I think I’ve narrowed it down between Hopkins and Cornell. I’m planning on being a pre-med and majoring in neuroscience or biology. I’d appreciate any input! Thanks!
Cornell all the way!
I’ve heard good and bad things about both schools (bad being in terms of academic rigor, for those who don’t necessarily thrive off of being busy). Baltimore is a great place for people interested in social justice, activism, education, public health, etc. It’s also a great place for people to get involved in research. There’s, of course, a large premed community, so there are a wealth of resources available in terms of advising and speakers (for example, the U.S. Surgeon General is coming to campus to speak today). I guess it depends what you’re interested, but I can only talk about Hopkins.
As a Neuroscience major who graduated from Hopkins I have only the best things to say about the program. Much of the stuff I will praise the program for:
- Accessible faculty who are almost entirely world-class researchers that are passionate about the content they are teaching (since they've spent their lives studying it)
- Flexible coursework (there are three concentrations you can focus on: Cellular/Molecular, Systems or Cognitive: http://krieger.jhu.edu/neuroscience/academics/requirements/)
- New facilities
- Teaching practicums (http://krieger.jhu.edu/neuroscience/academics/practicums/)
- 3rd most popular major (plenty of camaraderie and testament to the program's many strengths and its resources)
- Program-oriented outreach (NRP, the undergraduate neuroscience service society organizes tons of outreach on campus and in the community, which offers students great experiences to interact with the city, share your knowledge and boost that resume)
But more importantly than that is the sheer amount of research opportunities you will have access to. Everyone says they have research, but honestly, only large state schools and a few notables like Hopkins, MIT, Caltech, Stanford, Harvard, Duke, UPenn are the true research giants. Additionally, Hopkins has a small undergraduate size (which means you don’t have to compete for limited research opportunities, unlike students at many state schools), has the NIH headquartered in Bethesda right next door (which means they have many labs in Baltimore you can research at, as I did), and the school spends almost 50% more on annual research than the next highest school (http://www.bestcolleges.com/features/colleges-with-highest-research-and-development-expenditures/). I’ve come to learn that if you want to analyze any organization you simply follow the money. Money doesn’t lie and it shows the organization’s priorities. Hopkins is spending so much more than any other school on research, and I can attest that these opportunities are ripe for the picking for undergrads. The Neuroscience major requires independent research for its majors and so the undergrad program works diligently so that there are ample opportunities for research (not that I needed their help in finding research, but it was there).
Why does research matter? For science majors in general, research provides you the skill set to have marketable skills when you leave school. The market is inundated with science majors and unless you plan on going to graduate school to learn a skill set (like Ph.D or MD, etc.) it’s the science majors with undergrad research experiences in labs that have the skills and the industry connections to get the jobs. Even if you are planning on medial school, etc. meaningful research experiences are a huge leg-up on the competition. Coursework is also easier and more enjoyable when you see the application of the content you are learning in class. Specifically for neuroscience, a field growing rapidly and constantly changing, being around and participating in groundbreaking research is absolutely thrilling. In my opinion, for any school to have a strong neuroscience program it must have a strong research program. Neuroscience is debatably a fifty year-old field (if not younger), and active research is dramatically redefining what we know all the time. I only had three textbooks for all my neuroscience coursework since all of the classes were based on research papers and Powerpoint/lectures designed mostly by the faculty-researchers who are at the forefront of the research for the given topic. This is because the information in textbooks was often wrong or too vague by the time it’s edited and published. Furthermore, the skill set of reading a research paper and critically analyzing it on its merits, faults and value is essential for any science major. Basically, research experience and studying/discussing neuroscience from a research (rather than textbook) perspective is essential for a quality neuroscience education, and Hopkins does these things extremely well.
Some other general thoughts comparing the schools:
- Cornell has more than double the amount of undergrads than Hopkins, which is good for extracurriculars (more likely to find other people interested in starting a Star Wars Fan Club) but bad for research (more competition for limited resources, but that also depends on the breakdown of undergrads as science majors, etc. which I glimpsed at and Hopkins has slightly more but not to offset the difference in undergrad size)
- Cornell is in a rural area in a small college town (Ithaca w/ 30,000 residents) versus Hopkins, which is in a major U.S. City (Baltimore w/ 650,000 residents). Where do you want to live? Proximity to family? Opportunities for public outreach (as @OnMyWay2013 mentioned)?
- Climate: Baltimore TYPICALLY gets little to no snow with average warmer temperatures and more humidity in the summer.
- Greek life? Athletics? Safety (I've posted on this before)? Social Life outside of school? (there are plenty of posts about this factor, and NO, we are NOT cutthroat). These matter to some people (hopefully safety and social life matters, lol). Let me know if you want my perspective on Hopkins for these things.
- Tuition and associated expenses (travel, living costs) are nothing to overlook, and both of these are expensive schools.
- Premed support: If you are indeed premed then this should matter a lot to you. Hopkins has the highest per capita medical school applicants each year (last I checked), which can be good (faculty and advising staff know what they are doing and advise well) and can be bad (there are many students applying to med school with a Hopkins degree, though a smaller absolute value of applicants than other larger schools like Berkley, UCLA, etc.). Both schools offer a committee letter for medical school, which probably means nothing to you now, but is a huge benefit come application time.
Both schools are awesome and I am by no means bashing on Cornell, but if the last few factors I listed aren’t overwhelming deal breakers for one school or the other then I would definitely go with Hopkins. Cornell fans please chime in and balance me out, but what I do know for sure is that the research spending difference is overwhelming and the importance of research for any undergrad science major is clear to me. That alone (besides everything else I’ve said) is why I chose Hopkins and would choose it again.
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Thank you @OnMyWay2013 and @NixonDenier for your posts!
Since you guys are/were JHU students, I have a few questions for you:
I’ve heard Hopkins lacks school pride. Is this something I should be concerned about?
How’s the food?
Hopkins recommends a gap year between undergrad and medical school. But say if I didn’t want to take a gap year… would the JHU pre-med advisory committee view that negatively?
(Of course I might change my mind once I get to that point, but I’m just speculating.)
Did any of you take part in the greek life at Hopkins? Would you recommend it? From what I’ve heard, you have to seek out a social life.
Is going outside of campus/ exploring Baltimore safe?
Again, thank you very much for your help. I greatly appreciate it.
- Is school pride something that's important to you? I don't think Hopkins is lacking in camaraderie, and there are plenty of events like Spring Fair and Lighting of the Quads that instill a sense of community. As Hopkins students, many of us are proud of Hopkins students' resilience, passion, intellectual achievements, and commitment to service, and these things are definitely celebrated both in the student body and by the administration. I think most people here are proud to be Hopkins students, even if they have a love-hate relationship with the school; I definitely am. But it isn't so much a pep-rally, wearing-blue-and-black/gold-and-black, sports-oriented kind of school pride. I didn't really care about "school pride" in high school, and I don't really see why it's important in a college either, lol, as long as that community is there.
- I like the food, though my diet doesn't have much variety, and I don't eat on campus as often as underclassmen do. There's a lot of variety, especially if you're eating vegetarian, vegan, Kosher, or gluten-free. And every few months, there's a Sterling brunch that has really nice gourmet food (like shrimp cocktails kind of gourmet). I do think people tend to get tired of certain dining halls, but there are a number of them, as well as restaurants nearby (Chipotle, Subway, Pizza Studio are big), so it shouldn't be impossible to find food you like.
- Lol, no, there are many students who apply without taking a gap year. I don't know what kind of negative thing not taking a gap year would say about you.
- No, nothing to do with Greek life. My friend group and student groups provide enough social life for me. My past roommate and current roommate, and many of my friends, are in sororities, and they seem to like it a lot. I don't know many people in frats, but again, I don't think people regret joining. I would say that sororities don't do serious hazing, but frats do (though they say they don't). I don't know much about it, but I think it's more do-things-in-public hazing than hazing that will actually hurt you (though I think drinking-related-hazing is a thing). So that's something to consider. If you can make friends and are capable of walking to frat parties, social life (by which I'm assuming you mean "party scene") isn't very far away.
- Yes, particularly if you go with friends and don't stay out too late. There are plenty of security guards concentrated on, like, a five-block radius around the school. I haven't had trouble walking within this region, even at 2 AM to my house a few blocks beyond the perimeter of security being a petite female (though north of campus is arguably a little less risky than south of campus). Just use common sense, people will say.
@heytherehey I’m not a current student, but I’ve been admitted and took a recruiting trip for a couple days. I would say that the food at hopkins is pretty amazing. I think they are ranked 3rd or so for best food. At the one dining hall I always ate at, the food was buffet style. However, unlike most other colleges, they don’t offer a ton of options that are subpar; instead, they offer only a few options that are really really good. Additionally, they have a ton of healthy options, like plain grilled chicken and fresh vegetables. Also, you can eat ice cream for breakfast, and they provide containers if you want to bring food back to your room.
@vrhou98 True, but for those who’ve been on organized trips such as SOHOP, they deliver their best-quality food for the incoming freshmen and their families. So don’t be surprised if it’s not consistently at the same level as when you came. But ice cream for breakfast, yeah, that’s pretty cool, lol. They have a lot of unconventional flavors too, like Honey Graham Cracker and Blue Jay Batter.
As usual, @OnMyWay2013 and I are on the same page with most things but I’ll expand on a few things too:
- When I think of school pride I picture large sporting events, since that's probably the most common reason why large segments of the student body get together and have fun (otherwise you're probably all taking a biochemistry test - also fun). As you probably know, Hopkins has a Division I lacrosse team which consistently is in the top 5, and there are many avid fans of the sport at our school. I was from CA and lacrosse is not nearly as big on the West Coast but I grew into the sport with the sheer amount of energy, fast pace and sometimes brutality that is permitted on the field. I also knew a few of the members on the team who were largely down to earth, hardworking and friendly people. That being said, while the school does have all the standard collegiate sports (basketball, football, swimming, baseball, etc.) you will definitely not be getting the USC college football experience of 50,000 fans in a crowded stadium with beer-soaked tailgates, etc. That's just not Hopkins. Attendance to sporting events other than lacrosse is normally low, but the Homecoming game (a lacrosse game, of course), and a few of the big match games (like with Towson, Maryland, Rutgers, Princeton) is when you do fill the stands with Hopkins students painting their faces, banging thunder sticks, etc. So I think the sporting culture is there occasionally, but nowhere at the same magnitude. For me, this was all I needed: a few occasions to try it out and check the box off my college bucket list and then (after my migraine subsided) returning to the books.
That being said, there are many other events during the year where students get together and do have fun including the many of the Greek Life events (fundraisers, volunteer opportunities, Dorm Wars), large cultural events like Diwali and Holi, and school-sponsored concerts and events like Spring Fair and President’s Day of Service. Some of these larger events consistently are drawing upwards of a thousand or more students, which is about 1/6 of the undergrad population and definitely created, in my mind, a strong sense of community. Beyond that students are normally very proud of the school which is consistently in the news for scientific breakthroughs and humanitarian efforts. More recently, there has been more of a focus on Hopkins giving back to and supporting Baltimore with over a billion dollars pledged in support for local projects, local hiring programs, etc just in the past few years, which in my mind is one of the first things I brag about with this school.
- As for food, Hopkins has improved drastically over the last 15 years. I remember hearing horror stories when I was a freshman about food quality, sanitation and options and that apparently the school was called out in an expose in the early 2000s resulting in a complete overhaul and new vendor contract (Bon Appetite, considered one of the best). The results have been a huge improvement in quality and variety as well as upgrades in facilities and a focus on locally grown, organic foods as well as vegan and gluten-free options. Nonetheless, while Hopkins now does appear on ranked lists for some of the best cafeteria food (US News #9: http://college.usatoday.com/2015/04/28/36-of-the-best-college-dining-halls-in-the-u-s/ and The Daily Meal #3:http://www.thedailymeal.com/eat/75-best-colleges-food-america-2015/slide-74 ) That being said people will still complain because that's what people do. It doesn't matter how creative you get with your Taco Tuesday or Fajita Friday, people will get tired of the food since vendors do have limited numbers of suppliers and chefs only have so many recipes they can feasibly cook in huge batches. Rest assured though, the on-campus dining is more than adequate (even for the vegan, locally-grown freedom fighters) and off-campus dining continues to improve as more retail spaces open up and more options become available. As a side note, the quality and variety of restaurants throughout Baltimore truly surprised me given the city's relatively small size (it's no NYC or LA) and limited diversity. I still remember the great sushi, Indian, Korean, and Vietnamese foods I found in Baltimore, and I grew up in Los Angeles where I definitely developed an appreciation for quality Asian food.
- Few people plan for a gap year but it is happening more and more due to growing competition for medical school. Even if you're a competitive applicant, once you realize the difficulty of working on applications, studying for the MCAT, and completing interviews across the country all while in school with homework and exams... many reconsider. Students almost always have the epiphany of "wait, why am I rushing through this? Shouldn't I take a break before I do another four years of medical school and then jump right into residency?" Nonetheless, plenty of students start medical school two to three months after graduating (God that sounds exhausting even to write, in my opinion) and the premed committee has no preference in general (though they may recommend a gap year on a case-by-case basis).
- Greek life is a healthy balance at Hopkins. With 25% or so of the student body in sororities/fraternities I think the Greek life is large enough to be productive and organize quality events like Dorm Wars, parties, etc. without being so large that you feel pressured to join a chapter just to make friends. My favorite part though is that at the end of the day most Hopkins kids really are nerds who love to learn and do amazing things so even when I found myself at a frat party (I never pledged, but I did occasionally partake in the revelry) people were friendly, intelligent and inviting (there are a few frats that keep this facade of exclusiveness and that changes year to year based on the students running the house, hem hem, the unrecognized St. Elmos).
Most colleges across America have been cracking down on the hazing culture and the frat party culture due to longstanding concerns and incidents of date rape, alcohol and drug abuse, etc. A recent documentary called The Hunting Ground (now on Netflix!) shows the coverup of this issue at some of America’s greatest institutions, and while Hopkins has dodged much of the limelight on this unfortunate issue, it is definitely a culture that has reared it’s ugly head with incidents in the past, but nowhere near as common (I hope) and quietly condoned than at other big name, elite schools.
- To address some of the same JHU stereotypes that come up again and again: Yes, we have social lives. I had a social life at JHU, my friends had social lives...people have social lives. We're human beings who by nature form societies and socialize. No, the nightlife directly around the campus is not as great as Ithaca's, but Baltimore is a major metropolitan center with over 600,000 people and the downtown is less than 3 miles from the Homewood campus. There is a growing Hipster influence in close proximity to the campus (which has since added countless brunch locations, "Communist" bookstores and coffee shops) and a large underground music and art scene, especially around Fells Point, Fed Hill and Mount Vernon. I had plenty of fun with friends eating at great restaurants, singing karaoke, going to bars and 18+ / 21+ clubs, salsa dancing in the Latin Palace, exploring the odd shops in Hampden, going to museums, etc. The Hopkins students who complain they couldn't find anything were the ones who wouldn't venture more than three blocks to explore. I assure you, in a city that big, when there's a will (like taking a 10-minute free school-operated bus ride) there's a way. Plus, with the city circulator extending its routes to the Homewood Campus you can go just about anywhere in the downtown for free (previously we would have to take multiple buses, taxi, or walk). What I also didn't know at the time I applied was just how many other colleges are in the Baltimore area (12!) so there are many other young people roaming Baltimore's nightlife if you know where to go. More importantly, Hopkins is continuing to improve the infrastructure around the campus to invite more businesses (shops, restaurants, boutiques) to the Charles Village neighborhood, so things are always improving. All in all, don't base such an important decision on this "no social life" rubbish, it's not true, and honestly, if your intentions are to go to a competitive school to earn a stellar education, you're not going out every night to party anyway. As a side note, I'm a guy, so my experiences walking around the city at night with friends might be different than a 110 lb female's experience.
I’ve posted on safety in general at Hopkins/Baltimore before which should put your mind (and normally its your parents’ minds) at ease:
@OnMyWay2013 I actually went during the fall as a recruiting trip for an athletic team, so I don’t think they made a special occasion for me.
OH SNAP!
Lol, you got me. My statement still stands for those who went to organized events such as SOHOP. The point is it’s not consistent depending on who’s there and how close it is to a school break. Not drastically, but noticeably, IMO.
JHU is ranked higher (it’s in the top ten). The choice is clear here