What EFC number is generated in the two vs one in college scenarios? Is it really going to matter? In our scenario ( I think our income is similar to yours) it didn’t matter. We couldn’t afford either number anyway.
If it were me, I’d start with stating one in college and change it later if the second student is accepted and planning to attend.
We did fill out special circumstances forms for a couple of schools (two different kids, two different special circumstances) that our student was accepted to and seriously considering and was just out of reach financially. Neither was a meets need school and they were coming in under our EFC because of merit scholarships already. Both times we received additional financial aid, but it wasn’t a lot. For one of them it was the difference between barely affordable and not affordable. Neither was a meets need school and they were coming in under our EFC because of scholarships already.
@twoinanddone a college like Princeton is going to meet full need…and getting work study or SEOG won’t matter. If the student misses out on that, they will get need based aid in some other form. If the sibling enrolls in college later, a school like Princeton will adjust.
If the younger sister gets money to which she is not entitled, it won’t matter what she put on the FAFSA. She will have to pay it back.
But this question was about the FAFSA, and Princeton and other schools that meet full need require additional information to be provided on the CSS or on the school’s own forms.
The student won’t have to pay it back, it will just be taken off the FA award. The family will know before Sept if the second child is going to college or taking another path and can inform the school. A school like Princeton may very well take the special circumstances into consideration and decide to leave that extra $20k as part of the package because the family is paying something for the 2nd child to be in training. It won’t be because of the FAFSA having 2 in college, but because of special circumstances. You can’t explain that on the FAFSA.
I don’t think it will matterfor FAFSA only schools except for SEOG and work study and OP’s daughter has a lot of those on her list.
I think that most of the FAFSA only schools on this student’s list are places where she hopes to garner significant merit aid to attend.
The schools on this list that meet full need will make the adjustment to two kids in college IF that happens.
WRT work study and SEOG, even with two in college, this isn’t a really low income family. Family contribution at the Profile schools will be 60% of what it would be for a single student. If his EFC with 1 is $30,000, then with two it would be $18,000 or so…still way above Pell eligibility and likely out of range for SEOG. In terms of work study, even with an EFC if $30,000, this student would have financial need, and could get work study in her award. And you know…if she doesn’t, she can always apply for a regular job like tens of thousands of other college students.
It depends upon the college. One of mine at a state school got over 40 college credits from the get go and if he had not been going for a BFA, he could have easily graduated a year early.
It’s insurance for when things go wrong, it gives option of getting out early or taking a gap term without losing time or taking a course with pre reqs. Gives flexibility.
It comes down to the department and major at times as to how AP courses count at some colleges. And different majors can count the same AP course (or not) in different ways at the same college.
My one kid had a 5 in AP Bio. Took care of his science requirements as a Performing Arts major or Humanities or Socisl sciences major But say he wanted to be pre Med or other health science or maybe even sciences major. Then that course at his school and a number of others would not let it count as a college level bio course. It would count in general credits but first not take place of a required college general bio course. There could be exceptions but all of the schools on his list were clear about that.
The score on the test can make a difference as to how it counts too. A 5 in BC Calc is very different from a 3 in AB Calc.
It’s not always the best idea to skip a course that is a heavy duty foundation course either. It’s an individual thing that one should keep in mind
The landscape of AP credit given by colleges is changing all the time. Schools that used to give credit no longer do. Sometimes AP credits are accepted but can’t be applied towards the major. Sometimes AP credits are accepted but don’t reduce the amount of time a student must actually spend at a college due to course requirements and timing. Sometimes these credits help with general ed requirements. They seldom are used to satisfy degree requirements.
Still…I think this OPs kid should take the tests…because she has NO idea where she will be attending college and which of the above will apply at her college.
Having the AP credits might help in some way, but no guarantee they will reduce the number of terms the student needs to be enrolled where she matriculates. YMMV.
The private schools in my area require kids to take the AP exam for any AP course they take. It is in lieu of a final, and to pass the class you need to take the AP. I’m sure the D’s boarding school has a policy as to whether kids can opt out of the exams or not. Kids at local private schools for whom the test fees are a hardship take them for free (that’s what the guidance counselors are for… to make sure needy kids who are on financial aid are not billed for “extras” which they can’t pay for).
If the D’s school does not have a policy, and the tests are not a financial hardship I don’t see any downside to taking them. D gets a 3- that’s a good sign that she shouldn’t try to skip the 101 series in that discipline in college. D gets a 5- optional as to whether she advances, takes a more rigorous version of the AP class, or never looks at that subject again if the college accepts a 5 for distribution credit. No downside IMHO.
At our public school if you take the AP class you “have” to take the exam.
Yes, this is the worst case scenario that runs through my mind… Suppose our older daughter does attend college, and we get a Princeton price tag for our younger daughter that we can barely afford (say, $19K). It would be a very difficult gamble to go that route and pass up other stellar merit offers at other schools that are guaranteed regardless of what our older one does.
We won’t know the best course of action for our older daughter until about February or March, long before we have to file the FAFSA and CSS Profile. We will definitely do what is in her best interest regardless of how it affects our younger daughter.
I guess I’m trying to figure out which would be the least painful if I end up having to change the value we put for number in college :
To say 2 in college, get a lower EFC, and then later on have to tell the schools that it’s really just going to be 1 in college and have them rework the financial aid, or vice versa… Where’s that dang crystal ball when you need it?
Does EFC ever affect the amount of merit aid that a school will give? For example, if the amount of merit aid offered is less than the amount of need based aid offered, might the school not even offer the merit aid then? And this just led me to another question - do schools give you two different price tags - one with only need based aid applied and another with only merit aid applied? Seems like these two amounts can be vastly different.
But lots of good points to consider from everyone - thanks!
In this case, you may have to ask the colleges to re-evaluate FA with the changed information in March if the actual scenario is different from that which you guess now. And then hope that they will issue a re-evaluated FA offer before May 1.
Princeton doesn’t give merit aid so that’s not an issue.
I’d say most schools give merit aid and then look at how much need is still outstanding and decide from there if they will meet that need and how.
CSS profile schools will most likely include home equity as well in the calculation. They won’t base the aid on FAFSA EFC alone.
I thought the whole reason for applying for merit was the fact that with your income it will be difficult to get enough need based aid to get to the desired budget.
@KevinFromOC It might not be a good idea to wait until the last minute to file the FAFSA and the CSS Profile because some schools have a FAFSA filing “priority date” that is much earlier than June 30.
For example, ASU says “Submit your FAFSA before ASU’s priority filing date of January 15 each year to maximize the amount of aid you receive. Eligible students who apply by this date have a greater chance of receiving need-based aid.”
https://students.asu.edu/financialaid/calendar/2021
And if you are eligible for Cal Grant note that “For many state financial aid programs: [California state deadline is] March 2, 2020 (date postmarked). Cal Grant also requires submission of a school-certified GPA by March 2, 2020.”
https://studentaid.ed.gov/sa/fafsa/deadlines#2020-21-state-deadlines
This is why it is so important to look at the ability to pay for all 4 years, especially when there are these other moving parts. Its a tough pill to swallow if, IF a student successfully grabs that golden ring and gets into an elite school (one that doesn’t give merit aid) that pushes the financial envelope and/or is financially unaffordable. Parents have long been frustrated by the fact that COL isn’t considered in the EFC. Whether you live in rural Idaho or NYC, schools look at income, assets, etc.
If the student really, really wants to go to a tippy top school and might even have a chance of admission to schools with single digit admission rates (someone has got to get in, after all), if perchance they also have a strong leadership history, a strong personal success story and can demonstrate strong community service (or perhaps in this case if she has done a lot to done a lot to help the blind sister), then apply to the big outside scholarships. With the # of applications this student is doing, surely there is an essay that can be retooled with minimal effort for some of these big scholarships.
I think this is a typo…and he means long AFTER they need to file the financial aid forms…which could happen any time now.
@KevinFromOC places like Princeton will re-evaluate your aid should a second child be enrolled in college.
The schools on your younger daughter’s list that don’t meet full need for all…the ones where she will probably get sufficient merit to attend…might not care at all that a second kid is in college for financial aid purposes.
@KevinFromOC If you meant “after” instead of “before” as @thumper1 suggested, then I think that, due to your constraints, you should minimize financial risk. That means that you should assume that only your youngest daughter will attend college.
If things get clearer early next year for your oldest daughter and she decides to also attend college, then you might be able to get the schools to update their price, but as @jym626 pointed out, you need to be sure that she will remain in college for four years. I am not sure that you can make that assumption.
And while these costs are comparatively minimal in the big scheme of things, engineering majors will have additional lab fees added to their COA.
Having two kids in college would make a drastic difference in the financial aid OP’s younger daughter would be offered at schools that do guarantee to meet full need. It’s possible that the additional aid makes schools like Princeton affordable. But the other child has disabilities that make it risky as to whether she would be able to go or stay in school
Assuming that College payment for that older child is somehow covered, of course. Institutional EFC tends to be 60% of a single child’s EFC when there are two kids in college. But that is an increase in what the total college payment will be.
Wise to check out different options because no telling what the situation will be in spring
What are the facts that you know, not hypotheticals? You have 1 Dd who is in college application mode. She has the stats for automatic merit scholarships. You cannot afford your EFC if her sister does not attend college at a cost to you that reduces your EFC.
It seems pretty clear that you don’t need a crystal ball. Your Dd needs to proceed as if she will be the only student in college. With the schools your Dd is applying to for merit, no, number of students enrolled will not make a difference. They aren’t offering a combo of need-based aid and merit. They are offering merit.
The other schools you are discussing offer need-based aid and not merit. Those schools will adjust her financial aid package if there is a significant change in financial status. The best course of action is to state what is accurate right now while filling out the forms–1 enrolling in college. If your older Dd decides she is going to attend, is accepted, and registers, then you can contact FA depts at meets-need schools and ask how to change the information.
I think the other thing concerning the older daughter is since she has is a non-traditional student, her path may be nontraditional through college. She may struggle and change course, or gap semesters, may decide it’s not for her, go slower, etc. I totally agree that I don’t think it is at all safe to apply for FA as if you were going to have 2 full time college students next year.
If the EFC for one in college doesn’t work, I would not bother with that application. I know more than one person who has had to force their kid to transfer after a significant FA change after a year or 2. And it was really sad and difficult for the student. Focus on schools that will work with one in college and competitive merit options where you think your student may be a unique applicant. Now that I have a kid in college, I really see where it is really nice not to be absolutely pushed to your financial limit. There are additional expenses that will come up - travel, etc.