Is this plagiarism?

Parents Forum
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<p>The topic my daughter wrote about is a controversial one - the purpose of her paper was to present different sides of the argument and the reasons why each are valid (in the source author's opinion). Though my daughter had her own thoughts on the issue, she realized that they had already been discussed in the articles; she did not want to make assumptions about the authors' POV. In addition, several of her examples were "real life" stories that had been introduced in the stories, and she could certainly not change these details.</p>

<p>As a student interested in this particular field, my daughter wanted to learn more about the topic at hand - thus, her extensive research. She had spoken to the professor three weeks before the due date to discuss topic ideas, and the professor had even helped my daughter narrow down the subject. They had given a one-page presentation of their paper topic the week before it was due, and everyone in the class expressed interest in their in-class discussion (including the professor).</p>

<p>After my daughter learned that the professor had submitted her paper, an advisor (who know both my daughter and the professor) asked the professor if she would be willing to let my daughter re-write the paper - the professor refused. This is my daughter's first ever administrative warning for any of her assignments (and she is a rising senior).</p>

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<p>and so it seems your belief/feeling is that this woman professor took retribution because of the controversial topic. You are seeming to say that the professor disagreed with your daughter's stance and thus turned your daughter into the committee for plagiarism. Am I understanding you?</p>

<p>Out of curiosity has this particular professor taught this Frosh Seminar before?</p>

<p>
[quote]
The topic my daughter wrote about is a controversial one - the purpose of her paper was to present different sides of the argument and the reasons why each are valid (in the author's opinion)

[/quote]

and your daughter was the author whose opinion is referred to here? Seems it would be. As to the type of paper, this description seems to incline a persuasive paper that also incorporated research......was that the assigned task? Did that posture complicate this for your daughter?</p>

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<p>Sounds like either a very strange professor, or there is more to the story. </p>

<p>I agree with other posters that, as presented, it is plagiarism, but I don't know why the prof. is or has been such a butthead, if in fact she has.</p>

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<p>My advice,</p>

<p>1) Do not argue at all about whether this count as plagarism with the school judicial affairs people. Admit it and pretend to be fully repent.</p>

<p>2) Go tell professor you are fully repent and say sorry.</p>

<p>3) Hint prof to ask for leniency for your sanctions.</p>

<p>4) Write a good sanction statement requesting for leniency.</p>

<p>5) Forget about it when things are over</p>

45

<p>My family and I really appreciate all of your different aspects of the situation as my daughter prepares her defense. There are more details to the story and to the professor, but we are hesitant to post them here to protect the institution, the professor, and ourselves.</p>

<p>As a previous poster suggested, we should put up the University Policies for discussion. However, we would have to quote the policy on plagiarism or we would paragraph it (either way, we would be revealing the college name in our citation). We also realized that because the policy is written in list format, it would be difficult to make a "summary" without including every item in a way close to its original.</p>

<p>This was a dilemma my daughter ran into while writing her paper, because she came across lists (in the sources) that she wanted to include in her paper. Since she was unable to use quotes, the only way she could give a complete description of those lists was to change a few words in the sentences. However, she included a citation with each sentence to give the author credit.</p>

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<p>I totally understand wanting to keep the school name off this thread......at least until you have a resolution.</p>

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<p>You could also send a few posters private messages, if you want to keep things more confidential. Not that trusting an anonomyous online person is confidential, precisely... but you see what I mean.</p>

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<p>My comment,</p>

<p>the investigator/judicial officer/someother titled person at your D's college will formally charge this case. </p>

<p>This case will go to a judical hearing</p>

<p>do not contest the charge and pretend to be fully repent as usually contesting the charge will make your D appear not repentent or aware of her fault even if I know it doesn't exist. </p>

<p>try be nice to the judicial panel and ask for leniency</p>

<p>forget about it and live a normal (even better) life</p>

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<p>"You're missing the point, ldmom. Her wording was so close that it might as well have been the direct quote. Obviously the teacher's point was to have the students to interpret things in their own words, thereby avoiding quotes." (HiImAnAlcoholic, 2006)</p>

<p>I don't think I missed the point at all. I get that the professor has lulu's d on a technicality. I just think the teacher is being a bit disingenuous and lot harsh. It should have been obvious to the professor when she corrected the first paper and had to take off points for quoting, that lulu's d did not understand what was required of her. When lulu's d modified her technique, however inappropriately, by paraphrasing and citing, it should have inspired the professor to 'teach' not 'punish'.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
This was a dilemma my daughter ran into while writing her paper, because she came across lists (in the sources) that she wanted to include in her paper. Since she was unable to use quotes, the only way she could give a complete description of those lists was to change a few words in the sentences. However, she included a citation with each sentence to give the author credit.

[/quote]
The fact that she gave a citation with each paraphrased sentence shows that she was not trying to hide the source or deny the credit. I think she should point out to the panel that she was explicitly told by the professor not to use direct quotes - so that was the way she shared their words - using citations after the paraphrased section (which doesn't mean that what she did was okay - just that it was the only way she knew how to solve the problem.) It is a murky situation at best -without having the full text of both works in front of me, I can't tell if it really is a case of plagerism or not... But I just can NOT understand how a professor could disallow quotes!!!! And I think that should be an issue to be discussed at the review.</p>

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<p>I believe your daughter is guilty of plagerism. Since my son entered highschool, every syllabus for every course has contained examples of "plagerism" and the rewording done by your daughter is profiled as an example. </p>

<p>My guess is that your daughter did not intend to "cheat" but does not know how to write a research paper. Depending on the college, the professors probably assume this was covered in highschool. </p>

<p>I believe, the professor's comments on her first paper - not wanting quotes - was probably an attempt to get your daughter to do her own "thinking" instead of relying on the words of published authors. The professor's original criticism was probably directed to the absence of synthesis and original thought in the paper. </p>

<p>Perhaps your daughter could explain that she misunderstood the professors comments on the first paper, tried to comply on the second, and now realizes her mistake. I think including citations shows your daughter was not trying to take credit for the included ideas - but it does point out glaring deficiences in your daughter's college prep work. Obviously, your daughter needs a lot of "make up" work this summer before tackling another paper next year.</p>

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<p>I'm with interesteddad - there's got to be more to this story than Lulu feels comfortable posting publicly - and I understand that. As to plagiarism, it sound slike we're getting caught up in hypertechnicality. I understand that certain citation conventions need to be followed, and that a given assignment may require certain levels of "original" work, and failure to do that doesn't satisfy the course requirement. But quoting or paraphrasing an idea and giving credit to its author by any intelligible form of citation is not "plagiarism." The essence of plagiarism is passing off other's work or ideas as one's own. When you cite to your source in a manner which makes it clear whose idea or work it is - even if you do it in incorrect form - that's not plagiarism.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
But quoting or paraphrasing an idea and giving credit to its author by any intelligible form of citation is not "plagiarism."

[/quote]
</p>

<p>This is also what my daughter thought when she cited the sources in the manner that she did. It was her way of giving credit to the original author - now she knows that perhaps this was in an incorrect form, but at that time, she thought her citation made it clear that it was the author's work.</p>

<p>In addition, the purpose of my daughter's research paper was to present varying views of a debate so that she could herself have a whole picture of the issue. In her mind, her particular paper was not one that would contain a lot of "original work", because many of her conclusions/opinions had been discussed previously. But, she wanted to include these opinions (because they were important to the overall strength of her paper) but not try to pass them off as her own ideas - so, she cited the source.</p>

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<p>My suggestion to you beyond this immediate situation: please help your daughter locate the on campus resource for writing. Most schools have a Writing Center. I know at my school an appointment is good. Make your appointments early and plan for the fact you WILL have a paper due. I think it is sad that any student, regardless of the level of preparation prior to college, waits to locate the writing center until they have had a crisis. Low grade on a first paper may constitute a crisis.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
I think it is sad that any student, regardless of the level of preparation prior to college, waits to locate the writing center until they have had a crisis.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>In our parents orientation Q&A session, when we dropped off our daughter at college, the graduating seniors fielding the questions emphasized the value of using the writing center peer review resources. One honors graduate said that she hadn't discovered the writing center until her sophmore year and then had used it for every paper since.</p>

<p>Apparently my daughter got the same story. I believe that in two years at college so far, she has gotten writing center peer review of all but one paper. Some of her courses have actually had specific peer reviewers attached to the course and a mandatory peer review cycle as part of the deadlines. Just terrific learning opportunity. I wish more students would avail themselves of these resources.</p>

<p>BTW, Prof Purrin writes on his plagarism website that one of the most effective ways to teach students not to plagarize is to require submission of rough drafts for professsor review and discussion before the final paper is due. This submit, review, comment, and revise cycle is also a great way to teach writing.</p>

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<p>Without further information on what else may be part of this picture, and based on the information provided by the OP, I think the teacher comment to not use quotes is ambiguous. If the prof really meant to tell the student to do more synthesis and present ideas in her own words, the prof should have said that. If the prof has the students doing research papers, then quotations are absolutely essential parts of a proper reasearch paper. Using quotations to support info in a research paper is drummed into kids in our school district. To not use quotes in support of your statements would be grounds for a failing grade in our school district. If a prof tells a kid to not use quotations, I can understand a student interpreting this to mean, literally, do not use quotations - and I can understand that student simply paraphrasing and then providing the reference. </p>

<p>Honestly, if an English prof can't be more clear than to say don't use quotes, and the student then doesn't use quotes, how can the student be held to a standard of plagiarism? Even if, technically, the student has now plagiarized, by someone's standards, hasn't the student done it at the behest of the prof's ambiguous commentary? Jeesh, and the English teacher holds no responsibility for being unclear, noninstructive and nonspecific??? C'mon.</p>

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<p>And adding - clearly, the issue of plagiarism is one which our society is working through in general, so that our institutions (Universities, newspapers, publishing houses) are super sensitive right now on this topic. Possibly to the point of overreaction.</p>

<p>Furthermore, to drag one young student through a plagiarism hearing when there is a history of teacher commentary directing the student (and directing that student unclearly) seems excessive and cold, to me. </p>

<p>Has this professor been in the University for a long time? Is it a newly minted prof? </p>

<p>I guess this one just touches a nerve with me, because I can picture myself at that age, or plenty of other kids now in that age bracket, and their parents, who are struggling with freshman issues, and are now being forced to work through a situation like this.</p>

<p>I guess I am saying I hope both the parents and the student here and the institution recognize that plagiarism is a topic of coversation being held at a society wide level. Now, Lulu, you and your child are being forced to deal with this on a personal level, and I can imagine that it hurts like hell.</p>

<p>I agree with Marite that you should consider hiring an attorney and letting the institution know you are doing so. </p>

<p>Let us know what happens, please.</p>

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<p>firsttimemom:</p>

<p>"...If the prof has the students doing research papers, then quotations are absolutely essential parts of a proper reasearch paper. Using quotations to support info in a research paper is drummed into kids in our school district. To not use quotes in support of your statements would be grounds for a failing grade in our school district."</p>

<p>I wholeheartedly disagree that direct quotes are necessary for research papers. Direct quotes are frowned upon in any paper at the college level. By college, you're supposed to be able to integrate other people's work and arguments into your papers without needing direct quotes. You're supposed to briefly summarize the relevant point in your own words, cite the original author and then go on with your analysis. No direct quote required.</p>

<p>"If a prof tells a kid to not use quotations, I can understand a student interpreting this to mean, literally, do not use quotations - and I can understand that student simply paraphrasing and then providing the reference."</p>

<p>Again, she didn't paraphrase--she copied and tried to pass it off as paraphrasing.</p>

<p>lulu500:
"In her mind, her particular paper was not one that would contain a lot of 'original work', because many of her conclusions/opinions had been discussed previously. But, she wanted to include these opinions (because they were important to the overall strength of her paper) but not try to pass them off as her own ideas - so, she cited the source."</p>

<p>Including others' opinions is fine--that's what she was supposed to do--and she cited the fact that it was another author's ideas just fine. She didn't, however, cite the fact that she copied someone else's words. That's just as bad as not citing someone else's idea. Instead of explaining the other author's work in her own words, she copied almost word for word. That really isn't an innocent mistake.</p>

<p>What did your daughter's school do to explain its plagerism policy? I know that many universities (including mine) distribute a copy of its policy on the first day and it usually explains what consitute plagerism and what level of work is expected in writing assignments.</p>

<p>kluge:
"But quoting or paraphrasing an idea and giving credit to its author by any intelligible form of citation is not 'plagiarism.' The essence of plagiarism is passing off other's work or ideas as one's own. When you cite to your source in a manner which makes it clear whose idea or work it is - even if you do it in incorrect form - that's not plagiarism."</p>

<p>The examples given indicate that the words were the student's--they do not give any indication that they were the original author's. The fact that she changed a few words around makes it seem like she was trying to disguise the fact that she was copying from the original author's work.</p>

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<p>Wow, Ryanbis, you have been very very very very differently schooled than I have or have my children.</p>

<p>My understanding of research papers: when someone, anyone, paraphrases a statement, as reported in the literature, there is potential to introduce a different meaning. Hence, when an author makes a statement, especially in a research paper, it is important to back that statement up with a quotation to support your statement and to show that you, the author who is representing someone else's research upon which you are reporting, are not making that statement on your own, but are making it based on library research that has been reported in peer reviewed articles/research papers. Your reader has got to be able to go back to the original research, as referenced, to check you, the writer's, interpretation and to assess for him/herself (the research paper's reader) that you (the research paper writer) are accurately representing the work upon which you are reporting.</p>

<p>This is the point of a quotation. Call it a reference. </p>

<p>If this student was reporting on other people's work, then she needed to use references. If it was her own research, then she needed to use references to back up her approach, and then she could report her research in her own words. </p>

<p>The only time I can understand not using quotatations, frankly, is if the student is doing some kind of creative writing.</p>

<p>If there is any representation of other, prior, work, then quotations in some form are in order.</p>

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<p>The one lurking issue here is that the student in question had classmates. If those classmates got it right, and didn't raise any plagiarism issue by how they wrote their papers, the OP's daughter has to think carefully about how to do better next time.</p>