Life Sciences Graduate Admissions Advice

Graduate School
1

<p>Hey guys, I'm Steven and I'm in need of advice regarding my graduate application.</p>

<p>Before I dive into my situation I'd like to throw a disclaimer out there: The reason why I'm seeking advice from this forum is because I've been getting a lot of inconsistent advice from a range of sources, e.g. professors, the interwebs, grad school advisors, etc. regarding the viability of my graduate school application. Thus, since I've come to realize that everyone I speak with concerning my grad application typically has at least one good little nugget of advice I reasoned that it might be advantageous for me to solicit the opinion of as many people as possible. Hence, my posting of this new thread. Okay, let's get into it...</p>

<p>I'm a Senior at Texas State University with a dual major in biochemistry and microbiology and I've been planning on going to graduate school for several years now. Ideally, I would like to get into the Pharmaceutics programs (pharmaceutics, NOT pharmacy...big difference) at UT Austin or Northeastern in Boston. Also, if those fall through then I wouldn't mind getting into the Human Genetics program at Pitt. I have selected these schools specifically for the projects that individual professors at each school is working on. I'd like to work under any one of these three profs and have them as my grad mentor/thesis advisor.</p>

<p>Now that I've detailed where I would like to go and why (albeit, I've yet to specifically detail what the projects are and the names of the profs for the sake of saving time), I'll detail what is troubling me. Here's my qualifications:</p>

<p>Dual-Major in Biochem and Microbio
Current Undergrad GPA - 2.57
GRE - TBD (taking it soon, but not sure when exactly)
Research Experience - 2 Academic Years (4 semesters under the same prof)
Senior most tenured member of my research lab, trained grad students and new members
1 poster presentation on my original research and another poster I co-authored
No publications
Awards and ECs - Ina Brudnick Award and Scholarship Recipient
- 4 Congressional Letters of Commendation
- Front page cover story of me on the school newspaper</p>

<p>Can get 3 Letters of Rec when needed (2 of 3 are guaranteed to be strong, the other one has me worried)</p>

<p>Now, thus far I consider my qualifications to be good but not great with the exceptions being my sub par GPA, no GRE, the one potentially sketchy LoR, and no journal publications. I have between 1 and 2 more years left until I graduate, it is taking me longer than most undergrads b/c of the dual major. Does anyone have any advice as to how I could go about improving my chances of getting into the programs I've picked? I've already spoken with the profs at Northeastern and Pitt to try to familiarize them with me. I haven't spoken to the one at UT. Coincidentally, the prof at UT is the husband of the prof I'm doing research for right now. Crazy. This can be good and bad, my research prof doesn't give me a lot of feedback regarding my performance in lab even though I ask so it's hard for me to tell if she's going to give me a good LoR or not.</p>

<p>Honestly, I'm of the opinion that if I get a decent GRE score, say, over 1200, then I may have a shot at getting in if I continue to do research and pick up some more ECs. Most importantly, however, is my low GPA and my awareness of the fact that it may be detrimental to my cause. Quickly, I'll say that the reason why I want to work with the profs at Pitt and Northeastern is because they're doing some research on Inflammatory Bowel Disease. I got Ulcerative Colitis when I was 19 and had surgery to get my condition "fixed" when I was 21, so there were a good 2 years where I was severely ill but couldn't afford to miss school and my GPA took a hit. Actually, that award I won was because of my story about my illness I submitted. Thus, I've been trying to find a way to explain why my GPA is low, because I was sick, without making it seem like some kind of excuse in my SoP. That's pretty much the sum of my situation.</p>

<p>Well, thanks for taking the time to read this post, I look forward to hearing from everyone. Any and all advice will be thoroughly appreciated! Thanks again!</p>

2

<p>Almost all programs have a GPA threshold of 3.0. You should probably e-mail some admissions departments to see how they feel about exceptions for medical reasons.</p>

3

<p>Yeah, I’ve noticed that about most of the programs I’ve looked at through the years. From what I’ve heard, some schools may actually let you into their PhD programs if your gpa is just below 3.0 depending on how the rest of your application looks, however, this seems to be fairly rare. My hunch is that when something such as that does happen the prof that the student wants to work with really wants to get that student and may have some pull with the adcomm, otherwise I guess it can be attributed to other stellar features on their app. Either way, I’m not going to hold my breath and hope for this to happen for me, ultimately I need to get the gpa up in this last year I have.</p>

4

<p>It’s really kind of pointless to ask what your shot is before you even take the GRE. Nobody can tell you until you take it. I’m surprised the people you said you have already asked haven’t told you that also. We could tell you if your GPA was higher and your ECs were better, but a lot will be riding on your GRE.</p>

<p>“No publications”</p>

<p>Hmm, that could have really helped, but now it may hinder you even more.</p>

5

<p>All of the individuals I’ve spoken with about my grad application have told me that I need to take the GRE, everyone has to take the GRE. After I take it it will give me a better indication of where I’ll stand. I will be taking it soon, also.</p>

<p>As for me listing “No Publications”, well, I’m still working in lab and doing research so I still have time to get one under my belt hopefully before I graduate. At the very least maybe I’ll be listed as a co-author which would be great. I mean, for an undergrad to have their name listed as an author, co-author, or even in the acknowledgments section of a journal pub is great. From what I hear it gives your application a substantial boost.</p>

6

<p>well, it does no harm to try but you have to realize that the gpa will severly impact your chances. if i were you i would apply with an explanation of the gpa- but then get set for doing something to beef up my background. the standards would be to get a research masters and/or do a couple years of research experience after you graduate. this way you would also not need to rely on a lor from an iffy source.
good luck.</p>

7

<p>I agree with the general sentiment of the previous posters. Good research experience, good focus, bad grades. You shouldn’t feel bad for your lack of a publication, that is pretty unusual for undergrads to have anyway.</p>

<p>I would suggest you form relationships with the professors you are interested in working with as they may be able to shepherd your application though the grad school bureaucracy that demands a 3.0 to apply. I would encourage you to share your GPA with them before it comes time to apply so that it isn’t some shocker when the grad school refuses to pass the app to the department.</p>

<p>Since you seem pretty aware of the limitations of your application, I am a bit surprised that you aren’t hedging your bets by applying to a few more places. IBD isn’t an unknown research topic. I took a look at funding opportunities for IBD research and found a dozen grants that have been funded just in the last year [Grants</a> Funded in 2009 - Broad Foundation Scientific | Medical Research](<a href=“http://www.broadmedical.org/funding/funded_grants/2009.html]Grants”>http://www.broadmedical.org/funding/funded_grants/2009.html)
In addition, you might want to take a look at Immunology and Rheumatology departments as well. Also, a number of grad schools have socalled Med to Grad programs that allow students to pursue translational research in a way that wouldn’t necessarily require a specific lab studying IBD (It would require a clinical co-mentor in the gastroenterology division and a research mentor studying inflammation/autoimmunity)</p>

8

<p>That GPA is going to be tough to overcome. Do you have a strong upward trend? What is your GPA in your major? </p>

<p>You might want to look into working at NIH, either as a summer intern or as a postbac researcher. Such a position would potentially yield that elusive third LOR, plus give your research experience more weight. Although you cannot erase your grades, you can make other parts of your application much more attractive.</p>

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<p>Hey guys I just want to say thanks again for the advice. </p>

<p>belevitt, I posted a rather detailed response to your post but for some reason it didn’t get up on the board. That’s frustrating. Anyway, basically my response was that the reason why there are only three or so programs I’m focused on is because of the nature of their research. They’re researching the genetics of IBD as well as gene therapy as a means of treating these conditions. I’m of the impression that a thorough understanding of the genetic component of IBD is crucial to learning how to best attack these conditions. I’m also a strong advocate for the exploration of gene therapy as a means of providing a potent treatment not just for IBD, but for many other conditions as well. I’m set on going to grad school with a specific purpose, I’m not going to be grateful just for getting in to any program. If I go then I’m not going to waste my time working on something that I won’t find to be promising or academically fulfilling.</p>

<p>I have looked into grad student research grants for the study of IBD and I have found them to be fairly abundant. I think it certainly would be advantageous for me to bring money to the table to these schools I’m wanting to research at, however, I’m not sure that I’ll receive funding for a project in the form of a federal or private grant if I’m not yet a student at a particular school. When I do look further into that question I’ll know for sure. Once again, I think it would be huge if when I applied I mentioned that I had secured funding for my own work that way a prof wouldn’t have to bother budgeting for another student.</p>

<p>As for conducting a summer internship at the NIH, I believe that one of the prereqs for admittance is a 3.0 gpa. I’m not certain, but seeing as the NIH is a federal program I’m confident that they admit 3.0 students only.</p>

<p>Momwaitingfornew, I do not have a strong upward trend in my GPA. My major GPA for biochem is 2.37 and for microbiology it is 2.70. Right now, these numbers are dragging me down. Therefore, I’ve developed a plan to combat this situation.</p>

<p>I’ve heard that many grad programs look for upward trends if their applicants have GPAs that were initially low, particularly they look at the last 60 hours of coursework. Now, my microbio GPA can possibly be raised to 3.0 because I have to retake a bio class I got a D in and I also have 3 other bio classes to take before I can graduate with that degree. My biochem degree may be harder to improve, but I do still have 8 or so more classes to take. Raising my biochem GPA will be tough with these advanced biochem classes but it can be done.</p>

<p>I’m being as realistic as possible when I’m examining my situation. I’m actually not bad at chemistry or biology, I think I’m pretty good at these subject despite my grades. On top of being sick (which prevented me from studying many times) I’m also a poor test taker. I don’t know why that is, I just am. I get A’s in lab, papers, homework, and quizzes but I just suck at taking tests. Unfortunately, tests represent the majority of the course grade. Despite my attempts at explaining my low GPA I do acknowledge that these will likely be perceived as excuses by grad committees, therefore I just need to suck it up, cut the ******** and work harder. Then, maybe, I’ll get a decent shot.</p>

<p>Meanwhile, if I don’t get into these PhD programs I am also going to apply to the Masters program at my school. With any luck that will go well, my GPA will be good and when I reapply perhaps the PdD adcomms will look at my Masters GPA and look past my undergrad GPA. Thanks again guys! Any other advice, tips, etc.? :)</p>

10

<p>SW1232,</p>

<p>I recommend that you take time off before you apply. Check out the NIH IRTA program. To my knowledge they dont have an official GPA cut off (~1/2 post bacs have something hurting their app like GPA). I know post bacs with low GPAs, but I have not seen that low of a GPA. A lot of the PIs have their own GPA cut off, but some may care less. You will need to email 30+ people to probably find a placement.</p>

<p>In regards to grad apps, you need a high GRE score, 3+strong letters of rec, and strong senior grades. Taking time off will allow you to focus on raising your senior grades (you should not apply this year since you will miss tons of school). You need 3+ strong letters of rec, and taking time off will allow you to gain this letter. The opportunity to publish (is possible especially if you stay 2 yrs). Knowing a scientist in another circle can help with admissions. Admissions committees often agree to interview students of PIs they know (I witnessed this first hand). NIH is also a good conversation starter for a lot of PIs. If you are a bad test taker, I would not worry about the GRE until you graduate and have ample time to prepare.</p>

<p>If you are sure you want a PhD, I would not go the masters route. Apply 1-2 yrs before you go that route, unless you are unsure about a PhD. I think working a year (and taking classes on the side), will provide just as much creditability to your app and it wont cost you anything. Good luck!</p>

11

<p>Hey mtlve,</p>

<p>I have been thinking as of late that it might not be such a bad idea to hold off on applying to grad school. I have a question and I hope I don’t sound too ridiculous for asking this but what is a “PI”? Are you referring to a “Private Institution”? Sorry if asking this seems really lame, I’ve just never heard of that acronym unless it’s in reference to a private investigator, and obviously that’s not what you’re referring to lol.</p>

<p>I’ll go ahead and check out that NIH IRTA program and see what it’s all about. That’s something else that I haven’t heard of before. Wow, I thought that I had a good idea of what’s out there in terms of grad school and post bac opportunities but it seems as though I had yet to scratch the surface. All of this new information definitely warrants thorough inspection.</p>

<p>I got a message an individual who recommended I see what’s out there in terms of just being a lab tech for a university lab. Apparently, they’ve gone this route and it’s worked out well for them. If I were too look into that and land a position at a lab I’d like working at then I think that having experience there, working directly with a prof, would potentially be a better fit for me seeing as I could essentially skip the whole graduate application process where I’ll be taking shots in the dark and maybe get into the program I’m working at based in merit rather than GPA and test scores. Even if I weren’t to get into that program (which I would like my chances if my work is good), then at the very least I would have credible lab experience.</p>

<p>I do think that nixing the Masters program route could pay off. Unless I were to get into a PhD program I liked and they accepted me on a conditional basis, i.e. if you don’t keep your GPA above 3.0 then you’re going to be placed in the terminal Master’s program. Then again I wouldn’t want to work my tail off only to be denied entry into the PhD program because of one bad semester, you know?</p>

<p>Alright guys, I’m going to keep looking at these options that have been presented. Keep the advice coming. Thanks again!</p>

12

<p>PI seems to be referring here to “Professor of Interest”, meaning a professor you would like to work with. In addition it can refer to Perimeter Institute, a theoretical physics research center in Canada.</p>

13

<p>Hmm, you may be right but I’m not sure. I thought that they may have been referring to “Principal Investigator”, but I could be wrong. Thanks for the suggestion! :)</p>

14

<p>Oh yes, I was also going to ask if anyone on this thread has any knowledge about post-bacc programs and whether I should consider applying for some to essentially “prove myself”. I wouldn’t mind being in a post-bacc program for a year or so, taking classes and getting more research experience. Although, post-bacc programs seem to be similar to having a lab technician position at the same university. With a lab tech post from what I’ve read you can sometimes take free classes (no tuition like with a post bacc) and get research experience and possibly get pubs (may or may not get to do that with a post bacc). The research experience seems to be beneficial in the sense that it’ll give you a chance to get close to your research prof and have him/her pull for you when you decide to apply to a grad program. Any thoughts?</p>

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<p>PI = principal investigator :)</p>

<p>It’s NIH-speak for the faculty member in charge of a research program, and it’s faster to type than “faculty advisor”.</p>

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<p>Oh well, I stand corrected. (I was thinking why the ‘o’ had dropped, anyways).</p>

17

<p>PI=principle investigator</p>

<p>There are not many post-bac research program (make sure you go the research post-bac route not the class post-bac route). UPenn and Baylor also had one several years ago (minority focused?). A tech position at a University is also a great route to go. You do have to be careful about tech positions, since a large number of them will only have you filling pipette boxes. You need one that will allow you to conduct research and accepts that you are planning to go to grad school in a few years. </p>

<p>The benefit of choosing a post bac fellowship over a tech position is that PIs expect their fellows to apply to grad school. Some will even start training you to be an independent scientist/ start your grad training early. PIs are very flexible about taking time off for interviews. I know some people that had problems taking time off for interviews when they were techs. PIs often dont want to loose their techs. I have heard stories of PIs sabatoging their techs ability to get into grad school since they did not want them to leave, but this is probably rare. The con with going the NIH route specifically is that the research environment is very different from academia and most of the NIH PIs have never worked with grad students, undergrads, etc (PI expectations are greater). The pay is also greater for tech positions, as post-bacs typically make grad student stipends.</p>

<p>With both a post bac in a tech position, you may have the opportunity to take classes for free. If you get a project, you will have the opportunity to publish from either route.</p>

<p>One thing you should be aware of is that people strongly discourage you from staying in the tech lab (or post bac lab) as a grad student. Hence you may not want to use this method to get into a particular lab as a grad student. People do this though. Some PIs may be opposed to this, so you will need to check when you interview. On the otherhand, you could work in the Pit lab. A letter from this PI would then probably help get you into a related lab at Austin for grad studies as an example. </p>

<p>Regardless of what path you go, you need to find a lab that will train you to be a scientist (not just a tech). Some of the NIH labs are even bad for this, so you need to do your research. People that applied for tech positions may be better for answering this, but you may want to be upfront about your intent to apply to grad school if you go the tech route.</p>

<p>Good luck</p>

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<p>You seem to be leaning away from doing a masters, so I’ll make your decision a little harder by telling you my situation:</p>

<p>I graduated two years ago with a higher GPA than yours (2.9ish, though with no excuse, upward trend, or double major). After a break I started in a lab with a fairly new PI and nine months or so later I applied for a PhD program at the school for which I was working. I had a good GRE score and my PI pushed hard for me be accepted so I could stay there and continue my work.</p>

<p>I ended up rejected (three times) and was told, through my PI, that with my GPA I simply would not be accepted. No matter how much experience I get, how many posters I present, or how many first author publications I have. However, if I do a masters at any school (they recommended a nearby CSU) and have at least a 3.0 I’d get in.</p>

<p>Now, my situation might be different than yours. My work in this lab was the first research experience I had and other than 5th author paper in submission I had nothing solid to show for it, so you are more experienced now than when I applied. You could also question the truthfulness of what my PI was told and whether this school was abnormal in their view. However, it’s something to think about since some on this board are of the opinion that masters are just fluff and valued far less than research experience.</p>

19

<p>Wait.</p>

<p>Are you telling me you guys haven’t been talking about propidium iodide this whole time?!</p>