<p>i'll repeat, i was talking about similarity between academic programs and the schools in general ... not the mentality of the student body. Stanford and Cornell are just very similar. I wont comment on the similarity of stanford and cornell student body, though. I have not transfered to Stanford or spent any prolonged time in its academic setting and have been able to compare social lifes of students there with Cornell students. It would be unfair of me to comment on something like this, just the same way in which it would be unfair for me to comment on the social life at a school like Darmouth, Yale, MIT, etc. My assumption on the surface is that Stanford is 'chill' and Cornell is more tough academics, but I have absolutely no way of verifying this. </p>
<p>the OP should realize that nobody has any right to say anything about the student bodies unless they transfered from one school to another (people like to make assumptions, I probably have in this thread as well). Everything else is just hearsay and might easily be incorrect. FountainSiren's example is pretty legit ("chill" of dartmouth and stanford), though unless you do programs at all of the other schools mentioned here then you have no right to say what schools are and aren't close. Get it? Unless, of course, you dont mind people who dont go to these schools making assumptions on them in comparison to another school that they also don't go to...</p>
<p>agree with Slipper:</p>
<p>Stanford-like Ivies: Dartmouth, Brown and I'd also add Princeton.</p>
<p>ok, i'll give in.</p>
<p>there aren't any chill students at schools like MIT, Cornell, and Columbia.</p>
<p>Columbia SEAS can feel pressure cooker intense sometimes (in terms of students' mentalities), but certainly not Columbia College.</p>
<p>Princeton -- I had a very hard time choosing between them.</p>
<p>Both schools are located in fairly quiet, affluent suburbs about an hour away from the city. As a result, both have cohesive, campus-centered cultures (unlike UPenn and Columbia). Students are brilliant but most are generally not very intense and high-strung (unlike those of Harvard and Cornell). Because Princeton is very undergraduate-centered (there are twice as many undergrads as grads, unlike Stanford, where it's roughly 50:50) the student body is very collaborative and the undergraduate student government has a lot of influence. Academically, both schools are known for their strength in science and engineering, and the engineering school is not separated from the arts either socially or institutionally (Columbia, Cornell, and UPenn separate the schools, though they do have interdisciplinary programs.) They're also strong in humanities -- both schools have notable introductory humanities tracks (IHUM for Stanford and the humanities sequence for Princeton). Both are strong in pre-law preparation and creative writing. If Princeton's perceived preppy stereotype is a problem, apparently there are probably more popped collars at Stanford than there are at Princeton (according to my Stanford friends.)</p>
<p>Oh, and if I may add -- in terms of weather, Stanford is the clear winner, but Princeton's winter is much milder than the Boston/Cambridge, Hanover, or Providence winters.</p>
<p>Thank you all for your input. </p>
<p>gomestar, I agree that Cornell is probably the most like Stanford overall. But in terms of the student attitude and collaborative atmosphere, it seems like Brown, Dartmouth and Princeton. It's interesting that most think MIT fits in that category also. Of course I'm not really sure he has a shot at any of these, but it's good to explore the options.</p>
<p>This has been very helpful.</p>
<p>dad4son - about the collaborative atmosphere thing - the general notion about schools like stanford, brown, princeton is indeed a 'collaborative' atmosphere, but trust me, there will be cut-throat students here and there. Schools like Cornell and MIT are known to be more difficult work wise and I guess historically the student body isn't known to be described as 'collaborative,' but I am 100% positive that there will be collaborative-minded people as well. You son wont be befriending a student body, just those who he wants to befriend and can find very friendly and collaborative students at places like Cornell and MIT. I know there is a bit of a stigma going on about schools like these and how they're cut throat, but please take everything with a grain of salt. Last year, it was routine for me to have a study group for each different class. It was a nice surprise from what i've come to expect from a school like Cornell. </p>
<p>My suggestion is to do a visit on campus and to take a tour. You'll be able to talk to various students (worst comes to worst, just find me!) and here you can develop an opinon for yourself, rather than just basing it on what other people think. Do the same for Dartmouth, Princeton, and Brown if at all possible.</p>
<p>Cornell did indirectly help Stanford get its start:</p>
<p>
[quote]
President Andrew D. White of Cornell gave to the Stanfords, who earlier had tried to recruit him as the university's first president
[/quote]
</p>
<p><a href="http://www.stanford.edu/home/stanford/history/begin.html#Birth%5B/url%5D">http://www.stanford.edu/home/stanford/history/begin.html#Birth</a></p>
<p>Many of Stanford's first professors were lured away from Cornell as well.</p>
<p>As for Cornell's current atmosphere - definately go visit. You will find that it is "duck like", "chill" and "collaborative". Furthermore its bredth of offerings is hard to match.</p>
<p>Not sure where the stereotype for Brown and Dartmouth being more laid back comes from...perhaps its just wishful thinking or maybe mad jealousy...</p>
<p>I seriously doubt you could site any info on Dartmouth that does not explicitly mention the laid-back, chill, nature of Dartmouth.</p>
<p>Princeton Review, Kaplan etc
</p>
<p>Not to mention the students who have attended Dartmouth, either as students, transfers or guests
perhaps it is because we do not have a well suited bridge to lure students into leaping off, as Cornell does, but I'd rather think it is simply the kind of student Dartmouth attracts...all chill.</p>
<p>I doubt you could cite anything that calls Cornell students cut-throat, uncooperative, and suicidal. "Cut-throat" is often what I hear outsiders call Cornell, but I've never heard it mentioned from a student. </p>
<p>Also, I'm pretty sure the suicide rate at Dartmouth is about the same as at Cornell. Unless, of course, Dartmouth's suicide rate is well below that of the national average for college students (where Cornell is at). From my understanding though, all of the Ivy's are about the same in this regard. </p>
<p>Cornell is a very chill place, no doubt. </p>
<p>If you'll excuse me, I have a friend's history notebook that I need to alter some of the dates to ensure my success and his failure...</p>
<p>It is a mistake to label an entire study body, especially one as large as Cornell, as one thing or another. The attractive thing about a larger student body is that there is a mix of different types of students and anyone can find his or her like-minded friends/class-mates. So while there are competitive kids at Cornell (as well as Stanford, Princeton, Darmouth, Harvard, MIT, etc. -- I know some who are currently at Harvard and MIT) there are many many that are not. </p>
<p>For what it is worth, Cornell also has many more undergraduates than graduates (about twice as many).</p>
<p>I just don't think people understand. Spend a week at Brown, Stanford, or Dartmouth and you'll get a very different vibe than most other schools. People are brilliant but they are absolutely humble about it. It was for me absolutely refreshing, but its not for everyone. Having been to two Ivies, I cannot emphasize enough how different they are in this way. When I went to the latest reunion (not my classes but the year older) I barely talked about what job I had, but rather spent much more time just 'playing.'</p>
<p>
[quote]
I barely talked about what job I had
[/quote]
I bet that was hard for you! :)</p>
<p>
[quote]
spent much more time just 'playing.'
[/quote]
sounds like every reunion I've ever been to</p>
<p>I guess I don't understand the whole chill thing. Being self absorbed about being chill just doesn't sound chill. Is one still chill when they are desperately trying to be chill? Or is someone chill when the are simply enjoying the gorgeous waterfalls flowing through the middle of campus?</p>
<p>Slipper1234, I don't get what's so wrong to talk about one's job at a reunion...
How is that a point to be proud of? (Not saying it's something to be ashamed of either...I just don't see the point.)</p>
<p>The point is it wasn't all about one-upping each other, it was just about being who we were at the core and having fun. Sure there was a little 'this is what I'm up to" but unlike my high school reunion, MBA reunion, and the reunion of the college I left it was just so much more "laid back" and fun.</p>
<p>Um, I always thought Princeton and Stanford were similar in spirit. Location - both in a suburb, a wealthy one at that. Both with beautiful campuses, although v. different styles. Both within an hour of top US cities. Both very fond of their technical/engineering people, both very fond of their athletes, although Stanford is clearly an entirely different caliber:). Both more apt to attract kids who are more laid back on the surface than HYM.</p>
<p>"Spend a week at Brown, Stanford, or Dartmouth and you'll get a very different vibe than most other schools."</p>
<p>I spent 3 days at brown with a friend when I was a freshman and I guess the campus was pretty 'chill' ... there was nobody around!!! The campus was dead, it was really weird. I guess everybody was "chilling" and getting high with my friend. I took off to some good restaurants, that huge mall downtown, then visited Newport while I was at it. This was just my experience, though. Didn't like it, thought it was boring, but i'm sure there's plenty of others who think otherwise. </p>
<p>Also, odyssey's point about not labeling a student body of 13,000 undergraduates is spot-on.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Or is someone chill when the are simply enjoying the gorgeous waterfalls flowing through the middle of campus?
[/quote]
Well, that would depend on whether or not they were watching it fall, or themselves falling. : )</p>
<p>As to chill and the Ivy league, I would say the following words of wisdom may help the prospective student navigate the levels of chill either entering Cornell, or enduring it while ensconced there.
It has been said, repeatedly: "Cornell is the easiest Ivy to get into and the hardest to get out of." I take that to mean it is something other than "chill." You can google these words of wisdom here: <a href="http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&rls=GWYA%2CGWYA%3A2005-08%2CGWYA%3Aen&q=%22easiest+Ivy+to+get+into+and+the+hardest+to+get+out+of%22%5B/url%5D">http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&rls=GWYA%2CGWYA%3A2005-08%2CGWYA%3Aen&q=%22easiest+Ivy+to+get+into+and+the+hardest+to+get+out+of%22</a> ) </p>
<p>So it might be that one can chill during the application process; after that, it seems the climate may become somewhat intemperate.</p>
<p>By the way, I think Cornell is a great, non-chill, school! Not everyone is the same--many will prefer the atmosphere of Cornell or MIT--some won't.</p>