<p>My son currently is a junior in HS and is of mixed heritage. He is predominately African American but has some Filipino, Thai and Caucasian blood as well. He currently attends a 90% or greater Caucasian public high school. The overall SAT score for his school is currently ~1670. His score is as follows: CR 770, Math 730, Writing 750 10 E (2250). He was recognized as a GATE student in the third grade and received a 1980 on the official SAT when he was in 8th grade. His GPA is strong, extracurriculars are average. Like most parents with high achievers I always had Ivy league aspirations for him. Now for my dilemma, we are planning a college tour trip in a few weeks and I asked him where and what types of colleges he wants to visit. His answer was that he wants to leverage his SAT scores/grades to try to get a full ride and he would consider small class size to be optimal. I did some research and he qualifies for Presidential Scholarships at HBCU institutions, meaning full tuition, room/board,meal plan, and in some cases $1000/year for books and a laptop. Our Income is in the $180k/ year range so financial aid is not a reliable option for us, but we are far from rich in the area where we reside. He is considering dental school but he is only 17 therefore he may change direction. Two or three of the HBCu's have accelerated dental programs that he qualifies for and seem like a great fit in terms of merit aid and class size. Question: what would you do if you we're in his shoes? Apply and possibly matriculate in Ivy League school or other top 25 institution with a parent/student loan contribution $20 to 30K/year or matriculate at an HBCU in an accelerated dental program and have zero debt until he matriculates in dental school. Please note: he and his younger sister both have a 529B accounts that can cover 2 years at a top 25 school at this time. My son stated he does not want to spend it for undergrad as he would rather save it for professional school or use it for his sister. Also, please let's not make this an affirmative action debate :). I really could use some advice it is his life, but it is a family decision overall. Thank you in advance CC'ers!</p>
<p>Your son is making the finances a high priority in his decision which is phenomenal at his age.</p>
<p>My D was in a similar situation. She got a free ride to Hampton U. but decided to go to Penn.</p>
<p>The next consideration is what is the best way to go based on his aspirations.</p>
<p>This is the reason my D chose Penn. It has the best program in the world for what she is interested in and it will give her the biggest advantage post-graduation.</p>
<p>I attended an HBCU and had classmates that went on to medical school, dental school and MIT and other elite post-grad programs.</p>
<p>In my humble opinion, your son can go either way and do just fine. His cost consciousness is very intelligent and he can find ways to enrich his learning if he finds it not stimulating enough.</p>
<p>UPenn is on our list. I bet the campus is absolutely breathtaking? Another parent just informed me that financial aid takes into account 401K contributions (adds to income calculation). If that’s the case we could be forced to bear full tuition. I’ll research that now :).</p>
<p>The amount in a 401K doesn’t affect the calculation but the amount you put into it annually is. At the income level you stated, expect very little to none from anywhere except for the merit awards your kids earn.</p>
<p>I earn less than you and pay an unreal amount for education for two kids. It’s bad. They think I can afford half my net income in tuition. Half! No regard to food, electric, transportation or housing.</p>
<p>I understand. My son does not care about prestige or bragging rights etc. if he graduated Magna Cum Laude from Harvard no one would ever know. At least it would not come from his mouth. That being said, we will continue to satisfy his wishes of searching for a full ride or close to it wish small class size. This way he can keep his 529b account intact and we can keep building the fund for professional school down the road. Thanks for your reality check on parents contribution based on income etc. it will be nice to have a chance to afford him to travel back to CA and keep money in his checking acct etc.Paying 20-30k minimum will cause us to lose the financial flexibility a free ride can provide.</p>
<p>Great topic. One concern I have had at HBCUs is that the ACT and SAT averages at SOME are very, very low. One for which I would qualify for a full ride has an average ACT of 19. Then the issue becomes, would someone with a score 10-15 points higher who has had better high school preparation be challenged at one of these schools? Madaboutx, I would be interested in your opinion on that when you/your daughter were considering Hampton (where the scores are on the higher end for HBCUs, but I imagine that still your daughter’s scores would have put her in the highest percentile).</p>
<p>Yes, I DO think you can go to an HBCU and then onto a great graduate school. But while AT the HBCU will you get the rigor and challenge you are capable of if you also were qualified to go to an Ivy or top liberal arts school?
I have the same question about going to a lower ranked college where good scores can get you a free ride…but will that free ride provide you with a challenge, academically, if you are on the highest end of the student body, academically?</p>
<p>HSG</p>
<p>We are having this discussion in our house too. With one child, the ‘free ride at an HBCU’ should be a reality (though qualifying does not mean you will get the ride).</p>
<p>That being said, only one has felt a level of comfort and kinship when they have visited HBCUs. An HBCU is a very different feel than other schools. The history, dynamics and sometimes even facilities and academics…very different. </p>
<p>If your child clicks with it and gets the full ride, if could be a great, great thing. But if they do not want to be at the school, then you have to consider whether it is worth it.
Madaboutx would you share with us why your daughter turned down the free ride at Hampton? Was it because Penn is such a good school that she could not turn it down?..because Hampton did not overly appeal to her?..because you felt she’d get a better education and connections at penn?..
Your and her analysis would be helpful as others start to consider what should be taken into account, even if the end result is not the same.
T</p>
<p>My D was accepted to Wharton and has very high ambitions in business.</p>
<p>We all felt that Wharton would give her the biggest head start in terms of where she will start, how high she can climb and what she can do. It was clearly the best and she is highly competitive so she wants to learn from the best and compete with the best.</p>
<p>For those reasons, Penn is the best choice and she isn’t worried about her ability to quickly repay any debt she may accrue as a student. It’s an investment that will pay huge returns in the future.</p>
<p>That said, if she wanted to be an elementary school teacher or social worker or philosopher, we would lean on her heavily to pursue her education for free somewhere else.</p>
<p>Also, she is very comfortable and socially adept in a very diverse atmosphere. She has no hang ups or inferiority complexes. I’ve seen some young black teens that grew up in mostly black communities and attended mostly black schools then suffer culture shock being a tiny minority in college. Even very smart kids can struggle in that new environment. An HBCU really prepares talented black youth to succeed in a predominately white environment so it may be a needed transition for some kids. I was one of those. I survived high school. Over 50% of black kids in my class graduated, the rest dropped out, got arrested, got pregnant or something else bad. At Hampton, I saw blacks leading clubs, committees and teams, becoming class president and lead actors and intellectuals. I saw a great diversity among us that inspired me. I only knew the thug side. Previously, I had few positive role models -</p>
<ul>
<li>Hampton U. stretched my vision and was exactly what I needed.</li>
</ul>
<p>My D has benefitted from all the lessons I learned and is planning to use Penn to climb a few rungs higher up the ladder. She knows I’m attempting a multi-generational project to uplift our family name and to perpetuate it into the future. My family is a third of the size it was when I was a kid. My surname is disappearing if nobody does anything about it. I see a strong and healthy faith, family and finances as the key to reinvigorating our family tree. Fertility is not enough without any moral structure around it. Getting preachy but I was asked.</p>
<p>Watchfuleye,
Also consider that most kids who start off as pre med, pre dental, etc, do not finish that way, even smart kids who can do well in the courses. If your son changes his mind about dental school, would he still be happy with his choice (Hbcu or not)?</p>
<p>I couldn’t find common data sets for any HBCU’s, but here is some data from US News (I think you need a subscription to access all their data)</p>
<p>Hampton Avg GPA 3.2, 4 year graduation rate 40%, 25-75th percentile CR 483-603, Math 480-592. Data presented in a graph form, but seems that virtually none of the class has scores in the OP’s son’s range</p>
<p>Fisk Avg GPA 2.9, 4 year grad rate 37%, 25th-75th CR 410-560, math 420-540. Same as Hampton for scores in OP’s son’s range. About 20% have scores in the 300-399 math range.
Both Hampton and Fisk have about 35% males and 65% females.</p>
<p>U Penn (since it was mentioned in the thread) Avg GPA 3.9, Avg math 726, Avg CR 704, 4 year grad rate 87%</p>
<p>Swarthmore (competitive LAC, since OP’s son is interested in small classes) 4 year grad rate 91%, Avg CR 724, Avg Math 708, range math 25th-75th 670-760, CR 680-770</p>
<p>If my kid had the OP’s stats and I had other affordable options, I’d be wary about sending him to a school with low graduation rates and where his scores would be 300 points or so above most students’.</p>
<p>In your other thread, you mentioned that you have about half the cost of an elite college put aside, so about $120,000? Can you afford anything from current income? How much in loans would you/your son be willing to take out? These are all questions that will help you as you go forward. Have you looked at merit aid outside of HBCU’s? There are probably a lot of schools where he could get some merit aid? Is he a national merit or national achievement scholar? If so, he could get substantial merit aid at University of Alabama (may be a full ride). Some privates that offer competitive merit aid include Vanderbilt, Wash U, Tulane, Duke, Boston University. Also check out Rhodes, they may offer merit also.</p>