just wouldn’t be available at a larger college or university. The interaction with professors is truly special due to class size, discussion based classes and the caring professors who are part of the Pomona “bubble”.</p>

<p>As far as the consortium goes, it is SO important to the education received at Pomona. You are a Pomona student however, each Claremont college have its own terrific programs, unique to that college, that are open to all. My D, is going to be in the CMC Washington program spring semester where she will be working in a full time internship in DC as well as taking 2 CMC politics classes with CMC professors. It is such a great program for CMC students who are interested in politics, and like everything else in the consortium it is open to all students so she is seizing the opportunity. I have found it quite interesting that there is a facebook group of Claremont college students working in NYC this summer. I think that most students consider themselves Claremont college students on the same level as they consider themselves Pomona college students.</p>

<p>In a word, yes. There’s a reason why Pomona has been called a Ivy League-level liberal arts college on the west coast. There’s a reason why Pomona has rapidly been rising in the rankings and is currently ranked #4. There’s a reason why students regularly turn down Ivy League-level schools and attend Pomona. And it isn’t puppies and chocolate (which, IIRC, isn’t being done any more, although there are now free professional massages before finals week). Now, while certain things help define Pomona’s culture as a school, they must, of course, be in addition to a strong academic base. Although I quite disagree that “everything else is superficial.” College (especially a place like Pomona) is an experience to grow you as a person. Intellectually, socially, emotionally. Academics is a part of that. Remember that college is four years of your life. Make it a good experience, and you will get far more from it. It would be a tragic mistake for you to merely apply/attend a school solely based on how “valuable” the piece of paper you receive at the end is.</p>

<p>As a vessel, Pomona can take you anywhere you want to go. A CS major can work at Google, an econ major (like my brother, in this particular example) can catch the eye of prestigious consulting firms (Bain Consulting, Boston Consulting Group, etc), a biomed engineering major can go onto Yale’s School of Medicine, and on and on and on. At Pomona, the world is your oyster. With the school’s resources and connections (and academic reputation), there is very rarely anything you can’t do because you chose Pomona over a place like Amherst, or even HYP.</p>

<p>The consortium only makes Pomona stronger, though Pomona could easily stand alone. Outside of academics, there are more activities, clubs, sports, students, etc (you can eat at any of the dining halls on the other campuses without any additional inconvenience/cost - in fact, it’s quite normal). Academically, Pomona is able to leverage certain strengths it might not normally have. A friend of mine is going to another top liberal arts college, but is not able to double major in Chinese like he had originally planned. Pomona doesn’t offer Arabic? Good thing CMC does. You’ll never have problems with full/cancelled classes, as my friend at UC Berkeley has encountered. Don’t think you’re being challenged enough in your science courses (though I truly doubt that’ll be the case)? Take a class at Harvey Mudd. You can take up to half of your classes at the other schools, even major at one of them, provided certain conditions are met (the major isn’t offered at Pomona, etc). Or, just stay on campus for everything. Most students at Pomona don’t take even close to half of their classes off-campus. Pomona is more than self-sufficient, but don’t discount the number of additional opportunities the consortium provides.</p>

<p>Here are some suggestions if you have any other doubts about the intellectual vitality or academic strength of Pomona.</p>

<p>[ul]
[<em>] Watch [this</a> video](<a href=“- YouTube”>- YouTube) done by Pomona.
[</em>] Visit the homepage for the department(s) you might be interested in (eg <a href=“http://cs.pomona.edu%5B/url%5D”>http://cs.pomona.edu</a>), and look at the courses and faculty members.
[li] Visit Pomona: talk to students, professors, administration, etc. I seriously doubt you will find any discrepancies between Pomona and its peer schools (Ivy Leagues, etc).[/li][/ul]</p>

<p>So, yes, Pomona is amazing. The only reason why I would discourage someone from attending Pomona is if they did not “fit” the school in some way (socially, academically, etc). One of my friends, who was later accepted to Amherst, visited Pomona and found it to be too liberal for his taste (he’s extremely conservative), and didn’t even bother applying.</p>

<p>Please don’t hesitate if you have any more questions (specific or general) about Pomona (or other schools)! A short year ago, I was in your exact position of applying to schools. I just had the luck of having some friends/family (brother) at Pomona/5Cs to allow me to gain proper insight into the many facets that make Pomona amazing. It was the best decision of my life, and I have absolutely no regrets.</p>

<p>Maybe I should’ve expected these answers since I posted on the Pomona group.</p>

<p>I also realize that I asked many questions in my post, and I thank you for answering each one. Except, I’m not sure I found the answer to my main question. Maybe I’m asking too much idk. But let me explain why:</p>

<p>Zrathustra, the things you mention I have heard present at a lot of other schools.</p>

<p>“As a vessel, Pomona can take you anywhere you want to go. A CS major can work at Google, an econ major (like my brother, in this particular example) can catch the eye of prestigious consulting firms (Bain Consulting, Boston Consulting Group, etc), a biomed engineering major can go onto Yale’s School of Medicine, and on and on and on.” I could replace Pomona with, say, Williams and it would still make sense.</p>

<p>The problem I find, and the reason why I feel I may not have been as clear as I liked to, is that I don’t get the impression that Pomona is amazing.</p>

<p>Like I said, it could be my own fault. I really do love Pomona… but as I’ve said before I feel like something’s missing. Unfortunately everything I hear does not seem to unique to Pomona for the most part.</p>

<p>“There’s a reason why Pomona has been called a Ivy League-level liveral arts college on the west coast.” I’ve heard this before… The Ivy of the West they say. I’m noticing a lot of comparisons in general to the Ivy League schools. This is all in the eyes of the beholder, but Ivy Leagues are generally regarded as amazing. If you all didn’t believe it, I don’t think you would be listing top schools you turned town as a point of pride.</p>

<p>The fact is, and maybe this will happen someday… no one refers to Harvard or Brown or Dartmouth or any of the other Ivies as the Pomona of the East. </p>

<p>If to be amazing is to incite wonder or astonishment, then why is it that Pomona has compared secondly to another school? And why is it that with Pomona it always comes down to things that are measurable? As I said before, I hope to gain from the immeasurable qualities which NJ Mom of 2 touched upon, and if Pomona is always measured against truly amazing schools, then I think I may have to reconsider.</p>

<p>My logic and reasoning might not be sound, and I still have an entire summer to figure it out. In the meantime I wanted to thank the both of you for your answers. You have given me a lot to think about.</p>

<p>Let me see if I can address some of your concerns. I think part of the issue was/is that even you aren’t entirely sure of what you’re looking for. I read your post and interpreted it as you wondering about the “missing” part(s) of Pomona - namely, the quality of the education you receive there. And thus, I tried to address that specific part of it (and as I’m pretty scientifically-minded, I responded with as quantifiable data as I could). I never said that certain opportunities afforded to you at Pomona would necessarily be unique (and, to be perfectly honest, at a certain level, all of the top schools are the same in this regard).</p>

<p>Perhaps you need to be more specific. What do you exactly mean by “amazing”? Yes, a place like Williams is amazing. Harvard’s amazing. Yale’s amazing. I would hardly say Pomona is “better” than any of these schools (nor have I ever argued so), and I certainly chose Pomona based on personal preference. I would bet I would have an excellent experience at any of the schools I applied to, whether it had been MIT or UC Berkeley. But I found I liked Pomona, as a whole (campus, students, classes, resources, professors, administration, the entire package), more than anything I had encountered. I felt like I fit into Pomona.</p>

<p>Choosing a college isn’t quantifiable, and thus no one will be able to decide for you whether or not a school is amazing. For me, Pomona is (beyond) amazing. But you cannot expect anyone to provide you with the intangible benefits of attending a particular college and have those personally mean anything to you.</p>

<p>You must look into the details and the larger picture. At a certain level, none of the top schools are really unique. You have to decide yourself which one is best for you.</p>

<p>If you have any specific (quantifiable) questions (otherwise, expect answers to come from a very personal perspective), feel free to ask them. But everything else is up to you. If you truly feel that Pomona is missing something, nothing that I or anyone else can say will make any difference in your decision.</p>

<p>Best of luck!</p>

<p>PS: The reason why Pomona is compared to other schools in a certain way is purely because of standing reputation. The other schools have been around a lot longer, and have developed certain reputation. Pomona is only recently (relatively speaking) coming into prominence. The point is that “people in the know” (employers, grad schools, etc) know how amazing of a place Pomona is, and knows that the education you receive there is comparable to Ivy Leagues, Stanford, MIT, etc.</p>

<p>I find your post confusing at best and disappointing at worst. You ask what makes Pomona special; you want to see something that sets it apart from the rest of the great colleges?</p>

<p>I remember when my daughter was researching colleges, we were looking at the posts from students who reviewed Pomona and one caught my eye. This student went on the say how great Pomona was and what a lovely atmosphere to spend four years of your life but they did not feel enough was done to insure they had a job when they left college. Although at the end of the review they did own up to being apathetic about reaching out and taking the lead in the resources offered by Pomona.</p>

<p>My reaction to reading this post and from someone who does not come from a privileged upbringing was that this person got what they deserved.</p>

<p>Pomona is a great institution. It will provide you with four years of great professors, classes, atmosphere, and a student body that is exceptionally bright, creative and not cut throat. It will give you the resources to excel, grow and hopefully find your path.
What it will not provide is help for an apathetic student, someone who wants someone to do the leg work for them.</p>

<p>What I have found special from a parent’s point of view with the experience my daughter has had and what I consider invaluable, is the relationship she has had with her professors. There have been two classes which were challenging for her and she sought help from both professors and sometimes would meet with them on a daily basis if she felt she needed extra help. They were there for anyone who needed it.</p>

<p>Pomona offers all the tools to succeed but it is up to the student to take advantage of each opportunity. She has done research in the summers for her professors to Study abroad semesters in Europe. Next summer she will do her own research, she will with the help of her advisor, come up with a research plan which will be funded by the college.</p>

<p>In the end it is up to you to make college great, they can only offer the framework for you to succeed. All the top colleges provide this, it is why they are rated so high. Figure out what college you will enjoy spending four years of your life, and embrace the experience,</p>

<p>I worked for decades at Pomona, Pitzer, and Claremont McKenna, sometimes as a faculty member, sometimes as an administrator. I went to a small demanding midwestern college. I spent 12 years as a consultant to colleges and universities, large and small. With no hesitation, I would say that Pomona is the most amazing college in the country, with CMC second. </p>

<p>That, however, is only my opinion. Yours might be different. What troubles me is your question. How “amazing” a college is depends on the symbiotic relationship between the student and the college. You make it sound like the college has to hand you “amazingness” for your consumption. With that attitude, I suspect all colleges will come up lacking.</p>

<p>BTW, had you heard that Pomona has just purchased a ranch near campus as a biological field station to complement the Bernard Field Station owned by all the colleges? It will provide 50 acres of native chaparral and a number of rare ecosystems for hands-on research, and the geology department will use it too.</p>

<p>Hey PowerBar. I turned down a lot of amazing schools, such as Stanford, University of Chicago, and Columbia to go to Pomona. I think your problem is not your expectations, but the fact that you have been approaching Pomona with the wrong mindset. Pomona is not as superficial as its endowment, its traditions, its location, or its weather- it is above all that.</p>

<p>The focus at Pomona, like many other top schools, is the academics. Everything else is secondary in focus. But what makes Pomona so exceptional compared to other top schools is how balanced these academic opportunities are, and the fact that the academics extend beyond the classroom. </p>

<p>The consortium is a big part of what makes Pomona unique. You’d be kidding yourself if you didn’t see that. Over 2500 small classes that are mostly offered seminar style. All with extremely accessible professors. Nowhere else in the USA offers that as conveniently as Pomona and the other consortium members do. So in a sense, you’re getting both the benefits of an elite liberal arts education and a mid-sized university. The consortium was a significant factor for me in that I’d have options available to me that a traditional liberal arts college may not be able to offer.</p>

<p>Pomona’s academics by themselves are exceptional however. The courses are rigorous, challenging, yet fulfilling. Which I’m sure applies to other schools as well. HOWEVER- The learning does not extend linearly with the professor and student. I stayed at classrooms at USC and Amherst and felt that was a big flaw of their learning. They were not encouraging student-professor interaction nearly as much as Pomona was. Questions were being tossed back and forth in the classroom, the stone-edged wording of textbooks and texts were ignored for freedom of thought and belief, and in the process, both the professors and the students were learning from each other. That WAS the factor that convinced me to choose Pomona over numerous similarly exceptional liberal arts colleges and national universities. Pomona seemed like it would facilitate an academic growth in me. It seemed like a place where I would be challenged and criticized, but cherished as well for inciting a new perspective for everyone else in the class. Even in the objective science classes, the openness of ideas was abound. The arguments emerged from seeking to find loopholes in the current system. From developing new methods and protocols. Don’t expect only learning for the sake of learning as other liberal arts colleges will give you. Expect learning for the sake of discovering yourself.</p>

<p>The academics at Pomona never stop in the classroom or when you’re doing homework. The school capitalizes on learning through many ways. The first is through the professors. Pomona professors are enthusiastic in taking students for research opportunities, internships, one-on-one tutorials, and plain “ordinary” conversations that expand the perspectives of both the student and the professor. The second is through the students. Pomona students may be one of the most academically distinguished student populations in the country, but it is not about the statistics, but rather how insightful they are. They’re complex figures that you will come to really appreciate later on in your life for their contradictions and nuances. They will make you feel stupid when you have intellectual conversations with them because you’ll realize that missing link in your perspectives. And in turn, you’ll show them what they may be missing as well. Unlike similarly intellectual schools like Swarthmore or Chicago however, this intellectual climate is not shoved down your throat. It is subtle, there for you to seek if you want it. And I really appreciate that element of balance. The third is through the events. The consortium as a whole, particularly Pomona and CMC, always brings interesting faces to give talks about all sorts of things, ranging from Islamic studies to World health to nonprofit business to judicial perspectives. It’s a way to once again see learning from several viewpoints so that you can mold your own. The last is opportunity. Pomona as you know has a massive endowment, but it’s not how big it is that matters but rather how Pomona uses it. Your ideas will be funded for you. Whether you need new lab equipment. Or a rare book that is not at the library. Or a summer program at Japan. Or the initial funds to start your own project. </p>

<p>I don’t deny that several schools may offer some of the above factors, but Pomona offers them ALL. The combination of a free learning environment, the brilliant people, the intellectual vibe, and the funding to ensure that you’re not limited in your time there is the factor that convinced me to choose Pomona over everything else, not the consortium, not the “death by chocolate”, not the beautiful campus.</p>

<p>Another significant thing that separates the climate at Pomona from other top schools is the nurturing environment. I stayed at 7 other colleges for diversity programs or admit weekends and nowhere else did I encounter that as significantly as Pomona gave me. And I needed it. I needed that support to ensure that I wouldn’t fall. I came from a homeless, troubled, low income life. Constantly on the run, constantly making mistakes due to lack of experience. I literally made best friends at Pomona on the first day. I never felt I was discriminated as a basis of my race or my income. There were no cliques at Pomona. There was definitely a community vibe everywhere I looked. Warmth emanated from the campus and I was personally greeted by strangers who talked to me about their perspectives in the school. That can’t be said about cold, desolate, thriving Columbia, where I felt lost, afraid, and judged. Stanford seemed too fast-paced for me: I had little experience with the entrepreneurial, individualistic nature that the vast majority of the students seemed to encompass, and despite its laidback friendliness, Stanford didn’t seem like a place that would take care of you. Pomona seemed like a great fit for me because it would challenge me yet ensure that I always had someone making sure I wasn’t falling behind. I felt that I needed that transition from teenage years to adulthood before going into a community as rapidly different as several top national universities, and Pomona seemed like that place for me. Looking at your responses, you seem to feel that this causes the students to become too sheltered. I disagree with your evaluation and feel it’s a lot more complex. You clearly have to put in some effort yourself to get what you want. Pomona provides you the opportunities and you take advantage of them. If you don’t put in this initial effort, you will not receive any feedback. And plus, with a community as integrated, tightly-knit as it, you not only are given meaning, but you give meaning to the multifaceted face of Pomona. It’s a much more dimensional community than it seems to be on paper. </p>

<p>You think that by granting us all these features that Pomona is spoiling us. It might be, but it’s not as straightforward as that. Pomona is like other elite universities a tough, rigorous place. The shift can be quite drastic from laughable high school courses to advanced, multidimensional college courses, but Pomona ensures that its students can thrive by ensuring a low stress, high opportunity setting. The traditions it offers are not to spoil the students but to give the school a distinct culture from other schools- you’d be kidding yourself if you think that the only things these traditions do is to spoil the students. No, they are to build lasting friendships, memories, and recollections of times that you will deeply miss after your four years at Pomona. They are to provide an experience beyond the academic realm. It’s one of the things I love about the school- how deep it goes, both academically and extracurricularly. You do not go to International Festival at CMC to be spoiled but to learn about cultures that are not your own, to share in the joy of representing such a diverse community. You do not go to the Draper Center’s subsidized 47 Trips solely for a leisurely experience but to try out things you may not have done before. College is a unique time in your life to enhance your perspectives, winnow down what your true passions are, and make memories that you will reminiscence for a life time. Pomona does not spoil us but rather gives us countless opportunities to make the most of our time there. The puppies or the massages are only one tiny smidge of life at Pomona- you shouldn’t be considering it if you feel that is all what the school comes to represent.</p>

<p>Statistics are not what differentiate Pomona from other top schools. The various luxuries that you may think differentiate us are not the reason we ultimately choose Pomona. Yes, we appreciate the beautiful campus, the amazing weather, the astounding profile of our incoming class, the balanced social life, the countless things to do on campus, the mammoth endowment, the quirky traditions, the good food, the spacious dorms, and the world class facilities, but we ultimately turn down every Ivy League, countless other liberal arts colleges, and other highly regarded universities such as Stanford, Duke, MiT, and Northwestern for the openness of Pomona’s environment, the nurturing community, the amazing people, the fulfilling academics, and that vibe that the school is truly your best fit. My account of Pomona is only one of the several ways you can look at Pomona, and I think that is a wonderful thing. Pomona is such a complex institution that you can look at it from angle and compare it with the next and see something new. The element of balance that the school has, which means that there is something here for everyone, and the fact that the school manages to synthesize this diversity into a reflection of one of the best schools in the country is truly amazing. As Collegebuff says- a symbiotic relationship between the school and its students is what truly comes to represent Pomona. </p>

<p>I urge you to visit the campus, get detailed perspectives from current students and alumni, and explore the massive website to see for yourself what Pomona is, and in particular, for you. Statistics and numbers do not tell the tale. </p>

<p>As for your proposition of the Ivy League of the West, we all feel it is a stupid phrase. We turned down Pomona because it is distinctly wonderful from other elite universities. We chose the “less” prestigious option because we truly wanted to be here, not because we want to tell other people we went here. After all, it’s not what the school makes for you but what you make of the school, and we feel we’d thrive at a place that would be the best fit for us. Do we care that we’re not given the same publicity as Brown, or Stanford, or Dartmouth? No, we don’t. We’re not as superficial as rankings as you think we may be. You may feel Pomona is always secondly compared to other schools, but we don’t. We hold a lot of respect and pride for our school because we know that it maintains its own, unique place among the best schools in the country. There’s a reason nearly 100% of us return the next year instead of transferring to seemingly more prestigious institutions, and we get transfers from several of these schools. It’s not to affirm that Pomona is a better school, but rather a better school FOR US. And knowing that Pomona has some of the highest medical school rates in the country, amazing PhD production, high representation in the nation’s best graduate programs, and recruiting by some of the nation’s most respected companies, we don’t regret our decision, for we know it will benefit us in the future as well.</p>

<p>I’m not sure what, if anything, I could add to the above post, except echo its sentiments. I suggest you read it carefully - it outlines many of the reasons why certain students chose Pomona. I could not have put it better myself. I made the mistake of misinterpreting your original question and gave certain quantifiable qualities that weren’t really that helpful.</p>

<p>Pomona is an amazing school. But it has to be the right school for you. If you truly feel like Pomona is missing something vital, then applying/attending is certainly not the right decision. There are so many amazing schools out there. Pomona was just the “better” option for students like debakian and myself.</p>

<p>My daughter is an incoming freshman at Pomona. She narrowed her choices down to several East Coast Ivies and Pomona. All offer fantastic academic experiences. She chose Pomona after visiting during Admitted Students Day. Many factors tipped the scale that were already mentioned, so I will add only one. While she was visiting, my daughter met with several faculty members to discuss a possible double major and the 3-2 Engineering program with Caltech. What distinguished these interactions was the manner in which she was treated by the faculty members. The faculty were warm and genuinely interested, having taken the time to review her resume and research experience prior to the meeting. They treated her as though she was a new colleague instead of a nervous 18 year old. She was given as much time as she needed until all of her questions were answered. Names of specific faculty members were provided for matches in potential research projects. One faculty member emailed the following week with additional helpful information. After her visit, she went from " I NEVER want to study abroad!" to When can I leave for Europe?" after she met with an engaging fascinating member who was conducting fascinating Neuroscience research in London. As a graduate of one of those snotty aforementioned East Coast schools, I can tell you that kind of reception is a rarity for an undergrad. Pomona is fervently dedicated to undergraduate education and that endeavor, combined with their California warm and friendly vibe truly sets them apart.</p>

<p>I live in Claremont and have attended classes at Pomona (as a Scripps student). We are friends with many Pomona faculty and staff members. I have written articles about Pomona.</p>

<p>Pomona is a great school. The faculty are very involved, yes, more so than at the large research universities (although you can’t speak for every faculty member, everywhere). Is it better than any of the other great liberal arts colleges? I wouldn’t know, and probably not, they have many of the same advantages.</p>

<p>That said, the things that make Pomona unique: It’s part of a consortium of great colleges, all of which make up a pretty cool community. Claremont is a beautiful college town that is only a 40-minute train ride away from downtown Los Angeles. From there, the subways can take you to Hollywood, the Getty Center, Chinatown, Universal Studios… The faculty are attracted to living in this cosmopolitan area as well, and so you get the cream of the crop…</p>

<p>If we didn’t already live here, I would definitely want my kids to go to college here. Unfortunately, no one wants to go to college where they grew up!</p>

<p>I think this was mentioned before, but Pomona lacks a rich history, the traditions of grandeur of other elite schools, and I’m not sure how to say this but “power” of other schools. It’s in a position that Stanford was in, competing with the top schools to make its place in the world against other more well-established institutions. When I visited Pomona’s campus I didn’t feel it had the powerfulness and sorta magical quality about it that I felt at other school such as Swarthmore, Yale, Wesleyan, and UChicao. It didn’t feel like a college to me, it didn’t feel like an academic haven. </p>

<p>Also, so many people have said things like “I got into Harvard, Yale, Ivies etc. and went to Pomona”. Why can’t they just say I went to Pomona over other schools. It seems like people need to prove how good Pomona is by saying they chose it over other top schools. </p>

<p>Also, someone above posted something about “snotty East Coast schools” with disinterested professors while they were there, but I think that’s just offensive. You can find nice and helpful professors anywhere, and snotty and disinterested ones anywhere, Pomona doesn’t have a monopoly on considerate teachers and I know that some professors at Pomona are not spectacular.</p>

<p>Here are some of my personal thoughts on the above mentioned poster though to offer a different perspective. I don’t want to discredit his or her points because impressions are subjective, but I disagree with a lot of the points:</p>

<p>Pomona, like ALL liberal arts colleges, does not have that “grandeur” that national universities do simply because of size differences. There’s a huge difference between a place that has 1500 students and a place with 30000 graduates and undergraduates. Name brands become prominent at top schools and traditions become famous simply because more word goes out. In terms of the size and resources of a whole it’s expected that these schools would have, in terms of magnitude, the bigger sense of establishment. But I think differently about the history and tradition. Pomona has had a rich history through its 125 years and has established a position among the top 10 liberal arts colleges in the country ever since rankings were published, but more importantly, it’s a very distinctive school. I think there’s a 800 page history book in the store if you’re interested, but to sum it up, Pomona has established itself with a combination of an overarching east coast liberal arts foundation and a west coast cultural vibe. You won’t find a place like it with the same academic eliteness in the entire country. It’s not trying find its place like you think it is because there is no other school competing with it for the location, size, student body, consortium, and academics. As for traditions, there are several, just like there are in other schools. Ski-Beach Day. Orientation Adventure. Harwood Halloween. Walker Wall. 47. Mufti. Pretty similar to most other schools in terms of the strengths of these traditions, but definitely unique. Grandeur comes from how exceptional the resources are at Pomona when compared with the small student body.</p>

<p>When I visited Pomona’s campus, I loved it. I felt it had a magical vibe to it that in particular spoke of opportunity, nurturing, and potential. It was a beautiful campus that had a grand sense of funding but also a small charming sense of intimacy. The facilities were extremely up to date and I could just feel how extremely rich and established the school was in the air. Did it feel like an academic haven on the outside? Yes, it did. I saw professors interacting with students in the chairs outside the Coop Fountain. I saw students reading books while skateboarding or on the steps of Carnegie Hall. Yes, there were people running around or biking normally, but that can be said for any school in the country. More importantly, you get the academic feel in the classroom. The students I met were highly focused, there were walls and whiteboards littered with academic creativity, the professors took their time to ensure their students needs were fulfilled, and I often overheard philosophical conversations in the dorm I stayed in. </p>

<p>I don’t understand how you think Pomona doesn’t feel like a college to you. It’s a pretty huge campus for its size and has all sorts of buildings and facilities. There is definitely a collegiate feel to the place. The school was smaller than my high school but it did not feel like a high school- much, much bigger and within a far more advanced setting. </p>

<p>People say things like that in all schools, not just Pomona. I did turn down schools like Columbia and Stanford for Pomona not because I’m insecure to mention Pomona by itself, but because it’s the fact of my situation. If you look at my post, I did say “We chose the “less” prestigious option because we truly wanted to be here, not because we want to tell other people we went here”. Once you arrive at Pomona, no one is going to mention they turned down Yale or Harvard to be here because they’re so enthusiastic to be at their best fit school. Threads like “What did you turn down for X School” are definitely not a measure of the what you might be suspecting(if so, take the same logic to every other school on CC then because there’s bound to be a post like it), and neither are posts like mines above which are just a way to show that there is a reason behind we turn down schools that others might not understand. I think you’re ultimately associating the wrong people with Pomona or having a misguided impression because the vast majority of the students don’t feel like that.</p>

<p>To your last point, no, I don’t disagree. And that could be said for any school. However, Pomona is different in many ways. You are far more likely to encounter disinterested professors at a national university than a liberal arts college because research is a big component to those schools and undergraduates lack that expertise. You are more likely to see big classes in them compared to Pomona. And you definitely will not get the same one on one attention that Pomona gives at a place like Stanford. That’s how Pomona is different academically from national universities. But with the liberal arts college difference, the academic differences come from:

  1. Endowment- Pomona’s endowment per student is the largest for any LAC and it’s very actively used to funds students ideas and proposals. This ensures that you have the resources to academically thrive.
  2. Consortium- Pomona students enjoy over 2500 classes offered at 5 exceptional liberal arts colleges, which ensures that there’s a great amount of course variety.
  3. Intimacy- Pomona actively seeks to make sure its students are taken care of, from sponsor groups, one on one tutorial sessions, sponsored lunches for professors, one on one time with faculty advisors which are chosen from a letter you write, and the close-knit relationship with the students and administrations. I don’t deny that other LACs may offer this, but Pomona was definitely the most intimate and friendly I encountered among visits to Amherst, Swarthmore, Williams, Pomona, Bowdoin, and Haverford.
  4. Resources- Sure, having an endowment is great and all, but it’s of no use if it’s not put to resources right? Pomona has amazing resources for a tiny liberal arts college though. Its own observatory, the largest library collection among any liberal arts colleges, a very well built student center, an outdoor theater, an amazing number of athletic facilities, very up to date science facilities, top notch music facilities, dance and theater avenues, outdoor classrooms, study lounges, career development centers, and computer labs. These facilities are seldom crowded which ensures ample time for students to enjoy them. I got the sense of grandeur in terms of how expansive and rich the school was that no other LAC gave me.</p>

<p>Ultimately the point is that while Pomona has similarly accessible and great professors(as well as the bad ones, but again, what school DOESN’T have them?) as other schools, it has very unique or top notch academic characteristics as well. </p>

<p>I do dislike the statement “snotty east coast schools” because the people I met at the aforementioned schools were not snotty- definitely extremely friendly and enthusiastic about new students. However, they were not as cohesive as a community and laid-back as the folks at Pomona were, which were characteristics that I sought in choosing a college.</p>

<p>^Don’t take PAGRok too seriously, ever since he got waitlisted from Pomona he seems to have angst with it. Everyone who really does their research knows the vast majority of his points aren’t true.</p>

<p>Furthurmore a lot of his previous points are out of date(look for his post on his “sister”). The way Pomona has been enhancing its reputation each year, especially with selectivity and endowment, is astonishing.</p>

<p>No need to be so accusatory. I think he has an interesting perspective. It’s clear to see all sides of the opinions on Pomona because Pomona’s definitely not a perfect school for everyone :)</p>

<p>I agree, in small part, with PAGRok. The feel at Pomona is definitely different than a place like MIT or HPYS, etc. You can’t go to Pomona and say “this is where X was discovered. The boundaries of human knowledge have truly been pushed and tested here.” Pomona just doesn’t have that sort of history in academia (there is research at Pomona, but it really is to mainly give students research experience…you won’t/don’t see headlines like the recent “Harvard encodes 700 terabytes of data in a gram of DNA”). </p>

<p>But Pomona, at least to me, feels much more accessible. I’m glad that Pomona doesn’t have that sort of history. Pomona is entirely about its (undergraduate) students. And they’re so well taken care of. So while you may not be able to rub elbows with the giants in academia (or walk in their hallowed footsteps on campus), you can do so later in grad school after receiving a much more “personal” (I place that in quotes because I’m not sure how else to properly convey it) college experience. For example, instead of fighting for that coveted lab assistant spot, you can easily pursue a project of your own (with faculty supervision) at Pomona, and though you may not make earth-shattering discoveries, the experience may be more valuable.</p>

<p>They’re different. It’s the distinction between large research universities and liberal arts colleges. I decided Pomona was better for me.</p>

<p>But you also have to acknowledge that a part of it is because Pomona is an undergraduate only experience. Take out the graduate, business, and medical components from the top research universities and you will get the similar amount of potential in terms of undergraduates. Very few undergraduates will have discovered DNA or whatever major headlines come from these top schools; the vast majority will be from other sectors of the school. The only exceptions I can think of would be schools like MiT, Caltech, Olin, Georgia Tech, or Harvey Mudd, where innovation and development are a crucial part of the experience. But undergraduate programs in schools like Harvard, Penn, and the LACs will most likely be similar.</p>

<p>A place like Pomona offers similar resources and academic qualities to top universities for the vast majority of the people attending school there. However, it also offers distinctive characteristics of a small liberal arts college such as small accessible classes, intimacy and personalization, and a nurturing community. Best of both worlds and exceptional in those characteristics compared to other schools. I can’t think of any other school which does the same.</p>

<p>I would definitely agree with that. The graduate/research programs are the main reason why those universities have that sort of feel of prestige to them. There is no equivalent at the undergrad level, even at places like Harvey Mudd, Caltech, et al.</p>

<p>Which is why I said that it’s the difference between a research university and liberal arts college. We’re entirely talking about “feel” here, and there’s definitely a difference between attending a larger research institution where you have all of that happening around you, whether you take part or not, and attending a place like Pomona or Harvey Mudd where you are the focus of the institution.</p>

<p>@nostalgic I’m just trying to rationalize those out there who hold Pomona as holy and perfect. I bring a different perspective and am trying to point out things that I did not like about Pomona. I really have no bone to pick with Pomona because I was waitlisted, I can completely understand why I was waitlisted because I didn’t fit Pomona. </p>

<p>I do think Pomona is unique, and provides an amazing education and college experience, but it is has FLAWS. The things I talked about are all opinion and cannot be researched, because they are my opinion. I don’t think Pomona has much of rich history, other than its decision to incorporate a consortium of the Cambridge and Oxford style and the well balanced weight of majors. The traditions at Pomona seem weak to me (my opinion though), like Ski-Beach day, but it is fun and different! It works for Pomona, but many other schools don’t have these type of traditions, and the non-academic traditions at Pomona help make Pomona, Pomona, but some people might find them underwhelming.</p>

<p>I think Pomona has established itself, but it doesn’t have the “esteem” or “prestige” of other schools like Amherst, Williams, and Swarthmore who have the east-coast boost in applicants. I mean Pomona is nearly a third of students from CA. Even the fact that you said this: “The way Pomona has been enhancing its reputation each year, especially with selectivity and endowment, is astonishing.” means that in your eyes Pomona is still catching up, by “enhancing its reputation”. You simply proved my point, even though my point is “out of date”. </p>

<p>Pomona has so many things going for it, and it is different and unique, and that’s really refreshing, but just not my choice. That is what I meant to show in my previous post. But alas, haters gunna hate.</p>