<p>There are pure merit awards. Usually, however, they are usually not at a reach or match school but at a safety school. </p>
<p>Personally, I wish that all states would be like Georgia and offer Hope Scholarships (full tuition to state schools for those with 3.0, full tuition to tech schools for the rest).</p>
<p>Our economy will work best when everyone is educated to their own personal level of excellence.</p>
<p>"Why apply for money you don't actually need?" </p>
<p>First, those who really don't need it probably aren't applying for it; while you may think some of these folks are, re-read morningbird's post - even at $250k, after taxes and living expenses, not to mention trying to save for retirement, private school tuition represents a significant chunk of remaining disposable income. Outside the VERY wealthy, college tuition is a stretch for most everybody.</p>
<p>Second, in-state universities are a VERY good bargain and if those are too expenseive, then take a good look at doing two years at a CC, then transferring. You'll get a very good education at a very affordable cost.</p>
<p>But the real question (on 'merit' v. need-based financial assistance) is what is it really designed to do? Reframe the question: what do the institutions want to get out of it? Start by looking at atheletic scholarships: these are used (fair or not) to attract the best atheletes. In CT, where I live, UCONN offers full scholarships to keep the best students in state, like a valedictorian who got acceptances from several Ivies, and whose middle-class parents could have stretched, but in the end decided to accept the scholarship instead - what's fair here?</p>
<p>Think about this: is it fair when a high school drop out wins the lotto? Or should that go to someone who worked hard all their life?</p>
<p>Sky asks,"Why do rich and privileged students apply for scholarships when they clearly can afford the price tag"</p>
<p>Response: I am not going to get into the "Life isn't fair" syndrome since you probably know that. Your answer is that by awarding merit scholarships ( to kids whose parents don't need the aid as much as you) the colleges can theoretically attract better students than they would have gotten otherwise. This provides better competition and more capable students ( at least theoretically) for people like you! In addition, it attracts kids from wealthier parents who can be big donors in the future, which will also improve the education for kids like you. </p>
<p>Approaching this philosophically, I had a professor whose main thesis was that "the stomach is superior to the mind." Business, and most of life, is about survival. What is generally beneficial to colleges,they will do. What is detrimental, they will generally stay away from. </p>
<p>True, there are exceptions such as providing aid to needy kids.However, this certainly goes against their economic interests! Merit aid helps colleges in attracting smarter kids and thus raising the overall SAT scores,which, inturn, attract even smarter applicants in future years. It is an ethical dilemma: Better quality kids and better quality applicants in the future ( which directly benefit the college) or aiding those who are in need ( which might be considered more of an indirect benefit but is more beneficial to society as a whole).</p>
<p>Just because a family makes money does NOT mean that they can afford to send their kids to college without any help.</p>
<p>My family is upper-middle class. My parents both make a decent amount of money, and if I were an only child, they could probably afford to send me to college with very little financial aid.</p>
<p>However, I also have a sister who is college-aged as well. There is NO WAY that my parents can afford to send both of us to college with no aid. And yet I've gotten no financial aid and no scholarships as of yet. Can you imagine how frustrated I am?</p>
<p>You ask if it's fair for kids to get money because their family is well-off. Well consider this: We have no control over the family we're born into. Is it really fair that I be penalized for my parents working hard and wanting to give me the things that they never had? Is it really fair that I have worked VERY hard in school all my life, I have great test scores and ECs and I was accepted to all three schools I applied to, and yet all of that is suddenly discounted because my parents make money?</p>
<p>You need to look at the other person's perspective here. Just because we have money doesn't mean we can afford college. ESPECIALLY if, like myself, the student is planning on grad school. Or if (unlike myself) the child is going to a private school. You don't know that they "don't need it"...they may simply look like they don't need it, like others have said.</p>
<p>Also, my parents work INCREDIBLY hard...often 12 hours a day, 6 or 7 days a week. It's not like this was just handed to me...so if my parents still need help, why shouldn't I get it?</p>
<p>I am upper-middle class as well. I have three other siblings, however, and my parents could not afford the private LAC I attend without all the merit-based scholarships I'm receiving. I also don't have an expensive cell phone, I pay for my own books, and don't take exotic trips. A lot of the kids at my school do these things though, and still receive merit-aid, so I understand your frustration but if they worked just as hard throughout high school, shouldn't they be allowed to receive merit-based scholarships?</p>
<p>"We have no control over the family we're born into. Is it really fair that I be penalized for my parents working hard and wanting to give me the things that they never had?"</p>
<p>"Penalized?" Grow up. There are worse things in the world then not being able to go to the school that you think will be the best for you because your parents can't (or won't) pay full price. Try being poor for a while.</p>
<p>Yes, stop whining and work harder. Nobody owes you anything.</p>
<p>Also, the cost of a private college is still too much for many upper-middle class families. Merit aid is the only way many upper-middle class kids can afford college without having to take on tremendous amounts of debt. On the other hand, most respectable institutions will throw tens and tens of thousands of dollars on lower-class kids to allow them to attend.</p>
<p>As several people here have stated, a college education is a financial stretch for most families and those who are extrememly wealthy generally do not apply for money. However, kids who do get scholarships (rich and otherwise) deserve it because of their hard work, abilities, and determination and so scholarships are a reward for their efforts as well as an incentive for them to maintain or raise their academic status. I suppose knowledge and better prospects for the future can be a sort of encouragement but many people need something more tangible to motivate them and give them that hard push. And universities would like higher numbers and whatever so they provide the money. Don't you think people should be compensated for their hard work?</p>
<p>Excuse me...my family has NOT always been upper-middle class, and we were pretty darn close to losing out house for a while. I know what it's like, mmmmkay?</p>
<p>Not to mention, you have no idea what my homelife is like. If my parents can't afford to send me to the school I'm going to, I can't go to school at all. It seems to me that you're the one that needs to grow up.</p>
<p>And I'm not "whining"...I'm just trying to explain why I'm in a upper-middle class family but I'm applying for aid. Maybe instead of attacking me (which by the way does not help your case but certainly makes you seem immature), YOU should be the ones "working harder".</p>
<p>And I would point out that no one necessarily owes YOU anything either, bartleby.</p>
<p>SkyGirl - I know exactly what you are talking about, but unfortunately there's really not a lot that can be done!</p>
<p>that's why there is need based and not need based aid.
and that's why people who almost don't have any money already get tons from universities, leaving only a chunk for merit aid.</p>
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<p>What? I am afraid I don't understand your logic. So valedictorians whose parents can afford to send them to school deserve more aid than others? </p>
<p>Ignorance is indeed bliss, there are so many students who do not go to college because they simply can't afford it. Tuition costs covered, it is still too expensive as far as living costs are concerned. My parents pay my full tuition. I could of applied for merit aid and received quite a bit, but that is unfair to those who need it far more than I do. </p>
<p>The reason why education is not valued by so many in this country is because of the huge flaws in our system. The wealthy get tutors, vacations, private preparation for exams, etc.. and many on this board consider them "harder working." Well, grades and stats are not a direct reflection of effort, that is a stupid argument to make in the first. There are students working to pay their way through HIGH SCHOOL not college, what about them? they are most likely not going to be able to afford to attend any college.</p>
<p>I agree about taking advantage of state schools. I can reason with dreams being shattered. I disagree with offering athletes and valedictorians full rides when others need it more. More emphasis should be put on need. A girl here mentioned she has her own car, and other luxuries, but not an ipod or a iphone and she is considering herself NEEDWORTHY. That is ridiculous, if you can't afford an Ivy League school, get rid of the car, get rid of the expensive cell phone bill and other disposable non-essentials and learn the value of an education.</p>
<p>Come on folks, we are complaining about stretching budgets, putting off new car purchased, etc. to send our children to school, Shouldn't higher education be the first priority? America used to be where immigrants came, worked their butts off and earned whatever is coming to them. Nowadays we are handing aid to people who can afford to go to school, and you guys are still complaining.</p>
<p>I really haven't seen much of this-- my family is upper-middle class and I won't even be applying for need based aid, though I do expect merit. </p>
<p>As much I would like to see more people go to college, if they have the scores, they will get enough money, its a supply and demand relationship. </p>
<p>Both my parents came from low income families and had full scholarships, but not to fantastic schools. They do well now. </p>
<p>I believe the truly needy students shouldn't expect all of their need to be met, not when the average student has to take out loans and work. </p>
<p>Good luck on getting the aid you need, but please don't blame the wealthy -- it is not fair either for our parents to pay excessive amounts of money to subsidize the costs of low income students. The money you may get isn't coming from some wealthy unknown donor, it most often comes at the expense of other students who pay the full price.</p>
<p>"Excuse me...my family has NOT always been upper-middle class, and we were pretty darn close to losing out house for a while. I know what it's like, mmmmkay?"</p>
<p>Then you should know better. Count your blessings.</p>
<p>"If my parents can't afford to send me to the school I'm going to, I can't go to school at all."</p>
<p>A common myth. I'm not saying that you should have to, or that it would be easy, but lots of people put themselves through school (usually starting with community college). My point: just remember that you are one of the fortunate ones, and get the chip off of your shoulder.</p>
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As much I would like to see more people go to college, if they have the scores, they will get enough money, its a supply and demand relationship.
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<p>According to? This is definitely not the case. My EFC is 0, I will work and go to school full time regardless. The only difference between me and other students is that if trouble comes around their parents have the means to bail them out, I would be on my own. </p>
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Not to mention, you have no idea what my homelife is like. If my parents can't afford to send me to the school I'm going to, I can't go to school at all. It seems to me that you're the one that needs to grow up.
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<p>Well if your parents can not afford to send you to school at all, it is either because their income is too low (a contradiction of your upper-middleclass statement) or they need to reconsider some of their luxuries, and budget accordingly. </p>
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Good luck on getting the aid you need, but please don't blame the wealthy -- it is not fair either for our parents to pay excessive amounts of money to subsidize the costs of low income students. The money you may get isn't coming from some wealthy unknown donor, it most often comes at the expense of other students who pay the full price.
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<p>Think psychology for a bit. It may seem like you are still responsible for a large sum of money, but to the person who does not have that money at all it is simply impossible. "excessive amounts of money" to them is a fraction of what is it to you. You will get all the perks, spending money, on campus housing, meal plans, etc.. The lower income students usually need to attend a commuter school, and still don't have enough to get by. </p>
<p>You kids need to learn the value of your education and stop complaining. Look at yourselves, you are spoiled little brats. "ohh my mom has to drive a 2008 toyota instead of a 2008 mercedes to send me to college, it's too much to pay, screw the people who need the money we need it more"</p>
<p>My parents make good money yet they they are not just going to shell it all out for me to go to college, in fact they told me they would only contribute a small amount. I have a younger brother and sister that will need to go to college as well. So I think it's totally fair. Without scholarship I will not be able to attend the college I want, and if students have the grades and the work to deserve it, why shouldn't they get money??</p>
<p>skygirl if you need the aid you will get it those who apply for aid and do not qualify will not get any aid. with this said the school that provides the aid has to want you to attend. if you have the grades and of course these days everything else you do not have to be wealthy to get into the "best" colleges.</p>
<p>Middle Class depends on your state a lot. In Indiana 100K is the upper-end of middle class, but I don't think 40K a year for a whole family is middle-class anywhere.</p>
<p>Why do people think that a parents income should be the deciding factor. I don't think any school should give any student a full-ride on need-based aid. If your parents make X-amount a year and you go to college and you have to take out 20K every year, I bet your parents are going to make you pay about half of that after college, and since both the middle- and low- income students would be getting the same education they would probably have the same oppurtunities after college to pay it off, why should one have to put up with paying off loans just because their parents made more money? If you don't want to discriminate based on money then don't do it, for or against poor people. Poor kids and rich kids should come out of college with an equal amount of debt.</p>
<p>Should there be need- based aid... YES!!!
Should there be enough need-based aid to give full-rides...NO!!!</p>
<p>There is a program in Indiana where if your parents make under some random amount of money and you graduate from an accredited high school they give a full-ride to almost any school in the state, including a lot of the private schools. That's ridiculous.</p>
<p>Indiana must have a lottery--as so many states do these days. I won't jump on that bandwagon as that is a topic for another thread. Unfortunately, not all states have a lottery to help fund education.</p>
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My point: just remember that you are one of the fortunate ones, and get the chip off of your shoulder.
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<p>I do realize that I'm "one of the fortunate ones". But I get the feeling that no matter what I say you're just going to attack me. Sounds to me like you're the one with the chip on their shoulder just because you might not have it easy.</p>
<p>Look. The fact is, none of us have it easy. Even the wealthiest person in the world has problems. Get over it and find a solution instead of complaining about the problem.</p>